LNC Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Absolute and objective moral values are true whether or not I, or anyone else in the world believe them to be valid. Here are a few examples, and you tell me if you find any exceptions to these standards: 1) Don't murder; 2) Don't rape; 3) Don't be a racist. If you can tell me of any situation where those actions, in and of themselves, would be OK morally to commit, I would like to hear about those situations. Oh this is just stupid. Where are the exceptions to all of these three you ask? Here's your answer THE OLD TESTAMENT. Accept it. Sorry, I can't accept it based just upon your assertion. Just because the OT cites these incidents does not mean that it is condoned. If you believe different, please cite examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agnosticator Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 How is a "code of conduct" displayed by animals different than calling it "morality"? Animals aren't as developed and complex as humans, but I don't see it as being totally not about morality. Consider one example: The gorilla at Brookfield Zoo a few years back gently picked up a human child that fell in her enclosure. While her own baby was on her back, she proceeded to the gate of the enclosure while growling at other gorillas to keep away. She then handed the child to a keeper. I don't see the difference. Well, first, we don't know that animals have a "code of conduct" unless you can communicate with them to find this out. Yes, I do remember that story as I live in the Chicagoland area, however, we do not know what the intentions of that gorilla were, only the actions. That is why we can't say that animals are moral, nor do we judge them as such. The chimp that tore the face off the woman recently, if he would have lived, would not have been put on trial for attempted murder. HanSolo answered my question, and clarified what he meant. I agree with him that animals have been proven to display a "code of conduct", which refers to actions, not moral discussion. If the chimp lived, he would have been put to death anyway. But he would have gotten off at trial by pleading temporary insanity (psychosis)while under the influence of a drugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Absolute and objective moral values are true whether or not I, or anyone else in the world believe them to be valid. Here are a few examples, and you tell me if you find any exceptions to these standards: 1) Don't murder; 2) Don't rape; 3) Don't be a racist. If you can tell me of any situation where those actions, in and of themselves, would be OK morally to commit, I would like to hear about those situations. Oh this is just stupid. Where are the exceptions to all of these three you ask? Here's your answer THE OLD TESTAMENT. Accept it. Sorry, I can't accept it based just upon your assertion. Just because the OT cites these incidents does not mean that it is condoned. If you believe different, please cite examples. You are a bloody moron!!! Why don't you read your damn Bible through another time since the previous times evidently didn't sink in. But i guess your next read won't be any different. The truth of the matter means nothing to you. You only interpret it as you see fit. I am through wasting my time with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted March 6, 2009 Super Moderator Share Posted March 6, 2009 I can't believe anyone has talked to him this long. Just reading his "thoughts" and cut-and-paste postings made my tits bleed. Congratulations on your stamina and masochistic tendencies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agnosticator Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I can't believe anyone has talked to him this long. Just reading his "thoughts" and cut-and-paste postings made my tits bleed. Congratulations on your stamina and masochistic tendencies. The masochistic tendencies are artifacts of christian belief. Can we see pictures of your bleeding tits as proof? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted March 6, 2009 Super Moderator Share Posted March 6, 2009 You wish! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlerman Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Absolute and objective moral values are true whether or not I, or anyone else in the world believe them to be valid. Here are a few examples, and you tell me if you find any exceptions to these standards: 1) Don't murder; 2) Don't rape; 3) Don't be a racist. If you can tell me of any situation where those actions, in and of themselves, would be OK morally to commit, I would like to hear about those situations. Oh this is just stupid. Where are the exceptions to all of these three you ask? Here's your answer THE OLD TESTAMENT. Accept it. Sorry, I can't accept it based just upon your assertion. Just because the OT cites these incidents does not mean that it is condoned. If you believe different, please cite examples. Surely you jest. God ordered these things. Do you really need me to cite the versus? You're supposed to be the Bible expert here telling all of us the truth. You need me to reference these overt statements of the Almighty ordering the imprisonment and rape of little girls whose whole family had just been killed under orders from God; the orders of wholesale genocide against ethnic peoples; the chopping off of women's hands for striking the gentiles of a man while defending their husband being attacked; wild bears being sent by God to maul and kill children; etc. You really need me to inform you what is in the Bible? Then how in the name of God, can you claim to be an apologist? You have to first know what's in the Bible, then be able to "be ready give an answer to those who ask for the hope that is in you." You see, my answer for what "optimism" about what you seem to posses is simple: Ignorance. You believe because you are unaware. I'm sorry, but I too aware to be happy in ignorance any more. If you can come up to this level and make it work, to find faith in the light of full awareness, then we can talk. For now, you're more sounding like a child on Christmas morning excited about Santa. "What verses?", you ask. P.S. Ironically, you are right, but not how you would mean it. You're right in saying God did not order these things. The men who wrote those books claim he did. Those books you claim are authoritative. Sounds to me like you need to do some study. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 This whole thread is just stupid. Close it. But before you do please turn in your hymnals to page 213... Jesus loves me this I know For the bible tells me so Little ones to him belong They are weak but he is strong Yes, jesus loves me Yes, jesus loves me Yes, jesus loves me The bible tells me so mwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted March 6, 2009 Author Share Posted March 6, 2009 The Flood is over... and so is this thread. Closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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