Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 After another spiritual discussion, my wife agreed to swap book and read a chapter a week and discuss it. My wife is a fundy and wants me to read her choices of books of the bible. I get to choose any book and she will read a chapter and discuss it. I need suggestions of books that will start her on her way to question her fundamentalism. Something not too extreme, but something that questions biblical accuracy etc. Any other suggestions are welcome. I look forward to this challenge and hope this can start her to question her literalism and absolutism. Thanks in advance for any help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenhunter Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 hmm, you provide an interesting ordeal, well, lets do new testament: James chapter 2, mainly the works and faith, it's a start but instead of going extreme with Genesis chapter 22, (that one made completely question this "god" character) this may be a start, the biggest downfall of the christian faith is to not question "the will of god" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loren Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 You might try one of Bishop Spong's books. He's a Christian, but he will not allow his readers to not think about the Bible cogently and honestly. He's very scholarly in his breakdowns, but very readable to the laity. A couple of his titles are: Why Christianity Must Change Or Die and Rescuing The Bible From Fundamentalism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Marty Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 You might try one of Bishop Spong's books. He's a Christian, but he will not allow his readers to not think about the Bible cogently and honestly. He's very scholarly in his breakdowns, but very readable to the laity. A couple of his titles are: Why Christianity Must Change Or Die and Rescuing The Bible From Fundamentalism Misquoting jesus or jesus interupted both by bart erhman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddbird1963 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 How about Dan barker's "Godless." It describes his journey into atheism from fundamentalism. By reading an autobiography, it may be less threatening, but actually catch her more open to his ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKR Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 After another spiritual discussion, my wife agreed to swap book and read a chapter a week and discuss it. My wife is a fundy and wants me to read her choices of books of the bible. I get to choose any book and she will read a chapter and discuss it. I need suggestions of books that will start her on her way to question her fundamentalism. Something not too extreme, but something that questions biblical accuracy etc. Any other suggestions are welcome. I look forward to this challenge and hope this can start her to question her literalism and absolutism. Thanks in advance for any help. I second Misquoting Jesus . This will destroy the validity of the Bible for anyone who is willing to examine things honestly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 Great suggestions!! I like the Misquoting Jesus idea. The others are great also. Keep them coming...please. Do you think that some of Karen Armstrongs book might be too premature, as they go into things at a depth that may be overwhelming at first. I have read a few reviews of her books and really liked them. Anybody more familiar with her stuff? Thanks again.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted July 27, 2009 Super Moderator Share Posted July 27, 2009 I need suggestions of books that will start her on her way to question her fundamentalism. The Bible is the book that made me an ExC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator buffettphan Posted July 27, 2009 Super Moderator Share Posted July 27, 2009 The Bible is the book that made me an ExC. Me too! Jephthah's daughter, Abraham/Isaac, Noah, Job, Lot, bashing babies against rocks, stoning disobedient kids, etc. not to mention god's own demented plan of murdering his own son. Have you seen this post on the main blog? It should be required reading of anyone who believes the xtian god is anything other than pure evil. http://exchristian.net/exchristian/2009/07/story-of-joe-b.html Print it, have her read it. Then ask her if she treated your kids this way, would she, should she, deserve any love or respect. Happy reading..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Marty Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Great suggestions!! I like the Misquoting Jesus idea. The others are great also. Keep them coming...please. Do you think that some of Karen Armstrongs book might be too premature, as they go into things at a depth that may be overwhelming at first. I have read a few reviews of her books and really liked them. Anybody more familiar with her stuff? Thanks again.. I really liked Karen's book, A History of god, but I found it a bit dry, and was of interest to me only after I shed the god complex. I think it may be too much for where she is at right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocksandstuff Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 centauro: I gave my wife a copy of Karen Armstrong's "The Bible: a Biography", which I thought would be educational and non-threatening, but she just found it boring. I found it fascinating though, so go figure... I think it would be a great choice if she finds it interesting. I like "Jesus Interupted" by Ehrman too. It seems a bit more comprehensive that Misquoting Jesus, as it summarizing a lot of his other writings. I think he goes to some more length in it too to explain that he doesn't mean to be threatening to faith (thought it clearly challenges unquestioned biblical inerrant faith). Would be very interested to hear how things go. Have fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raul Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 "Letter to a christian nation" by Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 centauro: I gave my wife a copy of Karen Armstrong's "The Bible: a Biography", which I thought would be educational and non-threatening, but she just found it boring. I found it fascinating though, so go figure... I think it would be a great choice if she finds it interesting. I like "Jesus Interupted" by Ehrman too. It seems a bit more comprehensive that Misquoting Jesus, as it summarizing a lot of his other writings. I think he goes to some more length in it too to explain that he doesn't mean to be threatening to faith (thought it clearly challenges unquestioned biblical inerrant faith). Would be very interested to hear how things go. Have fun! I thought about that book, but my feeling is to go slowly. I am quite excited about this as I have been dealing with her rabid fundamentalism for the last 18 years. She has refused to look at anything outside of her usual apologists and last night I told her that her view of the bible is narrow and that she has never read anything contrary to what she wants to hear. Then she suggested I pick a book that she can read and I have to read the bible. No problem!!! She is a very literal person, not analytical, so I need something that is an easy read, to the point and non threatening. So far Ehrman fits the bill, with Misquoting Jesus. Jesus Interrupted may be something to consider in the future. I will post the progress of the discussions and I will welcome suggestions on how to deal with parts of the bible I am having trouble with. Thanks to all. I will keep you posted. Centauro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 "Letter to a christian nation" by Sam Harris Good suggestion, but I don't feel she is ready for that yet. Anything that smacks of atheism she will automatically disregard. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raul Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Good suggestion, but I don't feel she is ready for that yet. Anything that smacks of atheism she will automatically disregard. IMHO Well,if she'll automatically disregard anything that's contrary to her views what's the point anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Davka Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I will post the progress of the discussions and I will welcome suggestions on how to deal with parts of the bible I am having trouble with. Thanks to all. I will keep you posted. Centauro This is interesting, Centauro. I'm interested to hear where this journey leads you and your wife. Phanta I second Phanta's post. I'm betting she has her fundy magical thinking in high gear, because everybody knows that the Word'O'GodTM is sharper than any two-edged sword and will open your eyes to the Patented Truth of Christness. I'm thinking that discussions of what you are both reading will need a real go-slow approach, because she might get seriously pissed and/or freaked when you don't magically respond to the Bible. Especially since I can guarantee you she'll have an army of fanatics praying for your conversion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShallowByThyGame Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I am currently reading 'Good Book: The Bizarre, Hilarious, Disturbing, Marvelous, and Inspiring Things I Learned When I Read Every Single Word of the Bible' By David Plotz It is very enjoyable, and might be neat to read that along side the bible, or just read the whole thing. It only covers the old testament however. Even though the author is a lapsed Jew and not an atheist, he readily calls out all the horrible and hypocritical actions of God, and how most biblical 'heros' were deceptive and brutal Anyway, it's helping me see the 'glorious' stories from my childhood in a fresh and neutral light. I recommend it to all recovering Christians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snafutopia Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 I think it's commendable of your wife to offer to read ANYTHING that might cause her to question her faith. This is not an easy thing to do, and is very brave of her. I have hopes for my dear husband. He made the remark not too long ago that Christians ought to "try to prove their religion is false." And that just astonished me, for him to say that. So, good naturedly, I agreed with him and said, "In that case, I have some books you might enjoy reading." He's not ready any of them yet but at least he's seemed open to the idea and hasn't refused outright. There's so much emotion tied in with this whole thing. I really do think your wife is brave, and to me her willingness to read things that are important to you, shows that she does love and care about you and wants to keep connected with you in this area. Wishing you both all the best, and I hope your journey together is a happy one, even if you're unable to come to total agreement with each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 Good suggestion, but I don't feel she is ready for that yet. Anything that smacks of atheism she will automatically disregard. IMHO Well,if she'll automatically disregard anything that's contrary to her views what's the point anyway? She would be less inclined to read someone like Harris, an avowed atheist IMHO. Ehrman went to Moody Bible College, and then Wheaton College, two very highly regarded (by fundies) theological colleges. From what I have read, Ehrman's point of the book is to gently show readers how much we assume about the bible that just ain't so. I think she would be more receptive to that as opposed to an all out frontal attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 I will post the progress of the discussions and I will welcome suggestions on how to deal with parts of the bible I am having trouble with. Thanks to all. I will keep you posted. Centauro This is interesting, Centauro. I'm interested to hear where this journey leads you and your wife. Phanta I second Phanta's post. I'm betting she has her fundy magical thinking in high gear, because everybody knows that the Word'O'GodTM is sharper than any two-edged sword and will open your eyes to the Patented Truth of Christness. I'm thinking that discussions of what you are both reading will need a real go-slow approach, because she might get seriously pissed and/or freaked when you don't magically respond to the Bible. Especially since I can guarantee you she'll have an army of fanatics praying for your conversion. I have no doubt she thinks her spiritual power will prevail, and I will be a new convert But, like many here on this board, once the door was opened to information, it was hard to close it. My goal is not to make her an unbeliever, but to help her see my point of view, and respect it. It will be a tough sell. Even last night when we talked about literalism, I pointed out a verse in Mark about snake handling and drinking poison. It stated if one is saved snakes and poison would not harm you. She said it was true and if the holy spirit moved her, she would do it That is what I am up against. She is that into it. She also stated she has no intentions of doing it, but if she was filled with the holy spirit she would have no fear, as she has salvation. She believes that once I start reading scripture, I will submit to it's teachings. She is in for a surprise. I don't think this will shake her faith. Her emotional and security needs are too great to give her literalism up. But last night she actually talked about some issues that before she would have walked away in a huff. I will keep all posted and hopefully do a running account of how things are going and what we have read/discussed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 27, 2009 Author Share Posted July 27, 2009 I think it's commendable of your wife to offer to read ANYTHING that might cause her to question her faith. This is not an easy thing to do, and is very brave of her. I have hopes for my dear husband. He made the remark not too long ago that Christians ought to "try to prove their religion is false." And that just astonished me, for him to say that. So, good naturedly, I agreed with him and said, "In that case, I have some books you might enjoy reading." He's not ready any of them yet but at least he's seemed open to the idea and hasn't refused outright. There's so much emotion tied in with this whole thing. I really do think your wife is brave, and to me her willingness to read things that are important to you, shows that she does love and care about you and wants to keep connected with you in this area. Wishing you both all the best, and I hope your journey together is a happy one, even if you're unable to come to total agreement with each other. Well, it is commendable, but it has taken 18 years!! Brave? Maybe. She also might be overconfident...we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centauro Posted July 28, 2009 Author Share Posted July 28, 2009 I have ordered Ehrman's Misquoting Jesus for her first read. I will let you know what happens. I plan on doing some bible reading with her in the next few days and will post results. Not sure what book we will start, but I will let her pick the one and go from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Davka Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 My goal is not to make her an unbeliever, but to help her see my point of view, and respect it. It will be a tough sell. Even last night when we talked about literalism, I pointed out a verse in Mark about snake handling and drinking poison. It stated if one is saved snakes and poison would not harm you. She said it was true and if the holy spirit moved her, she would do it That is what I am up against. She is that into it. She also stated she has no intentions of doing it, but if she was filled with the holy spirit she would have no fear, as she has salvation. Holy Boogers! That verse happens to be one that was added later - any reliable translation will have a footnote that says "not found in earliest manuscripts." She's not a King James Only believer, is she? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Praxis_Of_Evil Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 I highly recommend Mathew Alper's The God Part of the Brain. It examines religion and spirituality from a strictly neuroscientific view, or as the author like's to call it, "biotheology." It answered many of the questions I had upon my deconversion. Even if you can't get her to read it, try it for yourself, it is very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redbeard Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Good call on Misquoting Jesus. I'm reading that right now and think it would be perfect for your situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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