Mudflappus Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 I was once in an argument with a relatively new Fundie about the whole "submit to god" thing when I realized how it really works. You don't submit to god, you're supposed submit to whichever Christian is challenging your position. If you don't instantly change your mind to match their point of view and allow them to roll over your opinion with complete impunity, you are not submitting to god. Apparently each Christian - being the appointed mouthpiece of the almighty gets to pick and choose who is submitting to god and who isn't vicariously through themselves. I was truly dumbfounded by the vigor that this Fundie was insisting that this wasn't the case and yet it was as obvious as a Colosseum full of brain dead Promise Keepers that each Christian zealot claims the right to determine if you are indeed worthy based on how you kiss their ass. I truly believe that this was the exact point that I completely shed the mantle of Christian myself and decided henceforth that I wanted nothing more to do with any of them. Especially the brainwashed, macho, sports fanatic types who would rather slap each other on the back while throwing a football back and forth behind their church than engage in any real service to the community. The same guys that will give you god's opinion verbatim on every subject you bring up. Seems to me that they want to be god a little too much. Wow, from filthy rags to god in one easy step. All you have to do is cow some poor bastard into submitting to your will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurisaz Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 Seems to me that they want to be god a little too much. "Herrenrasse" anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraphicsGuy Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 Hmmm...that is actually a pretty brilliant observation. Good one to use on the fundies around here...and woe to the poor bastard who ever tries to preach to me. I've been saving up for while... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudflappus Posted September 20, 2009 Author Share Posted September 20, 2009 Seems to me that they want to be god a little too much. "Herrenrasse" anyone? "Herrenrasse" indeed! Although it wasn't the main focus of my post, it does raise an interesting point about the Christian perception of themselves. Especially when they make the declarative statement that anyone not sharing their exact philosophy is going to Hell. As I have stated before in a different forum, it seems really convenient that god's will and opinions so closely mimic their own in all things from the Stock Market to Socialism. When they are so easily and willfully offended, it becomes crystal clear that they themselves would truly relish the ability to send souls to the Skillet of Hades if only for their own selfish amusement. The ultimate cosmic "I told you so" if you will. Man, the more I ponder this the more I'm completely flabbergasted that I ever tried to fit in with these yahoos. I can't even take the moderates seriously any more because I know that while they're paying lip service to me about how even keeled they are, they are making decisions about politics and law based not on wisdom but through the blind eye of their faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 Seems to me that they want to be god a little too much. "Herrenrasse" anyone? "Herrenrasse" indeed! Although it wasn't the main focus of my post, it does raise an interesting point about the Christian perception of themselves. Especially when they make the declarative statement that anyone not sharing their exact philosophy is going to Hell. As I have stated before in a different forum, it seems really convenient that god's will and opinions so closely mimic their own in all things from the Stock Market to Socialism. When they are so easily and willfully offended, it becomes crystal clear that they themselves would truly relish the ability to send souls to the Skillet of Hades if only for their own selfish amusement. The ultimate cosmic "I told you so" if you will. Man, the more I ponder this the more I'm completely flabbergasted that I ever tried to fit in with these yahoos. I can't even take the moderates seriously any more because I know that while they're paying lip service to me about how even keeled they are, they are making decisions about politics and law based not on wisdom but through the blind eye of their faith. I wish I had saved the study, it's lost now, but I remember a few years ago a brain mapping study was released that showed that the area of the brain that identifies with "the self" is the exact same region that activates when you are asked "what god wants". IOW, the study confirmed that god is really all in your head, and explains why everyones god mysteriously believes everything that person does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shyone Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 This thread is sheer brilliance. It is the confirmation of and reason behind the comment, "You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 I was once in an argument with a relatively new Fundie about the whole "submit to god" thing when I realized how it really works. You don't submit to god, you're supposed submit to whichever Christian is challenging your position. If you don't instantly change your mind to match their point of view and allow them to roll over your opinion with complete impunity, you are not submitting to god. So very true! It rings very true to my memories. If I would argue with another Christian, I would be more likely to agree, compared to when I argued with an unbeliever, which always meant I tried to find ways to disagree. Apparently each Christian - being the appointed mouthpiece of the almighty gets to pick and choose who is submitting to god and who isn't vicariously through themselves. I was truly dumbfounded by the vigor that this Fundie was insisting that this wasn't the case and yet it was as obvious as a Colosseum full of brain dead Promise Keepers that each Christian zealot claims the right to determine if you are indeed worthy based on how you kiss their ass. I used to belong to a church where submission to the leadership's interpretations of the Bible was a virtue. It's brainwashing. And the church constantly got "attacked by Satan" through infiltration of con artists who used the gullibility of the Christians to follow the orders of the leadership. Shut up and obey, is equated with "belief." And btw, welcome Mudflappus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 I read something recently where the author conjectured that through the evolution of the human brain, we developed the unfortunate tendency to identify with and favor our own group while perceiving outsiders as negative and as a threat. When the brain produced pleasurable affects in response to "my team is #1," and for "we're better than those scum suckers (who clearly deserve to roast around the campfire)," it supported group cohesion and therefore survival. The warm glow of self-righteousness may have helped us pass on our genes back in the cave era, but it looks like it could end up killing us off in the end. That's correct. You would read about it in Psychology and Sociology, if you would study those subjects. It's called group-think, and the in-group and out-group thinking. We exaggerate the positive sides of our in-group, while downplaying the good sides and up-playing the bad sides of the out-group. This is (to some degree) what underlies prejudice and racism as well (besides social learning, etc). I usually say that there are many explanations to why we behave certain ways, but they're explanations, not excuses. We can learn to overcome some tendencies, or at least make rational decisions, when we understand how these things work. (I could write forever about this topic. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chefranden Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 This thread is sheer brilliance. It is the confirmation of and reason behind the comment, "You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do." I read something recently where the author conjectured that through the evolution of the human brain, we developed the unfortunate tendency to identify with and favor our own group while perceiving outsiders as negative and as a threat. When the brain produced pleasurable affects in response to "my team is #1," and for "we're better than those scum suckers (who clearly deserve to roast around the campfire)," it supported group cohesion and therefore survival. The warm glow of self-righteousness may have helped us pass on our genes back in the cave era, but it looks like it could end up killing us off in the end. (Where did I read this?--was it in "God is not Great"? I can't place it.) I wouldn't want something that helped insure my ancestors' survival to be "unfortunate". It is a bit of a boon considering the size of our population that we can transfer some of this motivation to a sports team or a church rather than invading the next neighborhood to steal their women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brought None Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 Yep. I observed this in the sermons with how the preachers are basically telling the audience what they as followers really need to be doing with their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lighteclectic Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 I was once in an argument with a relatively new Fundie about the whole "submit to god" thing when I realized how it really works. You don't submit to god, you're supposed submit to whichever Christian is challenging your position. If you don't instantly change your mind to match their point of view and allow them to roll over your opinion with complete impunity, you are not submitting to god. So very true! It rings very true to my memories. If I would argue with another Christian, I would be more likely to agree, compared to when I argued with an unbeliever, which always meant I tried to find ways to disagree. Apparently each Christian - being the appointed mouthpiece of the almighty gets to pick and choose who is submitting to god and who isn't vicariously through themselves. I was truly dumbfounded by the vigor that this Fundie was insisting that this wasn't the case and yet it was as obvious as a Colosseum full of brain dead Promise Keepers that each Christian zealot claims the right to determine if you are indeed worthy based on how you kiss their ass. I used to belong to a church where submission to the leadership's interpretations of the Bible was a virtue. It's brainwashing. And the church constantly got "attacked by Satan" through infiltration of con artists who used the gullibility of the Christians to follow the orders of the leadership. Shut up and obey, is equated with "belief." And btw, welcome Mudflappus. Han, it sounds like you and I went to the same church! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lighteclectic Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 This thread is sheer brilliance. It is the confirmation of and reason behind the comment, "You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do." I second that -- simple and right on target. Bravo! Thank you for the quote -- I've added it to my FB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lighteclectic Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Seems to me that they want to be god a little too much. "Herrenrasse" anyone? "Herrenrasse" indeed! Although it wasn't the main focus of my post, it does raise an interesting point about the Christian perception of themselves. Especially when they make the declarative statement that anyone not sharing their exact philosophy is going to Hell. As I have stated before in a different forum, it seems really convenient that god's will and opinions so closely mimic their own in all things from the Stock Market to Socialism. When they are so easily and willfully offended, it becomes crystal clear that they themselves would truly relish the ability to send souls to the Skillet of Hades if only for their own selfish amusement. The ultimate cosmic "I told you so" if you will. Man, the more I ponder this the more I'm completely flabbergasted that I ever tried to fit in with these yahoos. I can't even take the moderates seriously any more because I know that while they're paying lip service to me about how even keeled they are, they are making decisions about politics and law based not on wisdom but through the blind eye of their faith. Man, you just summed it up for me. I have to bite my tongue a dozen times a day because of something a fundie or moderate says. Living in a rural southern town, with my fundie family no less, is my own personal Hades skillet. That must be why I'm always smelling of bacon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest I Love Dog Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Seems to me that they want to be god a little too much. "Herrenrasse" anyone? "Herrenrasse" indeed! Although it wasn't the main focus of my post, it does raise an interesting point about the Christian perception of themselves. Especially when they make the declarative statement that anyone not sharing their exact philosophy is going to Hell. As I have stated before in a different forum, it seems really convenient that god's will and opinions so closely mimic their own in all things from the Stock Market to Socialism. When they are so easily and willfully offended, it becomes crystal clear that they themselves would truly relish the ability to send souls to the Skillet of Hades if only for their own selfish amusement. The ultimate cosmic "I told you so" if you will. Man, the more I ponder this the more I'm completely flabbergasted that I ever tried to fit in with these yahoos. I can't even take the moderates seriously any more because I know that while they're paying lip service to me about how even keeled they are, they are making decisions about politics and law based not on wisdom but through the blind eye of their faith. Man, you just summed it up for me. I have to bite my tongue a dozen times a day because of something a fundie or moderate says. Living in a rural southern town, with my fundie family no less, is my own personal Hades skillet. That must be why I'm always smelling of bacon. Thank dog, I've never met a fundie! The moderates are bad enough for me. This whole religion thing is based on a hierarchy, with everyone knowing their place and all being as egocentric as the others. The RCC is the best example that I know of, working from the Pope down, with all of the hangers-on. When you actually get the the deluded worshipers. they are so brainwashed into believing that what they are told is the "truth" that they just won't/can't listen to any other proposition about their religion. Why can't people see that religion is just one huge scam? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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