Can No Longer Post On This Board And Will Not Be Back

[Ameen]

The pain is too much for me.

 

I have tried several times to start a new topic, but I find myself second guessing my words every time. Will a Christian attack me again? Will I piss off the mods? I feel like a Christian again, living in fear because the way I think is not the way the power elite thinks.

 

I have a real need to discuss why I still feel violated by a Christian post about sexual identity in a non-debate thread and the way I was baited, mocked and sadistically torn apart by that Christian even after I told him to stop several times. It was like being in high school again, with the straight heterosexual alpha male everyone likes going at me yet again. And that's what's really going on here. Everyone likes this Christian, so he can do whatever he wants with no consequences.

 

So where do I go? How do I discuss my feelings? I cannot here because no one gets it.

 

At first, in a thread now closed, Loren, a mod, expressed what I was feeling. I was so relieved that someone in power got it. I went to bed thinking I had finally been heard. But then the other mods made her post the party line and I lost the only voice with power that had stood up for me. That really hurt. (Loren: How could you?) The next supportive post was lenbitme's, but that user was shouted down. The thread was then closed,

 

At this point, I have to ask myself why I am on this board. I am here because I am a gay male who was abused by Christians for being gay and needs to talk about it. Yet, as Kyle posted in the thread in which I tried to explain why the Christian in question also needs this board, "Oh, no. Not this shit again." That is how I am perceived here.

 

In post number 56 of the closed thread, HanSolo wrote: "We will not change a thing." In number 43 nivek wrote: "I see little reason to 'tune the Rules' or modify what works for the grand majority of this place because of some 'not forbidden' net furring." It sounds so much like Christianity to me. "The system works for everyone else, so something is wrong with you. You have to have more faith." That's what I get from them. In this case, though, I have to have faith in the moderators instead of Jesus.

 

I have shown all the threads in question (the one where the incident occurred, the discussion thread that was closed, and the one I started about embracing the Christian on the board) to friends in my real life, and they agree with me about how everything has gone down. They have also advised me to leave this board and look for a place where I can be who I am without fear. I could never be my real self with Christians, and it is clear now that I cannot be my real self with atheists either. If I cannot be a Christian and I cannot be an atheist, what am I? As always, I am a community of one.

 

In post number 60 in the closed thread, HanSolo wrote: "But... somehow you have to accept how the website works, accept that Christians will in the future respond to your posts, and you have to be willing to handle it. I'm sorry, but that's what it all comes down to."

 

I cannot. Do you know what pain is, HanSolo? Christians have destroyed almost everything that was dear to me, and I did not join this site to engage them in conversation. That is part of why I must leave.

 

Finally, in post number 64, HanSolo wrote: "I have even received reports from other gay members on this website who also fails to see the problem with Abi's posts."

 

That hurts even more than the attack. It makes me want to cry. To the people he is referring to: How could you? Aside from one trans-identified person on this site who sent me a supportive messages and, perhaps, two people who posted in the closed thread, I don't even have the support of my own community here. Maybe I could have worked on everything else, but if I don't have the support of my fellow gays, if they don't know their own history and thus think it is all right for mods to allow a Christian to challenge our identity, how can I possibly continue here?

 

I have to throw in the towel. This board harms me more than it helps. I am scared posting even this, but I cannot be silent about it.

 

I have turned off my private messages. Please do not attempt to contact me in any way.

[♦ nivek ♦]

Ameen,

 

Then leave us. Save the self generated drama.

 

Sorry this place isn't to your specifications.

 

kL

[Ouroboros]

I cannot. Do you know what pain is, HanSolo? Christians have destroyed almost everything that was dear to me, and I did not join this site to engage them in conversation. That is part of why I must leave.

YES! I do know very well what pain is.

 

Do you know how it feels to see all your children spread at three different hospitals at the same time? Do you know how it feels to have three of your kids with spinal injury? Do you know how it feels to see one of your sons being seconds from death, several times, and then again, and again, years apart, and then again, and... Do you know how it feels to see your wife being a second from having a punctured lung or punctured heart and almost die? Do you know how it feels to live under stress from powerful attorneys who wants to destroy your life so they can make a few bucks? Do you know how it is to live with a child who is disabled? Do you know... actually, the question is, do you want me to continue?

 

You have not fucking clue what I've gone through, or my family.

 

I can tell you this: all the psychiatrists and psychologists my family has gone through say one thing, and that is that we are a prime example of how a family should stick together and get through extreme hardships in life. Everyone of them can testify that they see families with less than a fraction of what we've gone through break apart and get completely destroyed. But not us.

 

So there you have it. Life is tough. Things are hard. It's unfair. Grow up.

[Dagan]

It's sad you choose to live in fear, and to believe you are a victim. Hope you find what you're looking for.

[sarahgrace]

Ameen, I am sorry that you can't see how many people here have tried to reach out to you and give you the support you need. It feels as if whenever we tried to lend you an ear and throw you a rope, we were rebuffed and told we weren't hearing you simply because we didn't say what you wanted us to say. You can't assume that all ex-christians in the queer community experience and observe things the way you do. Just because some of us saw something differently doesn't mean that we don't support you. You can't accuse us of not knowing our history and essentially call us traitors because we don't interpret things exactly the same way.

 

I have really appreciated all that you have contributed to this community, but I am shocked and appalled that you would even contemplate asking a question like "Do you know what pain is" on this site. You've been here long enough to know that most if not ALL of us know what pain is. How dare you assume that just because we do not agree on some things, that we are unfeeling or insensitive to your history. By posing this question you undermine the painful experiences of this community (which, had you bothered to look, you would know that HanSolo has in spades) and make yourself out to be some kind of martyr.

 

Martyrdom is for religious nutcases and drama queens, Ameen. You are neither of these things, but your blaze of glory departure is going to leave us remembering you in a way that the rest of your time here does not align with.

[Vixentrox]

I hope you find the strength to not be a victim any more. You're preaching to the choir so to speak when it comes to pain with Christians. You seem to forget most of us have had it heaped on us for years. You are not the only one and you certainly are not the only GLBT person on this board that has struggled with things when it come to Christians. I wish you well in all that you do but unless you can learn to cope you may as well live under a rock because Christians, Christianity, and all that they are is everywhere.

[Guest]

One thing my therapist said to me the other day I've kept saying to myself over and over all week...

 

"There is no 'out there'; it's all 'in here' " (points to her head)

[Guest ephymeris]

Do we know pain? I have a fairly complicated past of manipulation, childhood rape and molestation so, yeah, I know pain. I also know the only person who has ever been able to end my pain is me. No amount of support from someone else could help me, I had to do it myself. The rest of the world is rough even in somewhat sheltered communities such as this. I don't know what the answer for you is, your behavior on this one issue seems incongruent with your past posts. You seemed strong and self secure. It's odd this disagreement has triggered such a strong victim response from you. I'm sorry if I didn't unconditionally jump on your side of this issue but I don't feel this is as black and white as you perceive it to be. It may help to remember that we all, Abi included, are human as well. I don't think there is anything the people on this board could do to "atone" for this to you.

[florduh]

Blatant attempts at manipulation and playing the victim card always tends to piss me off.

[Legion]

Ameen I was up late last night thinking about you, and some things occurred to me that I wanted to say. I questioned my own motives in saying these things. Am I saying them for the right reasons? I think I am. My desire for you is that you find happiness in life. And it also occurred to me that I need not single you out in what I wanted to say. I think this is fit for all of us to hear, including me.

 

I think all of us tend to be self-absorbed to some degree. This only seems natural to me. I believe if we don’t first take care of ourselves then it likely won’t be long before we are unable to care for anything or anyone else. But I also think it is a healthy thing to frequently step outside our own circle of concerns when we encounter other people and look for opportunities to support and encourage them. It is a poorly kept secret that when we do this, they in turn will be attracted to us and will be more inclined to offer encouragement and support in turn. But even if they do not reciprocate I think we should still do this because our act of encouraging others allows light to shine on our otherwise darker places.

 

One more point and I’m done. I think it is only natural to sometimes wish the world was different from what it is. I believe there is a place for saying that things ought to be this way, and events should transpire that way. And there are even times to influence things so as to make the world conform to our wishes. But I also think there is a time to stop and be still and simply accept the world for what it is. This doesn’t imply that we need to condone all things and pretend like “it’s all good”. The world can be an ugly, brutal place sometimes. However I believe it is healthy to occasionally take in the world’s beauty and ugliness alike and simply accept it.

 

That’s what I wanted to say. Leave if you wish Ameen. I hope you find happiness. I hope we all find happiness.

[qec]

Ameen, I didn't follow this stuff very well (stuff with Abi). What I can tell you is that if everything you say is true, then by leaving you are letting him win; not anyone else, just him. My advice is you say "Fuck him" and you don't let him win this little game he may or may not be playing. That's my advice to you as a person given your subjective understanding of things and I think you might find if you follow that advice, that things get brighter as time goes on. Listen man, I don't know exactly what went down, but from what I saw I just have to say I don't think you are letting the rest of the board get to you (us); I think what you are really letting get to you is him. Everyone's reactions here are understandable, and I honestly think your reaction to Abi's post is understandable too. But if you leave, you let the bastard win, so don't let him win. Stand up for yourself, stand your ground, but realize it's not about the mods or others here; it's about you and Abi alone. That's how I see it man and I think you are a good addition to this board and I would hate to see you leave because one dude did something retarded. Now if multiple people where harassing you and fucking with you, then yes I would leave too. But one Christian guy who is obviously mindfucked? It's not worth it man, you and I both know he will spend the rest of his life with the same problem he exhibited towards you and will merely exhibit that towards others-assuming what you say is dead on, because it's hard for me to sort out just what happened.

 

So in the end my advice would be to put ex-christian on the backburner for a month or so and then come back; don't leave altogether just yet. Look, I don't pretend to even come close to having an understanding of what it's like for a gay man such as yourself to have put up with the fucking bullshit you had to from Christians as you did, which understanding would do you justice. I have tried to understand and have seen some of your posts, some of which are pretty fascinating, but I can't understand what that's like very well, and how to make a difference in the lives of people such as yourself who suffer in a very real way from bigotry, if you don't stick around to share your experiences. I am not the only one who feels this way about this I think, and I am sure there are more than a few here who would like to see you stick around in the long run. I know I would man, seriously. You have good perspective on a lot of things and you make a good addition to this board even if we are mostly a bunch of recovering fucked up survivors.

 

My two cents

[par4dcourse]

How boring it would be if everyone agreed with everything you posted 100%.

Pain is part of the human experience. I was a short, pale, sick diabetic in high school.

Hate to see you go, but I followed the whole episode and dude, you overreacted.

BTW, I'm not fond of any xian on these boards.

[Loren]

Ameen, just because I understand your position and feelings, that doesn't mean that it's the only thing I understand. I understand a number of things beyond your position, as well.

 

Leave if you wish, or stay if you wish, Ameen.

 

I'm sorry if you can't get what you need here. I certainly hope you do get what you need somewhere in life.

 

Loren

[RankStranger]

I'm sorry that the Yoyo incident has come to this Ameen. But short of being 100% in agreement with your every whim, there's really no way that this site or this community can meet your 'needs' here.

 

Like Vix said earlier- Christians (and the like) are EVERYWHERE. Short of hiding under a rock, you simply CAN'T avoid them. At some point, you're going to have to man-up, develop a thicker skin, learn to hit back- however you want to put it. Otherwise you'll continue to get hurt, continue to find reasons to 'move on', and remain that 'community of one'.

 

And as others have pointed out here, lots of us "know what pain is". Not trying to minimize your own history- but we've all had our share. I'm going to wax philosophical here... take it for what it's worth: Everybody knows that Nietzche famously said something along the lines of "whatever doesn't kill me only makes me stronger". Well I personally think that's bullshit- denial at best. IMO, pain is more akin to a physical injury that heals, but it leaves scars, stiffness, and old aches & pains that can come back pretty easily with minor subsequent injury (or even cold, damp weather). Often the only way to minimize the pain from, say, an old knee injury, is to use it, flex it, keep it nimble. You'll re-live some of that old pain a little at a time this way- it sucks. But it beats the hell outta being on crutches.

 

Yoyo may be an ass, but he didn't intend to cause you the kind of pain that you felt- that all came from inside of you. And until you learn to deal with it in some manner, you'll keep re-living it (at full strength) whenever somebody (intentionally or not) pushes your buttons. Personally, I don't know of any better (more supportive, among other things) on-line venue for kicking around Christianity and related topics than this one- and you'd do well to take advantage of that by engaging these True Believers now and then. But you can't expect to be understood or accomodated 100% of the time. There's a term for that: Enabler.

 

Anyway, good luck. Live long & prosper. I hope you find a way to heal.

[Kyle]

Wooohoooooo I got singled out.

 

Buhbye....see ya.....don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

 

Seriously. I feel for you, Ameen. I don't know if you truly feel like you are such a victim or if you enjoy and thrive on the drama. Either way, this place is not for you. I haven't been around very long, but I enjoy the folks here. But I'm sure I have much thicker skin AND realize.....THAT'S IT'S JUST THE FUCKING INTERNET.

[Mike D]

if I don't have the support of my fellow gays, if they don't know their own history

So I see we've stooped to marginalizing the rest of the GLBT members here because some may thought you over-reacted just a tad? This is in very poor taste, and any GLBT person here who has had to live through the hell of being raised in a conservative/fundamentalist Christian environment (as I was) - doesn't deserve this. Especially from another gay person. Shame on you

 

I am not going to comment further on this, it's not even worth the energy i'll have to expend in keystrokes.

 

Goodbye and good riddance.

[qec]

THAT'S IT'S JUST THE FUCKING INTERNET.

 

Yeah, it's just the Internetz bro, just words on a screen! Not real people. In fact it's speculated that the people who inhabit the internet might not actually exist.

[qec]

if I don't have the support of my fellow gays, if they don't know their own history

 

I think as Mike pointed out already: this is pretty manipulative.... You are discounting your fellow GLBT's experiences just because they don't agree with your interpretation of what happened between you and abiyoyo. That's a pretty underhanded tactic man, honestly it's just downright disgusting that you would do that..

[I Broke Free]

Maybe I could have worked on everything else, but if I don't have the support of my fellow gays, if they don't know their own history and thus think it is all right for mods to allow a Christian to challenge our identity, how can I possibly continue here?

 

How can you possibly continue anywhere Ameen? Life is a challenge and you cannot escape it. I don’t expect any moderator on this forum to drop everything when I have been offended by a post and come to my rescue. Having Christians post on this forum can be irritating and offensive, but it is also a constant reminder for me why I left them in the first place.

[Legion]

I'm really real. Really.

[Ouroboros]

You post, therefore you exist.

[Legion]

You post, therefore you exist.

On some days it feels about like that Hans.

[qec]

I'm really real. Really.

 

Whoa, you mean I'm real too? Damn. We are all real, how about that?

[Legion]

I'm really real. Really.

Whoa, you mean I'm real too? Damn. We are all real, how about that?

Yeah Quid, you’re real.

 

Flesh and bone

sitting by the telephone

pick up the receiver

I’ll make you a believer

[Shyone]

I'm really real. Really.

 

Whoa, you mean I'm real too? Damn. We are all real, how about that?

Speak for yourself.

 

Some of us have doubts.