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Goodbye Jesus

Do You Discuss Your Xian Time With Xians?


Michael

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Today I received this email. We had a tiny discussion about xianity and I wrote, that I already knew xianity for nearly 20 years and that god just promised, but could not deliver. Than this reply came:

Oh how wrong you are mate, I cant believe you cud say this things even after 20 years of being a christian. But what we fail to understand is that being a Christian does not automitcally garauntee that you know God, what matters is ur relationship with him, understanding how he operate not in the physical, but in the spiritual, having faith in God and understanding his holy word, that's what makes us real followers of christ, not baptism, not how long, but how close you are to God.

 

What do you do, when people try to tell you, that you was not a TRUE xian? Do you discuss with those people? Does it make sense to talk to them? Should I list all the stuff I did during my xian time, so that I can prove my commitment during those years? My first reaction was:"You are a self righteous asshole. To talk with you is wasted time. Because no matter what I will say can change your mind about me."

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My first reaction was:"You are a self righteous asshole. To talk with you is wasted time. Because no matter what I will say can change your mind about me."

 

That sounds like an appropriate response to me.

 

Yes, I think you are wasting your time arguing about who is a true Christian and what is a relationship with God. We are discussing a relationship with an invisible man. Tell them they can have it, you prefer reality.

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Yes, I think you are wasting your time arguing about who is a true Christian and what is a relationship with God. We are discussing a relationship with an invisible man. Tell them they can have it, you prefer reality.

 

You are right. But it is humiliating to hear "Nearly 20 years of your time were just lip service". This statement is unfair, because I suddenly have to prove something, I am not trustworthy. If I remain silent, than he is right. If I scream "fucking moron", than he is right. If I offer prove he can always say: "Well you did not know god". Because this "know god" is a statement that has no meaning.

 

While I am writing about it, my picture becomes clearer...

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As I am inclined more and more to do these days, I'd simply reply, "Bite me."

 

Meaningful conversation is useless, seeing as you were never a True Christian in the first place.

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I was tempted once, with an unsuspecting workmate who seemed like an open-minded understanding type, but in the end I decided not to. I'm already enough of a shit magnet as it is, why make it worse?

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I don't bother. They will always accuse you of not being a "true christian". This is bullshit. I know I sincerely believed and followed, as you did. You will never reason with them because they are so brainwashed.

 

If you want to attempt to reason with them, I would try the Santa Claus argument. Once I believed in Santa. When I realized that Santa wasn't real, I stopped believing in him. Does the fact that I no longer believe in Santa negate the fact that I once believed in him? No, it doesn't. Same applied to Xtianity. Once I believed in Jesus/Yaweh. When I realized that Jesus/Yahweh was a lie, I stopped believing in them.

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Well I answered him and that was wrong. Would you like to read his reply?

Lol, all you,ve mentioned is not a guarantee that you know God mate, i personally see no point of the tears while praying, Jesus never asked us to cry while praying, but rather to pray from our hearts, to pray and believe in God that our prayers have been answered. A true Christian do not compare God with things of the world, does not demand God to prove himself physicality to him, testing God like satan did when he demanded Jesus to turn stones to bread, all you gotta is believe,

 

I did not answer. But my blood was boiling. I love the sensitive beginning "Lol".

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If you want to attempt to reason with them, I would try the Santa Claus argument. Once I believed in Santa. When I realized that Santa wasn't real, I stopped believing in him. Does the fact that I no longer believe in Santa negate the fact that I once believed in him? No, it doesn't. Same applied to Xtianity. Once I believed in Jesus/Yaweh. When I realized that Jesus/Yahweh was a lie, I stopped believing in them.

 

 

This sounds like a pretty good response in my opinion. In fact I would try it myself if I where in Michael's situation.

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Well I answered him and that was wrong. Would you like to read his reply?

Lol, all you,ve mentioned is not a guarantee that you know God mate, i personally see no point of the tears while praying, Jesus never asked us to cry while praying, but rather to pray from our hearts, to pray and believe in God that our prayers have been answered. A true Christian do not compare God with things of the world, does not demand God to prove himself physicality to him, testing God like satan did when he demanded Jesus to turn stones to bread, all you gotta is believe,

 

I did not answer. But my blood was boiling. I love the sensitive beginning "Lol".

 

 

Just laugh back: the guy's being a fucking douche and you don't need to hear this bullshit from people. The truth is that the very second you leave you where never a True Christian to some Xians. You know that, I know that, everyone here knows that. Hell, if the guy wasn't brainwashed half out of his fucking mind then of course you might be able to reason with him. It's precisely because he is so brainwashed that you can't reason with him. It's exactly because of this.

 

In fact if you wanted to get crafty tell him he can earn the right to tell you that you where never a True Christian: If he stops reading the Bible, stops going to Church, and then researches atheism regarding the Christian God for just three months, then he can tell you that you are not a True Christian. If he takes you up on your bet then he just might find himself thanking you once the spell breaks because he isn't reenforcing the nonsense over and over again.

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Honestly, you're never going to win this argument. I've heard it so many times, and hell, I even would have used it when I was a christian. Yes, it is annoying when they take that stance, and act like you were just "faking it" for the majority of your life, but there's really no arguing the idea because if you're right, then there is a chance they (as TRUE christians) could also lose their faith, and that idea terrifies them beyond description.

 

So, it really boils down to they are right, or they have the chance of losing everything they live for. The worst part is, if they would happen to deconvert in the future, you can't even hold it over their heads then, because by that point, they'll realize what a douche they were being!

 

A simple reply of "hey, it was nice knowing you back in the day, but apparently we have nothing further to discuss - have fun in heaven" then block, delete, and ignore their emails. For a few days you'll probably be morbidly curious about their responses, but after that you'll just forget they existed and probably enjoy the peace.

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OMG that was precious!

 

..........................

That is how I deal with it. I just agree, "Yep, I was never a true Christian. I just fooled myself with 40 some years of devotion, study, tithing, preaching, study, prayer and precious little sex. You know like you are doing."

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Honestly, my first response to the "you're not TRUE christian, you never were!" slam from christians, was "Good. Y'all suck anyway."

I'm glad I've never been baptized. I'm glad my bullshit-meter never left me in peace with that dead Jesus. They can have their creepy religion that worships a torture/execution device. They're unreasonable, dispassionate idiots who REJOICE IN BEING IDIOTS. I was told in a chat room that "Intelligence will never get you into heaven." Therefore, reasoned, intelligent arguments are of no value to these people.

I know having your sincerity questioned is downright insulting, but remember, you're talking to idiots. They just see black/white. christian/non-christian. I'm pagan, and I haven't met a "true christian" yet who didn't jump to one of two conclusions - I'm an atheist, and therefore angry at their god, or I'm a satanist, and therefore a child of the devil. I've stopped explaining anything to them. I just mutter in Latin, make weird hand motions, and walk off.

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Well I answered him and that was wrong. Would you like to read his reply?

Lol, all you,ve mentioned is not a guarantee that you know God mate, i personally see no point of the tears while praying, Jesus never asked us to cry while praying, but rather to pray from our hearts, to pray and believe in God that our prayers have been answered. A true Christian do not compare God with things of the world, does not demand God to prove himself physicality to him, testing God like satan did when he demanded Jesus to turn stones to bread, all you gotta is believe,

 

I did not answer. But my blood was boiling. I love the sensitive beginning "Lol".

 

If you really want to respond with this guy don't go on the defensive, trying to prove that you were a real bona-fide Christian like him. The fact is that by his definition you can't have been, why because you aren't one now, simple. IMHO if you want to get to him, it would be much better, to point out how you truly believed you were a true, genuine, redeemed in the blood believer, you know, like he thinks he is now. You know just continually point out how he isn't a real christian, it's quite possible it could get to him, or not, depends on how often he's doubted.

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If you want to attempt to reason with them, I would try the Santa Claus argument. Once I believed in Santa. When I realized that Santa wasn't real, I stopped believing in him.

 

In my case, I got sick of Santa handing me gift-wrapped boxes of shit, or not showing up in the first place no matter how hard I begged and cried. I was so worn out and fed up that I just said "fuck it" and conceded the battle to the atheists. I mean, I'd been secretly sneaking peeks at Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins, but my faith was rock solid. But I just got tired of the ruse. Box after box of shit.

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Here's another approach since this once saved always saved nonsense is Calvinist. Just tell your buddy that you discovered you were not one of the people chosen to be a saint. You discovered that you were made a vessel of dishonor, rather than one of honor. You have to disbelieve because that is the role God assigned to you in order that your buddy might enjoy the glory all the more. (Romans 9) Tell him that you are happy to make him happier and that he should rejoice in your disbelief for it is God's gift to him.

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Here's another approach since this once saved always saved nonsense is Calvinist. Just tell your buddy that you discovered you were not one of the people chosen to be a saint. You discovered that you were made a vessel of dishonor, rather than one of honor. You have to disbelieve because that is the role God assigned to you in order that your buddy might enjoy the glory all the more. (Romans 9) Tell him that you are happy to make him happier and that he should rejoice in your disbelief for it is God's gift to him.

 

Whoa this is evil stuff. I like it, although I think this guy is so far away in his self righteous fanatsy-land, that nothing can reach him. Is there really a denomination that believes in predestination? Is this biblical?

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Here's another approach since this once saved always saved nonsense is Calvinist. Just tell your buddy that you discovered you were not one of the people chosen to be a saint. You discovered that you were made a vessel of dishonor, rather than one of honor. You have to disbelieve because that is the role God assigned to you in order that your buddy might enjoy the glory all the more. (Romans 9) Tell him that you are happy to make him happier and that he should rejoice in your disbelief for it is God's gift to him.

 

Whoa this is evil stuff. I like it, although I think this guy is so far away in his self righteous fanatsy-land, that nothing can reach him. Is there really a denomination that believes in predestination? Is this biblical?

 

I actually used to believe in predestination. After studying out the subject myself, that was the conclusion I came to - not because some preacher told me that was the way it was, but my own studies of the bible led me to that belief. It wasn't the one I liked, but that was what I saw represented in both old and new testaments, and since god didn't change...well, that's what I found.

 

So I have used that one with christians...that i just must not have been "special enough" in god's eyes, so that's why I no longer believed...that really pisses them off for some reason!

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I actually used to believe in predestination. After studying out the subject myself, that was the conclusion I came to - not because some preacher told me that was the way it was, but my own studies of the bible led me to that belief. It wasn't the one I liked, but that was what I saw represented in both old and new testaments, and since god didn't change...well, that's what I found.

 

So I have used that one with christians...that i just must not have been "special enough" in god's eyes, so that's why I no longer believed...that really pisses them off for some reason!

 

I can not understand that xians do not care about the fact, that no one knows for sure what someone has to do to become a TRUE xian or to make it into heaven. I guess they just ignore the other churches and their approach or they just do not ask. If there is ONE holy spirit, how can there be thousand of interpretations? When I was a xian I had no concept for salvation. I just asked people to accept Jesus. I thought jesus would take care of the rest. But inside I was never sure if I would make it. I remember that someone said the holy spirit would let me "know" that I am saved. Whatever that means...

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Here's another approach since this once saved always saved nonsense is Calvinist. Just tell your buddy that you discovered you were not one of the people chosen to be a saint. You discovered that you were made a vessel of dishonor, rather than one of honor. You have to disbelieve because that is the role God assigned to you in order that your buddy might enjoy the glory all the more. (Romans 9) Tell him that you are happy to make him happier and that he should rejoice in your disbelief for it is God's gift to him.

 

Whoa this is evil stuff. I like it, although I think this guy is so far away in his self righteous fanatsy-land, that nothing can reach him. Is there really a denomination that believes in predestination? Is this biblical?

 

In the hands of a master of double speak like Calvin, anything is biblical.

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Just tell him that his declaration that you were not a Christian then, is about as valid, provable and right as you telling him that he is not a Christian now. Likewise, him saying you are wrong means as much to you as you telling him he is wrong does.

 

In other words, my response would be, "I care not what you think about me *mate*, and I expect you care not what I think of you! If you can trivialise my experiences as a Christian, then I shall trivialise yours."

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Oh how wrong you are mate, I cant believe you cud say this things even after 20 years of being a christian. But what we fail to understand is that being a Christian does not automitcally garauntee that you know God, what matters is ur relationship with him, understanding how he operate not in the physical, but in the spiritual, having faith in God and understanding his holy word, that's what makes us real followers of christ, not baptism, not how long, but how close you are to God.

 

 

 

You should tell them you were as close to God as anyone can be close to an imaginary being. If you were not a Christian, then they are not Christians.

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