How Many Of The Original Twelve Disciples Exist?

[Guest Valkyrie0010]

You can include Paul if you want?

 

And if you'all want please direct me towards sources in regards to this question?

 

*the number could be anything, was just using random numbers

[mwc]

You can include Paul if you want?

 

And if you'all want please direct me towards sources in regards to this question?

 

*the number could be anything, was just using random numbers

I was reading an article just this past week on this subject.

 

It had to do with the uses of the terms like "disciples," "apostles" and so on. The idea of "twelve disciples" or "twelve apostles" is somewhat difficult since it changes over time.

 

What you're looking for is the concept of the "twelve." They would have been disciples but all the followers, given a set of conditions, would have disciples (ie. those that left their families, property, etc.). The idea of "apostles" is for those who were given a set mission and was used while they were on that mission. So if they were dispatched to give a message in some town, they would be apostles, and upon their return they would cease being identified as such. Anyone could have that identification as long as they played that role. As I see it, in church terms, they might be compared to modern missionaries.

 

As I recall it's in G.Matthew where the idea of "twelve apostles" appears. This could be a result of G.Mark sending out the disciples two-by-two and they were referred as apostles when they returned. There could have been the idea in G.Matthew's community that there were twelve specially charged "missionary" disciples (ie. they alone were to carry a message as opposed to all other disciples or perhaps there were only twelve disciples at any given time that should be sent on missions making the assignment of a "twelve" fluid).

 

Paul seems to have a slightly different understanding of how things worked, as opposed to the gospel writers, but his is more in-line with the way the words actually worked. He understands that "apostles" are a special "class" in the church and he mentions a number of apostles that aren't listed among the "twelve." He mentions the "twelve" as an entity unto itself but never mentions anyone within the twelve itself and he mentions various disciples too. He states that he is also an apostle and it appears that comes from his "missionary" work with the gentiles. He's actively carrying a message unlike a regular disciple who is simply a member of the church (as mentioned above and not someone who has simply accepted the teachings of the church who would not be a disciple).

 

I tried to find the article that mentions some of this but the server isn't responding. If it starts working soon I'll edit my post to include it.

 

mwc

[Dagan]

12 disciples/apostles, 12 tribes of Israel ... In Matthew, and likely in the Jerusalem church, it was all meant to connect the old testament to the new.

 

Their names -- the ones that are actually named -- are so common that who knows if they existed or not.

[Mriana]

None. Not as actual human beings at least. As mwc pointed out, we are looking at the number 12, which is found as the 12 tribes and even in Egyptian mythology- 3, 6, 12, 24, 30. 12 main rivers of energy, and Khat is the physical body, with 12 main inner organs. 12 is a common number in mythology.

[qadeshet]

None. Not as actual human beings at least. As mwc pointed out, we are looking at the number 12, which is found as the 12 tribes and even in Egyptian mythology- 3, 6, 12, 24, 30. 12 main rivers of energy, and Khat is the physical body, with 12 main inner organs. 12 is a common number in mythology.

 

In this case, associated with the 12 signs of the Zodiac. Jesus is a typical dying and resurrecting Sun god. The synoptic Gospels describe the Sun's journey from "birth" at the winter solstice. The Sun is said to walk on water, calm storms, and turn water into wine.