No Longer A Believer

[Hydroman74]

I am a 36 year old married man with 4 kids. I was raised in what I call a "strong christian family" home. I accepted Jesus at about 10 years old and truly wanted to live for him. I didn't listen to any music except christian music. I didn't smoke, drink, go to parties, didn't masturbate, etc. I went to church events, even events at other churches that weren't my own. I was the guy in high school that you would see carrying a bible to class. I loved God and what he did for me. I always thought about him. At the ages of 19-22, I lived in a country other than my own working as a volunteer in a christian missionary organization that worked with drug addicts. I was invited by one of the head missionaries of the organization to come with him and his family. I must say, it was a great experience.

 

Now, when I returned home from the mission work, I chose not to go back. I decided to go to school and get an education. During this time, my brother had a brain aneurysm. What happened during his 6 days in the hospital was the catalyst to get me to examine what I believe and why. While he was in the hospital, there were people who would come and visit and give us messages that God told them that my brother would be healed, meaning his brain would be fixed and he would be with us in our physical world again. 100's of people were praying for him. I was ready to travel the world with him once he recovered to tell the story of how he was healed, and have proof that God did it because that would be the only explanation.

 

Well, my brother passed away. Yes, I was very angry at the christian god. Why would he tell people that he was going to heal my brother, then let him die? I realized that this same thing happened often. People claimed that god told them something then it turns out not to be true...and I'm talking about people who have lived for the christian god for many, many years. I wondered, "If these people who have served god for the majority of their life still don't know whether or not he is talking to them, how can anyone?" I had seen this happen many times before my brother's death, and many times afterwards. I realized then that perhaps NO ONE hears any omnipotent/omniscient god talking to them. This is what got me searching for the truth.

 

I did not have an instant deconversion. It has been many years, probably around 10. After my brother's death, I continued to seek God and try to serve him. It was very hard...especially as I continued to search for truth. I realized that those who have a relationship with this god have a one-sided relationship. By that I mean, you can speak to him all you want, but you never hear anything back. Sure, you might get some kind of thought in your head (or heart-the most deceitful thing we have according to the bible itself) but those thoughts are just your own, imo.

 

My searching has lead me down many paths. I wondered why do muslims believe they have the truth? Why do hindus believe they have the truth? Why do christians believe they have the truth? There are a multitude of other beliefs as well. Can they all be right? Could maybe some of them be right? Maybe only one is right? Maybe none are.

 

Meh, this is such a long story so I'm not going to get into EVERY reason why I quit believing...because there are many. I'm just telling the beginning of the story.

 

One thing I was not looking forward to was facing the missionary that I worked with over seas. This finally happened a few weeks ago. He came to my house and he already knew that I wasn't living for the christian god because he was told that I hadn't been to church in over 2 years. He came to talk to me about and try to bring me back. He decided to use fear tactics to do so. I was not impressed. He read to me a story from the O.T. of how the Israelites were god's people and served him, but there were times when they would rebel and stop serving him. At that point god would curse them, punish them, and bring diseases upon them and their children. He told me that this was going to happen to me because I once served him and if I don't begin serving him again that this would happen to me and my family and my children would die lost. Wow, maybe I should start serving him again out of fear? Is this what it comes down to? Being so afraid that you must serve him? What kind of god is this? Not one that I want to be around.

 

Anyways, a few days after he left, I began thinking......There are those who serve God with their lives whose children have diseases, who have family that die lost, who themselves are always sick. Here's an example: The missionary brought me this message has a wife who has all kinds of allergies and is always sick, he had twin girls who died a few days after they were born, has a daughter who is barren, has a son-in-law who is sterile, his own father died a sinner. So, seems to me it doesn't matter whether you serve the christian god or not, you're not safe. Or, could it be this is just nature? I think so.

 

Having said all this, I am not a normal atheist. I don't really know how to classify myself. When my brother was in the hospital, I had something weird happen. I actually saw him out of his body. That is really hard to explain, but I saw it. Was I hallucinating for some reason? Maybe, though I don't do drugs and wasn't on meds. Could I have just imagined it? I guess so, but it seemed real. I don't really know what to make of it.

 

Now, as far as ancient texts go, such as the bible, and the koran, and the hindu writings, etc. I have a theory that maybe these ancient people did witness things. But maybe what they witnessed they didn't understand and could only explain it that these beings were gods, and maybe to them they were gods. But maybe to us we would call them advanced extra terrestial beings. Who knows? Where are they now? Don't know.

 

There is so much to this existence and in this universe that we don't understand. I certainly don't. But, for me, the evidence just isn't there that an omnipotent, omniscient god exists. Looking around at the beautiful scenery does not explain to me that a god did it. Begging and pleading with this god from my heart over and over to let me get to know him when I was living for him, and not getting anything back in return also does not help matters.

[Hydroman74]

Oh yeah, another little thought I had the other day is this: The christian god, according to what I was taught and believed, will punish those who choose not to receive him by torturing them forever in fire. (This is even debated amongst christians themselves) Ok, now follow me on this....how does he expect us to make that kind of decision? Adam and Eve walked with god in the garden. They actually talked with him and really knew him. Yet, they could not make the right decision even though they were threatened with their lives. This is seen over and over in the Bible. The Israelites themselves saw many of their god's miracles yet over and over they would make the wrong decisions and go against what their god wanted. Peter, who gave up his life to go with Jesus denied knowing him 3 freakin times!!! There are more examples than these few. Ok, now this god expects us imperfect, fallible beings to make this eternal decision to believe in him when we've never even seen nor heard him? Does this make any sense? Not to me.

[Carmen]

Welcome to the site and thanks for sharing your story. I can definitely relate to all the things you said about why you left the faith. The harsh OT God, the fear tactics, the very idea of hell... The doctrine just doesn't hold together.

 

How are your Christian friends and family responding to this?

[ebonileigh]

I am a 36 year old married man with 4 kids. I was raised in what I call a "strong christian family" home. I accepted Jesus at about 10 years old and truly wanted to live for him. I didn't listen to any music except christian music. I didn't smoke, drink, go to parties, didn't masturbate, etc. I went to church events, even events at other churches that weren't my own. I was the guy in high school that you would see carrying a bible to class. I loved God and what he did for me. I always thought about him. At the ages of 19-22, I lived in a country other than my own working as a volunteer in a christian missionary organization that worked with drug addicts. I was invited by one of the head missionaries of the organization to come with him and his family. I must say, it was a great experience.

 

Now, when I returned home from the mission work, I chose not to go back. I decided to go to school and get an education. During this time, my brother had a brain aneurysm. What happened during his 6 days in the hospital was the catalyst to get me to examine what I believe and why. While he was in the hospital, there were people who would come and visit and give us messages that God told them that my brother would be healed, meaning his brain would be fixed and he would be with us in our physical world again. 100's of people were praying for him. I was ready to travel the world with him once he recovered to tell the story of how he was healed, and have proof that God did it because that would be the only explanation.

 

Well, my brother passed away. Yes, I was very angry at the christian god. Why would he tell people that he was going to heal my brother, then let him die? I realized that this same thing happened often. People claimed that god told them something then it turns out not to be true...and I'm talking about people who have lived for the christian god for many, many years. I wondered, "If these people who have served god for the majority of their life still don't know whether or not he is talking to them, how can anyone?" I had seen this happen many times before my brother's death, and many times afterwards. I realized then that perhaps NO ONE hears any omnipotent/omniscient god talking to them. This is what got me searching for the truth.

 

I did not have an instant deconversion. It has been many years, probably around 10. After my brother's death, I continued to seek God and try to serve him. It was very hard...especially as I continued to search for truth. I realized that those who have a relationship with this god have a one-sided relationship. By that I mean, you can speak to him all you want, but you never hear anything back. Sure, you might get some kind of thought in your head (or heart-the most deceitful thing we have according to the bible itself) but those thoughts are just your own, imo.

 

My searching has lead me down many paths. I wondered why do muslims believe they have the truth? Why do hindus believe they have the truth? Why do christians believe they have the truth? There are a multitude of other beliefs as well. Can they all be right? Could maybe some of them be right? Maybe only one is right? Maybe none are.

 

Meh, this is such a long story so I'm not going to get into EVERY reason why I quit believing...because there are many. I'm just telling the beginning of the story.

 

One thing I was not looking forward to was facing the missionary that I worked with over seas. This finally happened a few weeks ago. He came to my house and he already knew that I wasn't living for the christian god because he was told that I hadn't been to church in over 2 years. He came to talk to me about and try to bring me back. He decided to use fear tactics to do so. I was not impressed. He read to me a story from the O.T. of how the Israelites were god's people and served him, but there were times when they would rebel and stop serving him. At that point god would curse them, punish them, and bring diseases upon them and their children. He told me that this was going to happen to me because I once served him and if I don't begin serving him again that this would happen to me and my family and my children would die lost. Wow, maybe I should start serving him again out of fear? Is this what it comes down to? Being so afraid that you must serve him? What kind of god is this? Not one that I want to be around.

 

Anyways, a few days after he left, I began thinking......There are those who serve God with their lives whose children have diseases, who have family that die lost, who themselves are always sick. Here's an example: The missionary brought me this message has a wife who has all kinds of allergies and is always sick, he had twin girls who died a few days after they were born, has a daughter who is barren, has a son-in-law who is sterile, his own father died a sinner. So, seems to me it doesn't matter whether you serve the christian god or not, you're not safe. Or, could it be this is just nature? I think so.

 

Having said all this, I am not a normal atheist. I don't really know how to classify myself. When my brother was in the hospital, I had something weird happen. I actually saw him out of his body. That is really hard to explain, but I saw it. Was I hallucinating for some reason? Maybe, though I don't do drugs and wasn't on meds. Could I have just imagined it? I guess so, but it seemed real. I don't really know what to make of it.

 

Now, as far as ancient texts go, such as the bible, and the koran, and the hindu writings, etc. I have a theory that maybe these ancient people did witness things. But maybe what they witnessed they didn't understand and could only explain it that these beings were gods, and maybe to them they were gods. But maybe to us we would call them advanced extra terrestial beings. Who knows? Where are they now? Don't know.

 

There is so much to this existence and in this universe that we don't understand. I certainly don't. But, for me, the evidence just isn't there that an omnipotent, omniscient god exists. Looking around at the beautiful scenery does not explain to me that a god did it. Begging and pleading with this god from my heart over and over to let me get to know him when I was living for him, and not getting anything back in return also does not help matters.

Hi, and welcome, I am a new member to this site also, and an ex-christian, I am now an atheist, amongst other labels I like to give myself. Thankyou for sharing your story, I've read both of your posts, and I know it's not the full story, and I'm sure you'll tell more of it as time goes along. I like your questioning, and encourage you continue, I also encourage you to read (if you have not already done so) some of the great authors, alive and deceased; Sam Harris, Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins (of course), Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Dan Barker, Annie Laurie Gaylor, Daniel Dennett, Robert Ingersoll, Rupert Hughes, Thomas Paine, just to name a few. Infidels.org, is a great site for reading. I also recommend listening to skeptical freethought podcasts, they are great.

Also, I am very sad to hear about your brother, I know it's some years ago, however, the pain would still be there. Time is a great healer, of all things.

[Hydroman74]

Well, I'm at work and bored so I will continue sharing my thoughts. Thanks for the responses so far.

 

First, I would like to recommend looking up some videos on youtube of a TV show called The Atheist Experience. It's a live call in show with some great hosts. The lead host was actually studying to be a preacher when he became an atheist. There are others who appear on the show who are former christians. They have some great topics and discussions with their callers. This show has really encouraged me.

 

Second, I have not told my parents that I now call myself an atheist. When my family and I go to their house for dinner my dad always asks me to say the blessing. So, I do it. I have asked them many questions which would lead them to believe that maybe I don't believe like I used to. My wife does know of my beliefs and she doesn't know what she should believe. I've tried encouraging her to search for truth herself instead of just listening to what I say. I want her to do her own research and see where it leads her.

 

Research, hmmmmm, I have so much more I need to do. I have researched things, but there is so much to look into. When you research how the Bible was actually put together you begin to realize that this isn't the infallible word of an omnipotent, omniscient god. Then when you see all the english translations, and how some of those translations have complete verses removed and some have verses added that weren't even in the earlier manuscripts, it opens your eyes even more. You realize that if this god is real, he allowed this to happen. If he allowed his "word" to be changed over and over in our recent times, how much was changed in the ancient times? God doesn't change, right? So he would always allow it. If that's the case, how can ANY of it be trusted? One thing I've realized is that it all boils down to faith. You have to have faith. I don't. I've learned many times that just because one has faith in something, that doesn't make it truth. Don't muslims have faith that what they believe is true? What about hindus? What about mormons, jw's, catholics etc? All of these belief systems have people who have given and would more than likely give their lives today for their beliefs.

 

I've come to understand that the way we are raised is how we're more than likely going to believe. Yes, there are exceptions, and the exceptions go all ways. By that I mean that there are those who are raised christian who have become atheist, those who are raised muslim who become christian, those who are raised atheist who have become hindu, etc. But, more than likely if you're born in Saudi Arabia you're going to be muslim and if you're born in the U.S. you're going to be christian.

[Hydroman74]

As I began searching for truth, I would go back to the bible. But I had a problem. When I read the bible I would come up with questions. The more I read the bible, the more questions I would come up with. I decided I wasn't going to just believe everything I read, but that I would look at it with a different perspective. Just by starting in Genesis, so many questions would come up. First, god worked on the earth for 3 days before creating a sun or starts, yet there was light coming from somewhere. The bible says that there was evening and morning for each day of creation, yet no sun existed yet? So how was there an evening or morning? Especially if he is not on the earth creating it but out in space looking at it. How would you know whether it was evening and morning? What was the point of reference?

 

Anyways, on the fourth day he created the sun, moon, and stars. Ah, now we can have a better idea of an evening and morning, just depends on where you are on the earth to know when those will occur. Ok. But now this is interesting. God has spent so many days working on this little, tiny spec but in one fail swoop creates the rest of the universe? He created the sun, the moon, the rest of the planets in our solar system, all the galaxies which consists of stars (some of which are much bigger than our sun), other planets (some of which are bigger than our biggest planets) all the dark matter and other things that we haven't discovered yet, and maybe even life on other planets, and don't forget angels (when did he make them?)...he did all that in one day but worked on the earth alone for about 4 days? Anyways, when he's done creating he says it is good.

 

Well, we can move on to Adam and Eve. Did he create them immortal? If so, why did he create the tree of life? The tree of life gives immortality to those who eat of it. That's why he kicked Adam and Eve out of the garden, so they wouldn't eat of it and live forever. So, again, if he created them immortal, why did he need to create a tree of life? Who was it for? Now, if he didn't create them immortal, they were going to die whether they sinned or not. To me, this does the Bible in from the get go. We can get into the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Why did god put that in the garden? If he is omniscient, he already knows what decision would be made, so what's the point of testing them? He already knows they would fail the test. Then the serpent shows up. The serpent talks to Eve and says, "You're not going to die if you eat that fruit. But, you will become like gods knowing good and evil." Was it normal for Eve to talk to serpents or other animals? Did this encounter not give her any red flags? Ok, so we know she eats the fruit and convinces Adam to eat it too. The serpent is right. They don't die and they receive certain knowledge. God even confirms this and says, they have become like us, knowing good and evil. That's when he decides to kick them out of the garden so that they don't eat from the Tree of Life because then they'd live forever. You mean, if they eat the fruit of the Tree of Life that an omnipotent god can't kill them? Huh? Is the fruit of the Tree of Life more powerful than God?

 

Ok, so later some beings come down and mate with human women...somehow. Some people think they were angels and others think they were offspring of Seth. Either way, the offspring of these unions create some kind of beings called Nephilim who were men of reknown, heroes of old....whatever that means. I have to ask, if these sons of god were angels, did god create angels with the ability to mate and reproduce with humans? Can they reproduce with each other too? If they were offspring of Seth, what was so special about them that made them reknown and heroes? Well, god decides to correct the problem he is having with his creation by sending of all things, a flood....something that could be a naturally occuring thing, like with the melting of the polar regions, or via impact with an asteroid. Hmmm, why not just snap your fingers and make all those who you want dead to die? Instead a flood is sent, which could have happened naturally like I said before but attributed to a god doing it because he was angry....kind of like what happened recently with hurricane Katrina. People were saying, and still say, that God did that because of the sin of New Orleans. Are you kidding me?

 

Meh, I hope I'm making some sense so far with my ramblings.

[Hydroman74]

Off topic: I've just realized I spelled my name wrong! LMAO!! It should be Hydroman74, not Hyrdoman74! Jebus. Can it be fixed?

[FourDogBrewing]

Welcome to the forums, I think you will find this is a great place to learn, converse and be in a community of people who understand and share your experiences.

 

 

I understand exactly where you are coming from. I grew up in a missionary family and have seen people giving their lives for what??

 

Anyway take some time to study, think and start exploring your new beliefs.

 

Recommended reading is "Why I Believed" by Ken Daniels. Another member Shyone recommended it to me when I came here, and I have been recommending it to anyone with as strong a background as you have. Great book, worth reading, 100% free online as well.

 

http://www.kwdaniels.com/

 

Anyway, welcome, have fun, enjoy the journey and your new found freedom.

 

Forgot to mention as sad as this is, all that prayer for your brother could have made things worse. The only real study out there about the power of prayer (or lack thereof) demonstrated that those who were prayed for had worse recovery rates : http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html

[Petrel]

Hi Hydroman, welcome to the forum. I guess you're married with kids, so your wife must have taken it pretty well, which is some luck!

 

Forgot to mention as sad as this is, all that prayer for your brother could have made things worse. The only real study out there about the power of prayer (or lack thereof) demonstrated that those who were prayed for had worse recovery rates : http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html

I think this is inappropriate to bring up. I'm sure prayer made no contribution whatsoever to his brother's situation. IMO the results of that study are due to people getting performance anxiety over whether they would get better quickly and uphold the value of prayer or let their religion down by having a more protracted recovery. I don't think this effect would be involved with a situation as with his brother where he was very critically ill.

[Hydroman74]

Hyrdoman....that cracks me up everytime I look at it.

 

I agree, it was a waste of time to pray for my brother. I remember the doctor coming in to our waiting room and discussed harvesting my brother's organs so that someone else who needs them could use them. We declined every time he asked because we believed he was going to need them. But think about it...if God was going to heal my brother's brain, couldn't he also replace any organs they removed from him? It pisses me off. Someone could have used them.

 

You know, when people pray for something such as for a loved-one to be healed from some kind of problem, and the loved-one passes away, the excuse for it is that it wasn't god's will. Right? Well, if 100's of people can pray for something to happen and god doesn't do it because it's not his will then so be it. Now, what if it was god's will and no one prayed? Would he do it anyways, or would he refrain from doing his will because no one prayed? Isn't he going to do it anyways if it's his will? And if it's not his will, he is not going to do it? Just like with my brother and countless other instances no certain amount of prayer and faith changed anything. I'm sure we could all provide examples of this. If god were real, why wouldn't he just tell you that it's not his will so that you don't waste your breath begging for him to do it? Is it really that hard god?

 

In the end, it's all bullshit anyways.

 

You know what does heal people? Science and scientific research. Parents, don't sit at home in faith while your child is dying. Get them to a doctor!

[Shyone]

Hyrdoman....that cracks me up everytime I look at it.

 

I agree, it was a waste of time to pray for my brother. I remember the doctor coming in to our waiting room and discussed harvesting my brother's organs so that someone else who needs them could use them. We declined every time he asked because we believed he was going to need them. But think about it...if God was going to heal my brother's brain, couldn't he also replace any organs they removed from him? It pisses me off. Someone could have used them.

 

You know, when people pray for something such as for a loved-one to be healed from some kind of problem, and the loved-one passes away, the excuse for it is that it wasn't god's will. Right? Well, if 100's of people can pray for something to happen and god doesn't do it because it's not his will then so be it. Now, what if it was god's will and no one prayed? Would he do it anyways, or would he refrain from doing his will because no one prayed? Isn't he going to do it anyways if it's his will? And if it's not his will, he is not going to do it? Just like with my brother and countless other instances no certain amount of prayer and faith changed anything. I'm sure we could all provide examples of this. If god were real, why wouldn't he just tell you that it's not his will so that you don't waste your breath begging for him to do it? Is it really that hard god?

 

In the end, it's all bullshit anyways.

 

You know what does heal people? Science and scientific research. Parents, don't sit at home in faith while your child is dying. Get them to a doctor!

It is clear that you have thought about this a great deal. I think that praying, as an expression of love, isn't exactly wasted. It won't accomplish anything miraculous, but it does allow for one to express hope, and that' not really wasted effort.

 

Refusing to allow others to harvest organs because he might need them? I think that's counterproductive.

 

From experience, I know that science can do much. There are limits to what can be accomplished though, and that breaks my heart. Even with its limitations, it's still miles ahead of faith healing.

[★ Citsonga ★]

Greetings Hydroman74, and congratulations on breaking free from religion.

 

Anyways, on the fourth day he created the sun, moon, and stars. Ah, now we can have a better idea of an evening and morning, just depends on where you are on the earth to know when those will occur. Ok. But now this is interesting. God has spent so many days working on this little, tiny spec but in one fail swoop creates the rest of the universe? He created the sun, the moon, the rest of the planets in our solar system, all the galaxies which consists of stars (some of which are much bigger than our sun), other planets (some of which are bigger than our biggest planets) all the dark matter and other things that we haven't discovered yet, and maybe even life on other planets, and don't forget angels (when did he make them?)...he did all that in one day but worked on the earth alone for about 4 days?

 

You see, the earth had to be made suitable for man, so it was more important to get right. The rest was just for show, so it could be thrown together quickly.

 

[/sarcasm]

 

OK, on a more serious note, I fully agree. This is just one example of how the bible was composed by geocentric people who saw the sun, moon and stars as simple dots of light not to awfully far out there. It's so ridiculous that I feel like kicking myself every time I recall that I actually used to believe the bible!

 

Anyway, enjoy the journey ahead of you....

[HRDWarrior]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

[StevoMuso]

Hey Hydroman74 - and a huge welcome to you. I've LOVED reading your posts - you have a brilliant way of looking at Scripture and asking pointed questions.

 

Adam and Eve walked with god in the garden. They actually talked with him and really knew him. Yet, they could not make the right decision even though they were threatened with their lives. This is seen over and over in the Bible. The Israelites themselves saw many of their god's miracles yet over and over they would make the wrong decisions and go against what their god wanted. Peter, who gave up his life to go with Jesus denied knowing him 3 freakin times!!!

I often wondered why the 'heroes' of the Bible were so stupid. Well spotted Hydro - they actually saw God, saw Him do miracles and swallow up their fellow Jews by their 1000s for rebellion, and still rebelled!! Weird - and not very likely either.

 

God has spent so many days working on this little, tiny spec but in one fail swoop creates the rest of the universe? He created the sun, the moon, the rest of the planets in our solar system, all the galaxies which consists of stars (some of which are much bigger than our sun), other planets (some of which are bigger than our biggest planets) all the dark matter and other things that we haven't discovered yet, and maybe even life on other planets, and don't forget angels (when did he make them?)...he did all that in one day but worked on the earth alone for about 4 days?

And if some of the stars were millions (or even a mere 10,000,000) of light-years away, how did their light reach earth so quickly? Brilliant post bro.

 

BTW: You asked me to post my story - 'tis done, and entitled "Missionary To Atheist".

Love the way you ask questions, love the way you think - brilliant. Welcome to ExC.

[Hydroman74]

Thanks guys for the replies.

 

 

And if some of the stars were millions (or even a mere 10,000,000) of light-years away, how did their light reach earth so quickly? Brilliant post bro.

 

 

Well, what I've heard from some young earth creationists is that god created the light from the stars already in its path, lol. So I ask this, since we can see the light of a supernova (which is a star that has exploded)over 100 million light years away, that means it should have taken at least 100 million years for the light from that explosion to get here. But if god created the stars 6000 - 10000 years ago as they believe, then he would have created the star already exploding. Why would he create exploded stars? IMO, that blows away the young earth theories at least.

 

I'm gonna go read your story now, thanks for posting!

[Hydroman74]

Ha! I'm in the process of reading Ken Daniels online book and he talks about the whole supernova thing. That made me smile.

[Ouroboros]

Off topic: I've just realized I spelled my name wrong! LMAO!! It should be Hydroman74, not Hyrdoman74! Jebus. Can it be fixed?

Yes. It's done.

 

Welcome Hydroman. I thought "Hyrdo" was something Greek or whatever. I didn't know what it meant, but thought, "hmm. okay. whatever man. hard to pronounce, but sure..."

 

Anyway. I read your story. I can totally relate.

 

Me, born in a Christian home. Converted at 7. Spoke in tongues at 11. Read the whole Bible several times. Went on mission trips. Knocked on doors in the neighborhoods to convert heathens. Etc...

 

My kids and wife were in a terrible accident. All of them were badly hurt. They're all alive today, but things never returned to normal again. One thing led to another, and eventually I lost my faith too.

[Ouroboros]

Well, what I've heard from some young earth creationists is that god created the light from the stars already in its path, lol. So I ask this, since we can see the light of a supernova (which is a star that has exploded)over 100 million light years away, that means it should have taken at least 100 million years for the light from that explosion to get here. But if god created the stars 6000 - 10000 years ago as they believe, then he would have created the star already exploding. Why would he create exploded stars? IMO, that blows away the young earth theories at least.

Actually, I think the observation of the supernova 1987A is the most damning evidence against the young Earth.

[Hydroman74]

Thanks for the info, and thanks for fixing my name!