Question to literal Exchristian Atheists

[BuddhistCommunist]

I noticed that the majority of this site community is Atheist. Next, would be Pagan and Agnostic, the rest would be other. I'm a Celtic Buddhist and I was curious if the majority of the atheist community dislikes either (can use more than one answer)

 

1. Christian belief.

2. Evengelical faiths period.

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

I'm just curious If some of you dislike other faiths just because they believe in something, or if any of you have religious contempts against anyone belief. And please be completely honest. I must admit I find myself disliking All monotheistic faiths and the majority of western organized religion. But I think that just stims from my contempt for Xtians.

[Godless Wonder]

I find the entrie idea of faith to be stupid.

 

I don't even like the word "believe," and generally try to use the word "think" instead.

 

What is faith? To me, so far as I have been able to tell, despite all of the wriggly worming equivocations of the defenders of faith, it is nothing more then holding the opinion that an idea is true with a certainty that exceeds available evidence (and too often, ignores contrary evidence.)

 

So that is faith, as near as I have been able to tell. (Don't bother telling me that's not what faith is, because that is EXACTLY what it is, as I have observed it intensely over the last few years.)

 

And why the hell is a person who "has strong faith," or in other words, holds the opinion that certain ideas (any ideas) to be true with a degree of certainty unwarranted by available evidence, to be respected for so unreasonably tenaciously holding an opinion? Why is faith considered a virtue?

 

People think of faith as a virtue merely because they have been told it is a virtue since they were little kids, and virtually nobody even hints that it isn't a virtue. Even many atheists take a "live and let live" attitude to the extreme of "respecting" the faith of others.

 

Now, don't get me wrong, I do respect the right of others to think whatever it is they are going to think. I have no problem with that. However, if I find their thoughts to be stupid, I also respect my own right to have that thought, and to express it. They have a right to be stupid, and I have a right to think and to say that I think that they are being stupid.

 

So, I do "hate" the concept of faith, (more accurately, I think the concept is obviously stupid, rather than hate it.) I disapprove of the promotion of faith as a virtue, and consider the promotion of faith to be akin to promoting illiteracy, and akin to actively preventing people from being able to learn to read.

[crazy-tiger]

Well, I dislike the christian belief, simply because it makes so little sense and really jars my sense of logic.

I really hate evangelical faiths in total... any faith that tries to convert others deserves a slap.

On the whole, the way christians treat themselves and others isn't too bad. (damn stupid yes, but bad? not really) On the other hand, the way that fundies, YECs, IDers, creationists and other more litteral christians treat themselves and others makes me want to re-enact the cop station scene from "The Terminator" on them...

I have no problems about anyone having a supernatural belief, as long as they don't expect me to believe it too.

[Vigile]

I find the entrie idea of faith to be stupid.

 

I don't even like the word "believe," and generally try to use the word "think" instead.

 

What is faith?  To me, so far as I have been able to tell, despite all of the wriggly worming equivocations of the defenders of faith, it is nothing more then holding the opinion that an idea is true with a certainty that exceeds available evidence (and too often, ignores contrary evidence.)

 

So that is faith, as near as I have been able to tell.  (Don't bother telling me that's not what faith is, because that is EXACTLY what it is, as I have observed it intensely over the last few years.)

 

And why the hell is a person who "has strong faith," or in other words, holds the opinion that certain ideas (any ideas) to be true with a degree of certainty unwarranted by available evidence, to be respected for so unreasonably tenaciously holding an opinion?  Why is faith considered a virtue?

 

People think of faith as a virtue merely because they have been told it is a virtue since they were little kids, and virtually nobody even hints that it isn't a virtue.  Even many atheists take a "live and let live" attitude to the extreme of "respecting" the faith of others. 

 

Now, don't get me wrong, I do respect the right of others to think whatever it is they are going to think.  I have no problem with that.  However, if I find their thoughts to be stupid, I also respect my own right to have that thought, and to express it.  They have a right to be stupid, and I have a right to think and to say that I think that they are being stupid.

 

So, I do "hate" the concept of faith, (more accurately, I think the concept is obviously stupid, rather than hate it.)  I disapprove of the promotion of faith as a virtue, and consider the promotion of faith to be akin to promoting illiteracy, and akin to actively preventing people from being able to learn to read.

 

This is the best post I've read this week, probably longer. I'm saving this for the next fool who comes along claiming that faith in gravity and evolutionis akin to the faith they have in god.

[pandora]

I find most beliefs in the supernatural dubious at best, but I do respect people's right to believe them. I do have my own days where I am convinced something is out there, even if that something is nothing more than just life itself. I tend towards the spiritual and find Buddhist practices helpful, but personal petitions to some god are kind of ludicrous to me.

[BLACKGRAVITY]

the bibull tells you what faith is....

 

 

a bunch of crap.

 

Heb 11:1 (KJV) Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

 

Heb 11:1 (NIV) Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see.

 

Heb 11:1 (NEB) Faith... makes us certain of realities we do not see.

 

Heb 11:1 (Mof) Now faith means that we are confident of what we hope for, convinced of what we do not see.

 

Heb 11:1 (Wey) Now faith is a well-grounded assurance of that for which we hope, and a conviction of the reality of things which we do not see.

[Ouroboros]

i cant remember where it is in the bibull.... but it tells you what faith is...(something like) faith is hope,without evedince,blah,blah... ill try to find the vs.

You think of Heb 11:1-?

[BLACKGRAVITY]

You think of Heb 11:1-?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

yea... thx.. [bg]edit post...[/bg]

[MrSpooky]

I dislike all forms of supernaturalism. The philosophy and aesthetics you can keep.

[woodsmoke]

I noticed that the majority of this site community is Atheist. Next, would be Pagan and Agnostic, the rest would be other. I'm a Celtic Buddhist and I was curious if the majority of the atheist community dislikes either (can use more than one answer)

 

1. Christian belief.

 

You betcha'.

 

2. Evengelical faiths period.

 

As a general rule they tend to rub me the wrong way, but I try to reserve judgment until I've had a chance to study them in greater depth and come to an informed conclusion.

 

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

 

It's been my experience that the vast majority of Christians treat themselves and others pretty well the same as the vast majority of humans. Folks is folks.

 

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

This doesn't bother me too much. I may not agree with it, but the kind of person they are is a hell of a lot more important to me than what brand of spooks they worship, if any. Once again, folks is folks.

 

I'm just curious If some of you dislike other faiths just because they believe in something, or if any of you have religious contempts against anyone belief. And please be completely honest. I must admit I find myself disliking All monotheistic faiths and the majority of western organized religion. But I think that just stims from my contempt for Xtians.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm not too keen on most western monotheisms myself, but again, I try not to let that affect my judgment of a person's character. For the third time (you'll find I really like this saying), folks is folks. Most of them are good and the kind o' folks I'd love to sit down and have a drink with; that tends to hold true pretty well regardless of variations in race, religion, gender, culture, etc.

 

Welcome to Dave's house, BC. Check your coat at the door, put your feet up and stay a spell. We're good folks, and we don't bite.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Much.

[Amethyst]

I would say 1-3. I've got nothing against people who believe in the supernatural and keep it to themselves and don't expect others to believe them. Each to their own, so long as nobody is harmed (and they aren't driving me nuts).

[Dhampir]

I find the entrie idea of faith to be stupid.

 

I don't even like the word "believe," and generally try to use the word "think" instead.

 

What is faith?  To me, so far as I have been able to tell, despite all of the wriggly worming equivocations of the defenders of faith, it is nothing more then holding the opinion that an idea is true with a certainty that exceeds available evidence (and too often, ignores contrary evidence.)

 

So that is faith, as near as I have been able to tell.  (Don't bother telling me that's not what faith is, because that is EXACTLY what it is, as I have observed it intensely over the last few years.)

 

And why the hell is a person who "has strong faith," or in other words, holds the opinion that certain ideas (any ideas) to be true with a degree of certainty unwarranted by available evidence, to be respected for so unreasonably tenaciously holding an opinion?  Why is faith considered a virtue?

 

People think of faith as a virtue merely because they have been told it is a virtue since they were little kids, and virtually nobody even hints that it isn't a virtue.  Even many atheists take a "live and let live" attitude to the extreme of "respecting" the faith of others. 

 

Now, don't get me wrong, I do respect the right of others to think whatever it is they are going to think.  I have no problem with that.  However, if I find their thoughts to be stupid, I also respect my own right to have that thought, and to express it.  They have a right to be stupid, and I have a right to think and to say that I think that they are being stupid.

 

So, I do "hate" the concept of faith, (more accurately, I think the concept is obviously stupid, rather than hate it.)  I disapprove of the promotion of faith as a virtue, and consider the promotion of faith to be akin to promoting illiteracy, and akin to actively preventing people from being able to learn to read.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I too have gradually lost respect for the devoutly faithful. Even in life matters such as the fidelity of a spouse or the trustworthiness of a friend. No one has ever instilled in me such a sense of trust that I would put past them a human capacity for wrong. If you think the kid ain't yours, get a test. Think your best friend is a coke-head? Ask.

 

I especially don't respect the devoutly religious, because rarely do they allow their beliefs to be assailed, and said beliefs are born of ideas beaten into their heads that they are too afraid to analyze. I can't stand that I could have been kicked out of my house simply for having a book that just happened to have the word atheist in it.

[JeffXL]

Number 4, mostly.

 

Believers are making unsubstantiated claims, period. There is no difference between the world of make-believe involving God/Zeus/Jesus/Saraswati/Shiva/&c. nor mythical states of being involving Heaven/Nirvana/Pure Land/Elysian Fields/&c. All crapola.

 

It's not like nor dislike of religion. 2 + 2 = 4 whether I like it or not. It's the lying about something that does not exist.

 

Fundamentalist Christians want to force the world into their tiny, evil mould, which is why I despise them in particular.

[Vixentrox]

What would you think of a person that persists in the belief of the Easter Bunny beyond childhood? Raving lunatic perhaps? No difference between the Easter Bunny and the gods and supernatural things people follow devoutly.

[All Gods Fail]

I'm pretty much an atheist - gods/ghosts/fairys just don't exist. Spirituality, though, is fine if it's helpful, and encourages introspection and moral behavior. For example, I've found some of the philosophical practices of Buddhism very appealing.

 

But as for the questions -

 

1. Christian belief - a cult, plain and simple. No different than Mormons, Rev. Moon, or the Raelians.

 

2. Evengelical faiths period - evangelizing is bullshit. If you've got something good, you don't need to sell it. People will want what you've got. This goes for all religions.

 

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others - There are some 'false' xers who are genuinely good people, mainly because they don't really believe or practice the insanity or the hateful fanaticism. They just think 'Jesus is love' and try and practice that. Those xtians are wonderful. But unfortunately, they're also the minority.

 

4. Anyone with a Supernatural belief - Well, I guess it depends on the belief. I find fanatical Wiccans about as annoying as fanatical xers. I look at it like booze - as long as the user isn't an alkie, and they're not hurting themselves or others, let 'em drink. But if you can get along without it, you're that much better off, IMO.

[Mr. Neil]

1. Christian belief.

 

Depends on what you mean. Each person reflects their belief differently. I generally find the Christian faith rather immoral, but I've also found that most Christians are better than their faith. That may sound like a back-handed complement to a believer, I generally try to judge people on an individual basis rather than whether or not they are a Christian.

 

 

2. Evengelical faiths period.

 

Well, yes. I don't like evangelical faiths of any kind. I don't like the intrusiveness of evangelism. I'm tired of politically minded Christians trying to push and shove their way into science and ethics.

 

 

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

 

Again, it depends on the person, but in the case of evangelicals, no I don't like the way they treat people at all. The villification of anything non-Christian needs to end.

 

 

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

Certainly not. I only get angry with supernatural beliefs when they are explicitly anti-scientific. Now, some would say that supernaturalism is inherently anti-scientific (Franc), and that is correct in its own way, but when I say "anti-scientific", I'm referring to those people who attempt to stand in the way of greater scientific understanding simply because a few theories run counter to their faith. That is what I absolutely can't stand.

 

For a while, I was starting to become rather intolerant of supernaturalism, but I've kind of regressed back into my state of only attacking the people who really deserve being attacked; namely inerrantists and creationists.

[Sokudo Ningyou]

1. Christian belief.

 

I dislike it and any religions like it because it strikes me as the grown-up equivalent to a security blanket that's wrapped around their head and disallows them to breathe. I've met very few in the faith who seem to be able to think with their head instead of their ass once the topic comes up, and even more who seem to think my lack of is so abhorrent it means I'm then too stupid to deal with. People can think what they want, but it's personally stupid to me to believe in, and even more offensive when they try to push it on me.

2. Evengelical faiths period.

 

Only if I can get out the bullhorn and quote "The Origin of the Species" back into their face would I be a bit more tolerable. I've dealt with these assholes before, and it astounds me as to how well they've trained themselves to be bullying jackasses with no respect for anyone else.

 

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

 

You mean the way I get treated at work or at home by Lutherans who think they know everything and I'm just an idiot? Granted, at home isn't so bad, because the roommate is at least a bit more open to argument, but in general, I can't believe people who hypocritically think the worst of everyone can stand there and tell me I'm basically a bad person because I don't have God.

 

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

Supernatural isn't as odd to me as religion. As far as I see it, "supernatural" is more a term for things we haven't yet figured out as opposed to "imaginative crap someone thought up one day around the fire." I've had odd things happen that couldn't be explained away as my imagination, but I have yet to see someone create miracles because they believe in some dead smelly hippie.

[Prolix]

1. Christian belief.

Yes, I dislike the Christian religion. That doesn't mean all Christians, just their untrue, immoral, self-contradictory religion.

2. Evengelical faiths period.

Evengelicals themselves annoy me more than the faiths, because the faith isn't the one knocking on doors and making a Campus Crusade for Cthulu... em, Christ. It's the people following the religion that screeches on street corners, not ideas or books.

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

Nothing wrong with this, in the Western world at least, so long as they aren't trying to convert people, or kill witches, heretics and homosexuals.

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

I dislike supernatural beliefs, not necessarilly people with supernatural beliefs. But if their beliefs make them less than fun to be around, for example a fluffbunny Wiccan or a Muslim terrorist, and have no redeeming qualities, then no, I will not like them.

[Guest SwordOfTruth]

I have no issue with you being a Celtic Buddhist as long as you don't try to convert me to Celtic Buddhism. That is my main sticking point with much of christianity; it's evangelistic nature.

 

I think all supernaturalism is nonsense, but I don't hold a belief in it against anyone as long as they leave me alone. I am the first to acknowledge that there is much in the universe that is not explained by science, and possibly much that will never be explained by science. This doesn't imply a supernatural explanation; it doesn't really imply anything.

 

Did you know that anyone of provable jewish ancestory on their mothers side can emigrate to israel except for those who convert to christianity? The reason is that the christians encourage jews to leave behind their cultural identity and anything that might be construed as jewish. You can be a Buddhist, or Atheist or Religious Jew and emigrate, for example, because none of those set out to destroy Jewishness.

 

This is the aspect of christianity that I despise: It's Borg-like desire to assimilate everything into itself and destroy all other belief systems.

 

You be a Celtic Buddhist. I'll be a Secular Humanist/Naturalist. Sometime if we ever run into each other I'll buy you a beer and enjoy my time with you, as long as you don't try to convert me.

[Ouroboros]

1. Christian belief.

I dislike it if it's enforced on people, but if it's kept personal and not threatening, it's okay. Everyone have their freedom to choose.

 

2. Evangelical faiths period.

Dislike a bit more. They talk and think like they have the truth, the whole truth and nothing but. And yet they're changing their POV on particular issues in society depending on the cultural majority. 200 years ago, drinking alcohol was okay, now it's a sin. 100 years ago smoking cigar was okay, now it's a sin. Driving and SUV is okay today, and every friggin evangelical preacher have one, but I bet you it will be a sin in 20 years. Or take how they talk about Lord of the Rings. When I grew up it was the "books from Satan", now I hear people are saying it contains the message of Jesus to people. What the frigging hell?! Churches burned those books 30 years ago. Can't the Whooooly Spoof make up his mind?

 

3. The way the Christians treat themselves and others.

I definitely dislike how some Christians treat others, obnoxious, disrespectful, condescending etc. (not every Christian does this) It's the ultimate proof that salvation and having Jesus in your heart does not change a person.

 

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

Don't dislike, actually like it. I don't have a belief in supernatural things right now, but I believe through evolution we got the ability to think in these terms and concepts, not for the sake of understanding metaphysical realms, but because it gave us the ability to visualize, fantasize, be imaginative. Without those abilities we can forget art, music, science, philosophy, movies, books, Internet...

 

If we didn't have the skill of thinking and fantasizing about the supernatural, and sometimes even put some belief into it, we wouldn't have Star Trek!

 

 

I'm just curious If some of you dislike other faiths just because they believe in something, or if any of you have religious contempt against anyone belief. And please be completely honest. I must admit I find myself disliking All monotheistic faiths and the majority of western organized religion. But I think that just stims from my contempt for Xtians.

Monotheistic faiths overall are extremely patriarchal and is all about gaining power and control.

But there are other faiths that are less threatening.

[Guest Challenger]

1. Christian belief.

 

No problem with it; I consider it to be mythology as much as that of the Greeks, or Native Americans, but not nearly as interesting, and much more confusing.

 

2. Evengelical faiths period.

 

Whatever makes them happy.

 

 

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

 

They can treat themselves any way they choose; its the "others" part of that becomes questionable.

 

 

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

Some people believe in ghosts and psychic phenomena; I don't begrudge them their belief, but, like Christianity, if they want it to be validated, they really need to produce something substantial. Definitive proof along those lines is lacking.

[woodsmoke]

No problem with it; I consider it to be mythology as much as that of the Greeks, or Native Americans, but not nearly as interesting, and much more confusing.

 

Ha! Well said!

 

I could never quite put Christian mythology on par with that of other peoples/cultures, but I never knew why. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

[Gnosis of Disbelief]

1. Christian belief.

 

I dislike monotheistic religions in general and Christianity in particular because these belief systems generate way too many arrogant, intolerant, self-righteous asswipes for there to be much good in them. And the idea that there is only one truth revealed to a single chosen people (whether those people are genetically related or not) is simply repugnant to me.

 

Eastern religions I'm not as hostile towards; there are certainly elements of Buddhism that I find appealing, even if I don't accept the totality of its world view. Plus, I can't recall encountering a single Buddhist that I would call arrogant, intolerant, or self-righteous (maybe others have, but I can't recall any in my experience). On the other hand, I've lost count of the number of Christians that I would characterize that way.

 

 

2. Evengelical faiths period.

 

How can I not feel contempt for any faith that markets its god (or gods or goddesses) like a bar of soap or a hooker? Sorry, no sale....

 

 

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

 

Don't care how Christians treat themselves. If they want a heaving mass of ancient gibberish to control their lives, that's their problem.

 

How they treat others, however, is a different story. The hatred they feel towards anyone who disagrees with them is detestable. Their long history of killing off anyone who disagrees with them is abominable. And their desire to keep the rest of us in the dark ages so they can worship their non-existent deity with minimal cognitive dissonace is simply repugnant.

 

 

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

No, I don't have a problem with someone believing in the supernatural, per se. It's what they do with that belief that concerns me.

[spamandham]

I'm a Celtic Buddhist and I was curious if the majority of the atheist community dislikes either (can use more than one answer)

 

1. Christian belief.

2. Evengelical faiths period.

3. The way the christians treat themselves and others.

4. Anyone with an Supernatural belief.

 

I'm just curious If some of you dislike other faiths just because they believe in something, or if any of you have religious contempts against anyone belief.

 

 

Don't confuse disdain for belief with disdain for those who hold such beliefs. As a humanist, I feel sorrow for those whose minds are enslaved by faith, but I still respect them as fellow people. However, I do despise those belief systems - all of them.

 

As best I can, I strive to eliminate faith from my own life. It's hard, since I keep finding new unexamined areas of my life, but I don't hold myself accountable for ignorance, anymore than I hold others accountable for ignorance.

 

I have to admit though, it's tough to make these distinctions when dealing with zealots.

[Guest David Williams]

What would you think of a person that persists in the belief of the Easter Bunny beyond childhood?  Raving lunatic perhaps?  No difference between the Easter Bunny and the gods and supernatural things people follow devoutly.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Christmas is coming, and we will be assailed by stories of the wonder of believing in Santa Claus. These stories never include the ending: the child discovers that all this believing was false, for there is no Santa.

 

Why does our society consider this wonderful? Why do we consider it good to accept claims without proof, to be convinced of the existence of creatures we cannot verify?

 

Santa, elves, Jesus, Allah, Krishna, Big Foot.