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Goodbye Jesus

I thought this was a place to DEBATE?


Angel

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In regard to the OP:

 

I typically give up on a 'debate' because it gets so horribly mis-directed.  Often times, what one is trying to say is replaced with some ridiculous carticature and in the process of trying to clear up the strawmen one only ends up in worse shape.

 

I don't think this is suprising; however, because many people here are wounded (by Christians) and probably shouldn't be talking with Christians -- the 'debate' is more of an opportunity to take cheap shots and express rage then anything.  I went through that phase myself -- it is perfectly natural.

 

Anyways, more often than not when I find myself being asked to explain how it is I justify clubbing baby seals -- when only moments before we were talking about the NFL -- I usually just throw my hands up and go read a different messageboard or carry on the conversations with people via PM.

 

:phew:

 

Don't forget the whole army ganging up on you!

 

Sometimes, an angel pm me tho'. That's the nice part. Do you get that?

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I've had serveral profitable conversations with people here via PM.

I've learned stuff from Neil, Chef, Madame_M and many others.

I've even read a couple of books based on challenges here.

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I don't think this is suprising; however, because many people here are wounded (by Christians) and probably shouldn't be talking with Christians -- the 'debate' is more of an opportunity to take cheap shots and express rage then anything.  I went through that phase myself -- it is perfectly natural.

Your CONDESCENSION towards others is showing again.

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Left speechless all right, usually because we know thier fucking "holy" book better than they do.

And knowing the book is "the problem" for us, isn't it?

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Your CONDESCENSION towards others is showing again.

 

Your need to read horrible things into other people's posts is showing again.

 

After getting burned by fundies I was pretty damn angry for a very long time (10 years) -- and I wasn't even abused as badly as some here. Understanding that anger phase isn't condenscension and it doesn't diminish the importance of that phase.

 

However, in healthy people it should be a phase that is passed through -- because living in anger for the rest of one's life is self destructive.

 

(I'm sure you'll read something about my desire to club baby seals in there -- go for it.)

 

:phew:

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And knowing the book is "the problem" for us, isn't it?

 

Your condescension is showing again -- that is, if anyone is still a Christian they don't know their Bible whereas those truly 'in the know' have left the faith. Do you make it a habit of always refering to everyone else as idiots?

 

*Mad_Gerbil begins to play the 'read whatever you want to into other's posts' game*

 

Also, your use of the royal plural is disturbing....

 

wOOt this is fun!

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And knowing the book is "the problem" for us, isn't it?

For many of us indeed. Actually READING the bible with an unbiased eye dechristianizes people faster than just about anything it seems.

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Actually READING the bible with an unbiased eye dechristianizes people faster than just about anything it seems.

When people are ready to see, their vision becomes more clear, in the same way that when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

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When people are ready to see, their vision becomes more clear, in the same way that when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

 

You've been reading "Ishmael" again haven't you?

 

:grin:

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You've been reading "Ishmael" again haven't you?

 

:grin:

Actually, no, I've never read that book. :HaHa:

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Actually, no, I've never read that book.  :HaHa:

 

Even though I disagree with it -- it does an excellent job of saying some things that really need to be said. It is very well done and an excellent (yet not too heavy) think piece.

 

I know Cerise is a huge fan -- some of the concepts show up in her posts quite frequently.

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However, in healthy people it should be a phase that is passed through -- because living in anger for the rest of one's life is self destructive.

 

Ah fuck it's the forgiveness police.

 

RUN ALL THOSE WITH LESS THEN HAPPY-GO LUCKY FEELINGS ABOUT CHRISTIANITY, FOR YOU SHALL BE BITTER AND SELF-DESTRUCTIVE ALL YOUR LIFE.

 

So decree the forgiveness police. :nono:

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Ah fuck it's the forgiveness police.

 

RUN ALL THOSE WITH LESS THEN HAPPY-GO LUCKY FEELINGS ABOUT CHRISTIANITY, FOR YOU SHALL BE BITTER AND SELF-DESTRUCTIVE ALL YOUR LIFE.

 

So decree the forgiveness police.  :nono:

 

I think a person should get over the anger but retain the lessons learned.

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I think a person should get over the anger but retain the lessons learned.

 

I think people should stop assuming they know what is best for other people regarding their own mental health.

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I think people should stop assuming they know what is best for other people regarding their own mental health.

 

I've assumed no such thing.

 

There have been numerous studies on the effects of anger/hatred on people and none of the effects (over the long term) are good. All the angry people I know curl up into tight little balls and die.

 

It is good to be angry in the short term because it motivates one to take the action necessary to change (or protect) oneself. However, being angry about something 20 years after the fact just kills one's soul.

 

However, if someone wants to spend the rest of his/her life a little bitter balled up mass of hatred -- feel free. It ain't clogging my arteries.

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I've assumed no such thing.

 

There have been numerous studies on the effects of anger/hatred on people and none of the effects (over the long term) are good.  All the angry people I know curl up into tight little balls and die.

 

It is good to be angry in the short term because it motivates one to take the action necessary to change (or protect) oneself.  However, being angry about something 20 years after the fact just kills one's soul.

 

However, if someone wants to spend the rest of his/her life a little bitter balled up mass of hatred -- feel free.  It ain't clogging my arteries.

It all depends. Sure, just going around in anger all the time causes stress on your emotional system, and you'll have a hard time making any friends. But! Sometimes, occasionally it is good to release the valve and let the steam out. We walk around with a lot of repression and supress our thoughts, emotions and concerns. This is the reason why we have psychotherapy, when someone actually talks about their frustration, anger, disappointmenst and so on, because it helps just to talk about it.

 

That is not the bad kind of anger, but the controlled and occasional outlet of frustration.

 

When I go to work, I don't spend a second thinking about how frustrating it is to debate with Pug or DPaul, but when I go on the site and read and post, then a lot of energy goes into it. I doubt there is anyone on this site that are in complete anger and yells at fictious Christians on the wall every awaken second of the day. This site is the vent, the outlet, the exhaust pipe (if you so want). We need it, and here is the steam and heat set on maximum.

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It all depends. Sure, just going around in anger all the time causes stress on your emotional system, and you'll have a hard time making any friends. But! Sometimes, occasionally it is good to release the valve and let the steam out. We walk around with a lot of repression and supress our thoughts, emotions and concerns. This is the reason why we have psychotherapy, when someone actually talks about their frustration, anger, disappointmenst and so on, because it helps just to talk about it.

 

That is not the bad kind of anger, but the controlled and occasional outlet of frustration.

 

When I go to work, I don't spend a second thinking about how frustrating it is to debate with Pug or DPaul, but when I go on the site and read and post, then a lot of energy goes into it. I doubt there is anyone on this site that are in complete anger and yells at fictious Christians on the wall every awaken second of the day. This site is the vent, the outlet, the exhaust pipe (if you so want). We need it, and here is the steam and heat set on maximum.

 

I agree.

I spent alot of time venting in the past in regard to my experiences in fundamentalism.

 

The venting is healthy, I think - and it is one of the major functions of exchristian.net if you ask me. It is a healthy function. However, the goal of venting should be to get to a point of being vented and done with it.

 

If the steam keeps being produced then the issue isn't being resolved -- the goal should be to lose the hatred and anger and replace it with a lesson learned. Forgiveness doesn't mean "make yourself vunerable again and be stupid" -- forgiveness is more about releasing the wronged than releasing the offender.

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I've assumed no such thing.

 

There have been numerous studies on the effects of anger/hatred on people and none of the effects (over the long term) are good.  All the angry people I know curl up into tight little balls and die.

 

It is good to be angry in the short term because it motivates one to take the action necessary to change (or protect) oneself.  However, being angry about something 20 years after the fact just kills one's soul.

 

However, if someone wants to spend the rest of his/her life a little bitter balled up mass of hatred -- feel free.  It ain't clogging my arteries.

 

You are using the language of the forgiveness police perfectly. Bitter, hatred, soul-killing. That's some good brainwashing.

 

Call me when you wake up, mm-kay?

 

I don't believe in a "soul" unless it relates to the type of music that comes out of jazz trumpets.

 

Anger = death? Maybe for you. Stop ASSuming everyone else works that way.

 

http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?showtopic=1544

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I agree.

I spent alot of time venting in the past in regard to my experiences in fundamentalism.

 

The venting is healthy, I think - and it is one of the major functions of exchristian.net if you ask me.  It is a healthy function.  However, the goal of venting should be to get to a point of being vented and done with it.

 

If the steam keeps being produced then the issue isn't being resolved -- the goal should be to lose the hatred and anger and replace it with a lesson learned.  Forgiveness doesn't mean "make yourself vunerable again and be stupid" -- forgiveness is more about releasing the wronged than releasing the offender.

Right.

 

Ooops! I'm in agreement with a Christian here, what did I do wrong... will that destroy my credibility? :HaHa: j/k

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Right.

 

Ooops! I'm in agreement with a Christian here, what did I do wrong... will that destroy my credibility? :HaHa: j/k

 

Undoubtedly. Your credibility is destroyed Han. Go flog yourself immediately in penence. :begood:

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You are using the language of the forgiveness police perfectly.  Bitter, hatred, soul-killing.  That's some good brainwashing.

 

Call me when you wake up, mm-kay?

 

I don't believe in a "soul" unless it relates to the type of music that comes out of jazz trumpets. 

 

Anger = death?  Maybe for you.  Stop ASSuming everyone else works that way.

 

http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?showtopic=1544

 

The forgiveness police thingy is throwing me -- I don't know why suggesting that people rid themselves of anger is generating such a response. The negative effects of substained anger on human health is well documented -- do you disagree with that assertion?

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I think Cerise mistakes the difference between forgiveness and letting go of anger.

 

I will never forgive my stepfather for what he did to me and my siblings, but I have let go of the anger because it hinders my path through life at this time.

 

Gerbil speaks of letting go of the anger, not forgiving the perpetrators. Some people think the two must happen together, but they do not. He is not the forgiveness police, at least I think not, and neither am I.

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I think Cerise mistakes the difference between forgiveness and letting go of anger.

 

I will never forgive my stepfather for what he did to me and my siblings, but I have let go of the anger because it hinders my path through life at this time.

 

Gerbil speaks of letting go of the anger, not forgiving the perpetrators.  Some people think the two must happen together, but they do not.  He is not the forgiveness police, at least I think not, and neither am I.

 

I think you should let me think for myself, imouto.

 

Some people think that "letting go of the anger" is required for all people. Anyone who thinks "what's best for me" = "what's best for everybody" gets a big fat F in red pen from me.

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From now on, I'm going to try not to waste webspace in this section on "hit and run" posters.  If a new Christian posts, I'm going to write:  Are you coming back? If they dont' reply, I'm not going to give replies anymore.

 

drive by posters, aka seagull fundies. They drop a load of shit and fly off oblivious.

 

You can tell if they will be sticking around most of the time by the level of arrogance and condescension in the opening post.

 

If they quote a bunch of babble bullshit and talk about how jesus loves us, they aint comin' back for more than a few posts. If they quote John 3:16 or sound like they're repating this sunday's sermon, you can be assured post 1 is their last post. They're just here to "sow seeds". We usually just tear them to shreads in effigy in honor of thier stupidity, get a good laugh, and tell them to fuck off just in case they happen to skim back through.

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