Jump to content
Goodbye Jesus

Two Questions for Christians...


quicksand

Recommended Posts

Hi Pug... hey excellent post! Lot of meat to chew on and you’ve tried to answer the questions before you, and with humor too. Cool.

 

Yes you will be glorifying Him in Heaven. But in Heaven you will be in a different body, I do not know what form that will be, but definitely without any more carnal, flesh desires. Maybe no need to drink or eat or shit even. No need to be one better, racist, sexist, logical, find proof of Him, search for the meaning of life or whatever. No more pain or whatever. Just eternal happiness. Eeeerrr... Heaven!

Well, first off, the question of whether or not the soul , that is your sum of your personality (foibles, faults included) will either extinguish or survive after physical death is a great question in itself, but not really central or important to the two or three question I asked above. It’s called a gimme, (a vehicle to further the debate) however, successful arguments against the immortal soul prove that there can be no heaven or hell waiting for you after death.

 

So I won’t really delve too much into your quote above, but you should be aware that in all ways your physical body does define who you are. In all ways your faults contrast the highlights of your persona. Remove one and a person becomes a house of cards.

 

Personally, I do not feel God is with me all the time. Sometimes when praying yes. Most times when praying with others yes. But all the time? Nahhh, I pray for it tho'. So no heaven for me on earth most times I'm afraid.

 

Sometimes in church my mind is thinking about work (eeek!). Then sometimes I get work solutions while day dreaming thus, was that Him talking to me? Or myself? Hmmmm....

 

But when you pray, are you not in heaven and at those time when you feel closest to god? If so, then what is the difference?

 

So? If you are without God, you won't believe in hell anyway. Like Christians, Buddhists also believe in many levels of Hell and Heaven and even realms of "other worlds". I think if I'm in hell, if I even think of God, I'll be adding more to my eternal suffering. What the hell, i had one chance and i screwed it.

The answer to your question if right from another Christian’s mouth. Hell and heaven exists regardless of what I choose or not choose to believe in. The question is I believe in God/Jesus right, but go to hell. If I am in hell and still feel god is with me, then how can that be hell? Have fun with that one there Pugmeister.

 

Anyways, Christians have such a masochistic side. Well, then I guess they’ll enjoy their eternal suffering then, but, heck if they enjoy it so much is it really suffering? He he.

 

The Bible, as we (you and I) have established is full of inconsistencies. Edited, modified conveniently by our ancestors. Some of it in there are God's words. But which part(s)? Jesus in me, and my faith, shall tell me... I pray. God, to me, is always here, sometimes closer, sometimes He's too busy (or heartless?) to entertain my petty prayers.

Well, very true in the first part. You’re a pretty liberal Christian up there, which is cool by me. However, you’ve exposed your flank as you have no reliable way to establish what is exactly God’s word or what is innovation by humankind. We, the skeptics, (including evey you - Pug) will tell you all you can do is special plead for whatever position you choose to advance.

 

For instance, take the religious right. To them, god and Jesus is the god of Constantine - a god of war and retribution. They, like Robertson and esp. Farwell (google it up) will tell you that war is Biblically justified. Liberal Christians like yourself will say that no Jesus was all about compassion and God is a caretaker of humanity and not the parental punisher of the right.

 

So who is right? You don’t have to anwser that directly, but something to consider. The Bible is a horrible way to figure these issues out. As fiction, as allegorical its fine to discuss, but to say that something is biblically justified is ludicrous and preposterous.

 

Babies are filed as special category. They'll be judged when they are older to make the choice of accepting or rejecting Christ. What if they err.. expire before hearing the Word? I believe Jesus would lovingly welcome them to heaven.

Really? How do you make this distinction? From where do you base this assumption on that babies are special category?

 

Here’s a kick in the ribs for you. If babies go to heaven, welcomed by Jesus, society better start killing their children before they get old enough to sin , you know. Concerned parents should kill their children before they can well disobey them (OT law and a SIN) . Andrea Yates should be out of prison for the murder of her sons and we as a Christian soceity should lionizer her as model of perfect parenting.

 

Well never mind all that.

 

Of course you are not in hell. Just feels like it. You will only go to hell when He says so ~ at the time of your judgement (body death). Your soul then goes to Heaven or Hell. There you'll have a body waiting for you (ha ha). But i do not know what that "body" (as humans understand it) will really be.

 

That is what has been speculated anyway. Roman C even thought of a holding area ~ purgatory i think. Here, your relatives pray for you to be cleansed so that you deserve to go higher up.

 

All the above info is as much as i know, and like the Bible, could all be (logical? illogical?) information/imagination/speculation from what i have heard/learnt from religious sites and from my pastors and fellow more senior Cs.

So, Pug you are in hell then? Right now you are in hell. If I kick you the nuts and it hurts are you going to tell me it only ”feels” like it and therefore the paint doesn’t really ”exist?” Your making a preposterous argument here.

 

On the issue of purgatory, a priest was opining in the paper the other day that purgatory is place where ALL people get cleaned up before going to the robotic assembly line of praise and devotion to God up thar in heaven. Anyway, if that is really the case, then what does it matter what I do or what I believe here on Earth? Eh? Hell is definitely unnecessary and irrelevant.

 

I don't think God's hell will be like what we humans imagine it. Not physical at all. Much worse!!!

 

If you happen to visit Singapore ~ there's a theme park there depicting the Chinese version of hell. In the human's way of imagination, of course. Cutting off hands for stealing. Boiling in oil, etc. But i think God's hell is beyond my imagination.

Your describing an evil demon Pugmiester, not a loving being that by definition is all loving being all powerful.

 

You'll certainly be having too much fun rather than thinking of Him. Hey, you've already made it to hell, he can't send you to another more hellish hell can He? But some people believe there are many levels of hell and heaven.

Well, your point is really irrelevant. Do you read Dante much?

 

Beyond my powers and poor knowledge. I know so little. The Bible is ummmm.... I have to rely on God. Sometimes His reception is ummm... a tad frosty. So... apologies.

 

I wish and pray you have a day like Heaven on earth today and as many other days as possible..

That’s too bad you feel that way however, you do not sound like a person that is really “alive”. Wow, everyday for me is a quantity that I can not adequately qualify. Your waiting for a life to live after your dead. I live it now. I start today and everyday. I live to live and it seems to be that those of the afterlife variety are living to die.

 

”Christians if you weary of life so easily, there is plenty of rope to be had.”

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 356
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • Ouroboros

    34

  • daniel_1012

    34

  • Vixentrox

    32

  • Fweethawt

    28

I never claimed i can heal people. thanks for you kind words

Then your not a true Christian or you have faith less than a mustard seed. Which is it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So you've already answered your Q and shut your ears to all else? I'm sorry, but it seems you're snickering up your sleeve while asking a supposed serious Q. :nono:

I'm not trying to start an argument here, but is anyone really going to accept an answer?

Well go ahead Paul. I know the debate well that's why the questions are posed in contra-postive. So go for it. I don't know if you are really a Calvinist, but if you are, it will add another wrinkle to the debate, which I will twist you in the wind with. (ie it is by God's grace and not by human volition that one is saved.)

 

If you got a reasonable argument, which can only be a strong or weak one and not proof in itself, then I will listen. I doubt you can harmonize all this anyway as the concepts of hell and heaven have developed over the centuries within the theology itself that I really doubt you are going to make much headway here in clarifying them.

 

But go for it. I wait to see what you can bring to the table.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Two Questions for Christians...

Consider the following.

 

 

 

 

 

What I would like from the Christian here is to harmonize these contradictions.

Often answered, when asked, a Christian will tell you that in heaven you will spend your time glorifying and praising god and then I often wonder, how is that any different then spending all your time praising and glorifying God on Earth?

 

How much variety do we experience on earth? Why, if Heaven exists (for the sake of the Q) would it be different? It would be to a higher degree and a higher satisfaction. If, in his many pursuits here on earth, a man does so in a fashion that brings glory to God and also brings the honor of his fellow man, how is this condemnable? Would we not expect that the Heavenly existence would bring the greater joy in work? Would we agree that work is still a "good" thing on earth or in Heaven (IF we allow its existence, of course)?

 

Conversely when asked about hell, the Christian will tell you that in hell you are without God. (So, God is not in all things and not omnipotent.)

 

Here I would tend to disagree. The presence of God will be the continuing condemnation against men. But in what form will they be cognizant of Him?

 

  Yet, on Earth, we are told that we can be close to God by following the Bible and believing in Jesus, otherwise we are without God.

 

Does the Bible not make the clear distinction between a level of "belief" and saving faith?

 

What about a baby without any beliefs? Are they languoring hell? Remember, a belief in Jesus is necessary. Newborns, toddlers, do not have beliefs.

 

Again, we would say this simple "belief in" is not the issue. This belief in Jesus does not simply concede his existence as a man. A baby cannot place faith in the Son of God. In anticipation of further Qs...

 

Now here’s a kicker and an additional question. Can I be in Hell (the physical burning eternal part of it) and still believe in God and Jesus?

 

Do you mean continue in the knowledge that God does exist? Yes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Paul. Thanks for you comments and now I am going to shred them to pieces. J/K. But hang tight.

How much variety do we experience on earth? Why, if Heaven exists (for the sake of the Q) would it be different? It would be to a higher degree and a higher satisfaction. If, in his many pursuits here on earth, a man does so in a fashion that brings glory to God and also brings the honor of his fellow man, how is this condemnable? Would we not expect that the Heavenly existence would bring the greater joy in work? Would we agree that work is still a "good" thing on earth or in Heaven (IF we allow its existence, of course)?

That pretty vague D.Paul. Can you qualify what a ”higher degree” means? When Billy Graham has sex with his wife (to which he admitts openly about) will his sex be of a better and higher quality experience in the clouds with God? Will my sexual adventurous in heaven be of greater satisfaction to me, b/c they are pretty satisfying right now.

 

I’m playing with you here. However, you should get the point that your language is to vague and doesn’t mean really anything until you can describe what a “higher degree or satisfaction” means, that is, I need a metric that can not be topped and so that I may know it.

 

Here I would tend to disagree. The presence of God will be the continuing condemnation against men. But in what form will they be cognizant of Him?

You asked the question, go ahead answer it. But hey, if the presence of God will be in Hell with me, then I guess he’ll be suffering right along with me.

 

Pretty cool. I feel like the hero, about to die who says “When I die, I will take as many of them with me as I can.”

 

Does the Bible not make the clear distinction between a level of "belief" and saving faith?

It really doesn’t. I can twist the Bible and say no God’s will supercede’s all. You can negate that back with faith. I can further negate that and say God’s will and faith. You can throw in deeds and add them all up. Your most probably a Calvinist and you will make the argument against a Witness that they have it all wrong. Whatever, if your god is all powerful then the bible can not contain him so you have no reasonable argument that is grounded in fact, or that is testable and observerable.

 

Again, we would say this simple "belief in" is not the issue. This belief in Jesus does not simply concede his existence as a man. A baby cannot place faith in the Son of God. In anticipation of further Qs...

Do you mean continue in the knowledge that God does exist? Yes.

Then what is the issue? To have faith one must believe? What else is there?

Do you mean continue in the knowledge that God does exist? Yes.

No, I mean the Christian. The Christian, judged unfit by God goes to hell for his or her wickedness. (I like the wored wickedness - so wonderfully biblical!) But still continues to believe that Jesus is their savior and loves God but dutifully goes to hell.

 

I am not making an argument based upon knowledge, but on belief. Are you going to tell me that you have the insights in God’s mind? What kind of God are you Paul?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Paul. Thanks for you comments and now I am going to shred them to pieces. J/K. But hang tight.

That was supposed to "shred" something?

That pretty vague D.Paul. Can you qualify what a ”higher degree” means?

Do you ever experience dissatisfaction here? Are you ever weary? Do you ever feel discouraged? Are you exhilarated every waking moment?

 

There will be no dissatisfaction, weariness, discouragement etc.

 

You asked the question, go ahead answer it. But hey, if the presence of God will be in Hell with me, then I guess he’ll be suffering right along with me.

 

The fact that you will aware of His Being and His righteous judgement against you is not a suffering with you or His presence with you.

 

QUOTE(D. Paul @ Oct 7 2005, 10:45 AM)

Does the Bible not make the clear distinction between a level of "belief" and saving faith?

 

 

 

 

 

It really doesn’t

 

It really does. John 6:27-29

 

God’s will supercede’s all.

Do you say it does not?

 

Whatever, if your god is all powerful then the bible can not contain him

And who ever said the Bible "contains" God? You did.

 

Then what is the issue? To have faith one must believe? What else is there?

The issue remains that there is an object to faith - it is not blind - and the belief in that Person as He has been revealed by the Father. There is more to Him than saying we affirm that he is just a guy who lives down the street.

 

No, I mean the Christian. The Christian, judged unfit by God goes to hell for his or her wickedness.

 

This too is your error. The "Christian" by Biblical definition is John 10:1-16. No one else, no matter what moniker they use, are not of His sheep. John 10:24-30. These people thought they were "of God" but v.26 says they are not. None of His sheep will be judged unfit by God and go to hell.

 

Are you going to tell me that you have the insights in God’s mind? What kind of God are you Paul?

 

I'll never undrstand how, when one points out where God Himself has plainly "spoken His mind" that you accuse him of claiming special insight. It's right there for you to read for yourself. That's what the Bible is. God's sufficient revelation.

 

So, no shredding. I gave you plain answers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Do you ever experience dissatisfaction here? Are you ever weary? Do you ever feel discouraged? Are you exhilarated every waking moment?

 

There will be no dissatisfaction, weariness, discouragement etc.

 

Prove it using a source outside of the Bible that is scientific in nature, not religious. That's a pretty fantastic claim, and fantastic claims require evidence.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The "Christian" by Biblical definition is John 10:1-16.

Uh-huh... sheep...

 

Seriously, that definition describes the standard un-questioning idiots who drool their way to church each week...

No one else, no matter what moniker they use, are not of His sheep. John 10:24-30. These people thought they were "of God" but v.26 says they are not. None of His sheep will be judged unfit by God and go to hell.
Got news for you... we're no sheep.

 

You might be happy being a sheep... believing in stuff that goes so far against reality that The Discworld sounds normal by comparison, but we aren't. Unlike you, we won't believe in things that never happened, nor will we believe in things that contradict themselves.

 

If being dumb and gullible is the definition of a Christian, then I'm glad I'm not one.

I'll never undrstand how, when one points out where God Himself has plainly "spoken His mind" that you accuse him of claiming special insight. It's right there for you to read for yourself. That's what the Bible is. God's sufficient revelation.
28,500 seperate denominations of Christianity... 28,500 different ways that God has plainly "spoken his mind"...

 

 

If it's that fucking plain, there would only be ONE!

So, no shredding. I gave you plain answers.
With 28,500 different answers, none of them plain and most of them contradictory, you've given no answers at all...

 

What you have given, is your opinion. Something you've railed against on another thread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kryten, I hope this will help clarify the above issue

 

This has to do with the usage of anthropomorphisms in Language about God, especially in the Bible.

. . .

1. ---- God is an unchanging BEING who exists outside time. God has no length, breadth, weight , color, eyes, hair, nose, or brain or any physical attribute. Basically, God is a SPIRIT as declared in John 4:24. God has no size like "big" or "small".

 

2. --------The Bible frequenly applies human-like terminology (Anthropomorphisms) to speak about God's ACTIVITIES inside the physical world (i.e. the world that is composed of space, time, energy, and so on )..

    Example, Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart, and every other reference  you have cited below, besides dozens that you havent cited.

. . .

I think that the references to God's apparent changeability, His hands, His eyes, His face have to do with His activity or manifestation in a space-time world. But in his essence He is eternal, omniscient and without possibility of change.

Ah, yes. If I just would have remembered that when there is a contradiction in the bible, it must mean that at least part of the apparent contradictory verse was not to be taken literally! Damn- I'd still be a fervent believer if I had just clung to that concept! Good straw-man with the hands and face crap. I know Jesus wasn't a door and I never said he was. I'm talking about real scriptural changes and differences.

So your point is that God is an unchanging BEING, even though he changes his mind and changes his laws and changes his plans and changes his desires. Do you want to dispute any of that?? Go ahead and try.

In your next reply, please tell me which day of the week you set aside for worshipping God. Saturday? Friday? Sunday? If it is not the day God commanded, please justify it with scripture, including book names, chapters and verses. I want to look them up to see if you are correct.

Then tell me what God's attitude and punishment was to the men of the O.T. who had more than one wife and perhaps concubines and handmaidens. Why was it okay back then but not okay in the N.T. times? Go ahead and tackle theses. I'll have more when you're ready. Don't forget to change the subject and call me a sinner running from God. Another good thing to include in your reply would be to talk about the punishments those men got for something else they did. That might help believers think you're winning the battle.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Uh-huh... sheep...

 

Seriously, that definition describes the standard un-questioning idiots who drool their way to church each week... Got news for you... we're no sheep.

 

You might be happy being a sheep... believing in stuff that goes so far against reality that The Discworld sounds normal by comparison, but we aren't. Unlike you, we won't believe in things that never happened, nor will we believe in things that contradict themselves.

 

If being dumb and gullible is the definition of a Christian, then I'm glad I'm not one.28,500 seperate denominations of Christianity... 28,500 different ways that God has plainly "spoken his mind"...

If it's that fucking plain, there would only be ONE!With 28,500 different answers, none of them plain and most of them contradictory, you've given no answers at all...

 

What you have given, is your opinion. Something you've railed against on another thread.

 

And you simply affirm everything the Bible says about you and against you. I've not given you my opinion. You claim to have read all this for yourself. I just pointed things out again. You're the one who has given no answer.

 

And it's true...you're no sheep. Sheep on the right; goats on the left. Matt 25:33 Baaaa

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That was supposed to "shred" something?

++++++

So, no shredding. I gave you plain answers.

Settle down man. I was teasing you. But I see you do not have a shred of humor in you.

 

Do you ever experience dissatisfaction here? Are you ever weary? Do you ever feel discouraged? Are you exhilarated every waking moment?

 

There will be no dissatisfaction, weariness, discouragement etc.

You didn’t answer the question. You dodged it. Please qualify what a greater satisfaction means.

I already know what it feels like to be satisfied and dissatisfied, but what does it mean to be satisfied but only more?

 

Please. If you can not, then concede the point. It’s okay and no big deal.

 

The fact that you will aware of His Being and His righteous judgement against you is not a suffering with you or His presence with you.

Oh well. I guess He and You will be looking up there in Heaven enjoying the barbecue below you then. Fun!

 

The real issue is once again, about belief. If I still believe in God/Jesus etc while enjoying the country club that is Hell, then wouldn’t I still have God’s presence within me and one I would still relish even though I have an eternity to work on my tan? Well? And since having that feeling, this presence is exactly like what Christians report when they pray etc and this is what it will be like in heaven, then what is the difference? I will wait until you can successful demarcate between them. Thanks.

 

It really does. John 6:27-29

Well, I guess I will have to negate you then and sideways mention that this verse really rings of selfishness. Are we not to covet? Ha ha.

 

But anyway, does God elect his people? As a Calvinist you know this as true. So what does it matter if I hunger for the meat of everlasting life?

 

Do you say it does not?

I say nothing of God’s will. I take the arguments and the assumptions about God based upon the knowledge that Christians say they have about him. Be happy, I take you at your word and then I test it from there. If it fails a smell test and is refuted by reason and if a concept is not irreducible, then I disregard it.

 

So, you can answer the question.

And who ever said the Bible "contains" God? You did.

That’s pretty funny really. So the Bible does not contain God. Well you better hope your worshiping the right guy or the Bible is not incomplete.

 

The issue remains that there is an object to faith - it is not blind - and the belief in that Person as He has been revealed by the Father. There is more to Him than saying we affirm that he is just a guy who lives down the street.

I thought God was resting? Why would he need to reveal anything more anyway? Never mind that, just musing.

 

Anyway, I would like to know how you could distinguish between God and the guy down the street. You can’t. But go ahead and try.

 

sheep. John 10:24-30. These people thought they were "of God" but v.26 says they are not. None of His sheep will be judged unfit by God and go to hell.

Really Paul, I can’t believe you are going to try this argument, but you have really no other choice I suppose because the problem that is layed at your door. Well, you guys have been making this argument against each other for centuries. Rome has spoken, and it is so. Augustine I think said that. Understand the significance of that quote and you understand how ridiculous and fallacious the argument you are making.

 

I'll never undrstand how, when one points out where God Himself has plainly "spoken His mind" that you accuse him of claiming special insight. It's right there for you to read for yourself. That's what the Bible is. God's sufficient revelation.

Really? Which God? The madman of the OT, the caretaker of the Synpotics or the anti-reason homophobe of Paul?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There will be no dissatisfaction, weariness, discouragement etc.

 

Ooh. Ooh. And we'll have our own little place. A place just for us. And, tell me about the rabbits, George. I get to tend to the rabbits. I like rabbits, George.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And you simply affirm everything the Bible says about you and against you.

 

Hey crazy-tiger - I didn't know you were in the bible! Nice one, man. :goodjob:

 

And it's true...you're no sheep. Sheep on the right; goats on the left. Matt 25:33 Baaaa

 

Uh oh - Matt25:33! Shit! He's pulled the big guns out on us!

 

How about Matt 7:1-2?

 

"1 Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

 

Uh oh - now you're a goat too!

 

Of course, dig around in scriptures and I'm sure you'll find a justification for condemning us. god knows there's enough contradictory crap in there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And you simply affirm everything the Bible says about you and against you. I've not given you my opinion. You claim to have read all this for yourself. I just pointed things out again. You're the one who has given no answer.

 

And it's true...you're no sheep. Sheep on the right; goats on the left. Matt 25:33 Baaaa

head-up-ass.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To conclude that God does not care about you based on not having your prayers answered is wrong. Remember, he is not your physical daddy who will take you and buy you toys every time you cry...

Try to allign your prayers with His will, maybe he will start answering.

 

So define "allign your prayers with His will, maybe he will start answering."

 

I know of people that prayed for the return of a pet. They got their prayer. God wants to return lost pets. I know of people that prayed for the return of a lost balloon. They got it (although the balloon was in a popped state). God wants to return lost balloons (popped and unusable). I know someone personally who likes strawberries and on her very birthday, with no one else even knowing, her coworker brought her strawberries. God wants to give you strawberries.

 

I never bothered to pray for a balloon or strawberries. I did, however pray fervently for wisdom (apparenlty I missed Paul's denouncement of that). I've prayed for many a lost pet. I prayed fervently that I'd be cured of Tourrette's Syndrome. I prayed fervently, painfully so (mentally and physically I felt like I was being turned inside out), that my faith be preserved.

 

I was going to say that none of my prayers were answered. That my will did not line up with god's will. I can overlook the pet prayer (no matter how horrible it was to see others get that one answered). I can overlook the Tourette's prayer (even though others get 'cured' of things all the time apparently). I can't overlook the preserving my faith prayer. He is the good shepherd afterall and is supposed to leave that flock when one goes astray to return him safely home. The wonderful thing of this story is there is no "maybe" about it. If I go astray he will come but he did not and I can guarantee I won't be returning to the "flock" (and I deliberately blashphemed the old spirit, many times now, to make absolutely sure that there was no doubt about this). I guess god's will does not include me. I did get the wisdom prayer however. I now have the wisdom to know that the whole thing was just a horrible myth and my desire for wisdom produced wisdom in abundance. If this prayer was from "god" then he gave me the wisdom to know he doesn't exist. Impossible but bible god has managed much stranger things. Something "god" was never able to accomplish in 30 years.

 

Oh, but things are cool with you, right? That's what really matters anyway.

 

mwc

 

P.S. Oh yeah. I prayed for happiness too. I got that after I got wisdom. Unfortunately it was taken away when my wife went fundie on me. I don't think she prays for wisdom so I don't think it'll be coming back anytime soon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Isn't it funny that people can claim "we don't know if God exists or not", but in the next sentence "Oh, I know for sure that God exists, and not only that, I know which brand of shoes he wears to Church on Sundays!"

 

Everyone paints a picture of the "perfect God" in their mind, and then they start believing in it, and when they find someone that agree with they little fantasy, they start using them as source for their delusion.

 

No one even knows if Paul was serious when he wrote the epistles. Maybe he was a fraud that tried to con the whole nation back then? So why even trust his words? Or the authors of the gospels? They maybe were paid to do so, by the newly founded Paul's Church Inc.

 

It's all moot, smoke and mirrors. Nothing of faith is real. It's all emotional. It's all sola fide. Logic can't be used to explain the existence of a God that is full of paradoxes. It's a failure from start!

 

For ever paradox we find for God, the apologist finds an illogical excuse to explain the obvious paradox, and use that as their "logic" for that God must exist!!!

 

In essence the apologist claims logic is illogical, and God exists just because he is a paradox and beyond logic.

 

Faith in an illogical God, is illogical from start, and can't be explain or reasoned. It's doomed! (doom doom doom doom :sing: )

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So define "allign your prayers with His will, maybe he will start answering."

Oh man.

 

Such a strange dogma, "align your prayers with his will", and you don't know God's will. So it's doomed. You can't align your prayer with God's will, because he changes his will at will. Even if God knows his will for tomorrow, he will change his will tomorrow on the fly, and not answer your prayer, because now all of a sudden, your prayer was not according to his will. It's just a big game. God is playing X-Box with the universe.

 

     I know of people that prayed for the return of a pet.  They got their prayer.  God wants to return lost pets.  I know of people that prayed for the return of a lost balloon.  They got it (although the balloon was in a popped state).  God wants to return lost balloons (popped and unusable).  I know someone personally who likes strawberries and on her very birthday, with no one else even knowing, her coworker brought her strawberries.  God wants to give you strawberries.

Yup. God shows his mercy and love in the simple, silly, stupid stuff in our daily life. But it's his good will and benevolence to have hundreds of kids die of starvation each day, because the place lacks rains, or it gets to much of rain.

 

     I never bothered to pray for a balloon or strawberries.  I did, however pray fervently for wisdom (apparenlty I missed Paul's denouncement of that).  I've prayed for many a lost pet.  I prayed fervently that I'd be cured of Tourrette's Syndrome.

Then you at least have an excuse to rant and flame people on this site. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And it's true...you're no sheep. Sheep on the right; goats on the left. Matt 25:33 Baaaa

 

This is classic. The gospel in a nutshell: we can't be the in group unless we create an outside group otherwise how will we feel special.

 

 

Thanks D.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Riiiiiiight....sheep.

 

And we all know what happens to sheep don't we. They either get fleeced or eaten.

 

Goat? Naw, pretty sure I'm more of a capebara then anything...

 

Why would someone who believes in predestination debate at all? Really, if we are "born to burn" as it were, what's the point. Some twisted form of mental masturbation perhaps?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why would someone who believes in predestination debate at all?  Really, if we are "born to burn" as it were, what's the point.  Some twisted form of mental masturbation perhaps?

 

Yeah, I never got that, either. Why bother with salvation if your fate is predetermined, anyway? No matter what you do, you're just as likely to go to hell as heaven...

 

And I'm not a sheep, either. I'm a cat.

 

I eat sheep :woohoo:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So like a Christian...thinking being a SHEEP is a good thing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Then you at least have an excuse to rant and flame people on this site. ;)

 

Thanks. I guess I do have a little bitterness to work out still. :)

 

mwc

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And I'm not a sheep, either. I'm a cat.

 

I eat sheep :woohoo:

 

Oh yeah? Well, I'm a mouse, and I eat pussy! :woohoo:

 

:twitch: Waitaminute... :twitch:

 

Wrong thread. Sorry. :ugh:

 

:HaHa:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They are scared to death that we might be decent people, and that we might be right about Christianity being a cult after all.

 

You are decent people and my Catholicism (Christianity) is not a cult. :Wendywhatever:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fweethawt - I think I have already posted a reply to someone regarding prayers.

You have to understand one thing. Just b/c prayers go unanswered, does not mean that God is not out there.

Do you have any idea how old this little piece of apologetic material is? Do you have any idea how UN-biblical your excuse is?

 

:lmao:

 

You can't base your faith and beliefs on JUST YOUR LIFE EXPERIENCES, and how someone never got healed.
If you can't base your faith and beliefs on your life experiences, then what else is left that you can base it on? The bottom line is, your life, and your life experiences is all that you have. Everything else is in the mind.

 

Noone in his/he rright mind will be able to tell you why things went the way they went and how come God never responded to that particular situation.
On the contrary, only a person in his "right mind" can explain it. Wishful thinking is irrelevant.

 

I understand the frustration and anger, and trust me, I have experienced a lot... but that does not change the reality, or makes God non-existent.
Nothing can change reality. It just is. Nothing can make a God nonexistent if it's truly there, just the same as nothing can make a God exist if it doesn't.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.