"i'm So Sad You're Going To Hell"

[MagickMonkey]

I hate that you are going through this. I hope your dad backs off. Religion is certainly divisive. I find it helpful to try to direct my anger towards the christian meme rather than those I care about whose minds are infected with that meme. Of course that's easier said than done. I hope things get better soon.

[marycontrary]

So sorry about your grandmother. We have been through similar stuff with husbands fundy family. It started with my mother-in-law telling me that I am going to hell and bringing her son with me because I'm divorced and married to her son. Then when my father died she told me he was going to hell because he was a mason. When my brother died she asked if he was a good christian to which I responded I didn't know since that was between my brother and god. I swear she has verbal diarrhea. What ever inappropriate thought flies through her head, she feels the need to verbalize it. I might be able to respect her views on hell if she could verbalize some sort of sincere condolences on the loss of a loved one. If she felt that my husband and I were doomed to hell and sincerely showed concern and said she was praying for us, I might feel differently about her. When she says these things she tilts her head high, with a huge smug look on her face like she gets some sort of satisfaction from it. Her actions were the tipping point for me in my conversion to atheism. My husband and I have had very little interaction with his family in 3 years. He has told her why and yet she continues to spew such hateful things. About a year ago my husband spoke with her on the phone. Of course, she blames the whole breakdown of communication on me since she didn't bring her son up this way. She told my husband she wanted to send me some religious propaganda on anger. He told me this and I had to laugh. I am not angry, I'm just done with it and he is free to do as he pleases with his family. I did call her and let her know I wasn't angry. I told her I was weary of being the outsider of the group (they have let me know in no uncertain terms that I am not family). I told her that if she found herself in a bad situation and needed assistance that she could count on me, that I'm not angry and do not hate her. She responded with a statement that basically said she has found herself in a similar spot with her sister. Her sister married a catholic and converted and were married in the catholic church. My mother-in-law spewed her typical your going to hell bit and the sister cut off communication. She told me she had to apologize for her behavior towards her sister. I anxiously awaited her apology to me and it never came. She just said she was glad I wasn't angry. WTF! She's a stubborn old lady. She hasn't had contact with her only grandchild (my daughter) for 3 years due to similar behavior. My husband bought her a mothers day gift and dropped it off on her doorstep because he doesn't want to deal with her. When he came home he was very upset and said he had an anxiety attack going up her steps. His siblings have made it clear they side with their mother and have really made the situation worse. He is in a tough spot. Everyone complains he won't come visit. How could he possibly feel comfortable to visit if they can't set aside to whole religion thing and have a relationship outside of it? Why would he want to visit with people who obviously are very angry with him (us,me, the child we have). Our life has improved tremendously since the blow up. He does love his family though, and even his cousins won't speak to him or our child. That shows us that she has shared all of this with extended family and they too have sided with her. She is in her 70's now. My husband pretty much lives for today and doesn't think much about the future. As for me, I wonder how things will work out when she dies. Will any of us attend her funeral? If any of us do, will we be treated badly? Gotta love this peaceful loving religion huh? If I ever hear the whole your going to hell thing from her again I think I'll respond with a "I'll see you there".

 

Mary

[asanerman]

Your post Brain thrust me back to 2005, as I was going through my Eckhart Tolle phase. I recalled a topic entitled “Carrying the Past.” So I dug around and found where I had taken modified notes. Below is what I found.

 

(Tolle introduced his comments with a story of two Zen monks, I substituted my up dated story.)

 

My brother gave my daughter a bicycle for her fifth birthday. When with great pride he uncovered the new shiny bike my daughter looked into his eyes and said “it looks like a boy’s bike!”

 

That was twenty-eight years ago and I just found out the other day that my brother still resents my now thirty-three year old daughter. He is still carrying that “boyish looking bike” around with him, unable or unwilling to internally let go of that situation.

 

(Modified Tolle)

When memories or thoughts about the past turn into a burden they turn problematic and become a part of our sense of self. Our personality, which is conditioned by the past, then becomes a prison.

 

The story of our lives (i.e. the things we say that tell the story of who we really are) consists not only of mental but also of emotional memory--old emotion that is being revived continuously. As in the case of my brother having carried the burden of his resentment for twenty-eight years by feeding it with his thoughts, most of us carry a large amount of unnecessary baggage both mental and emotional, throughout our lives. We limit our selves through grievances, regret, hostility, guilt. Our emotional thinking becomes who we perceive ourselves to be and so we hang on to the old emotion because it strengthens our identity. (A New Earth pp 39-40)

 

(Personal Reflection)

A vicious self destructive cycle is set into motion and this becomes payment for our decisions. All that we have to offer to those around us is our insentience life saga replete with all our guilt, regret and grievances.

 

I have found that by gaining a different perspective (given its inherent limitation) of a situation some times gives me the needed latitude to gain some semblance of balance and sanity. It also can become the catalysts to healthy action.

 

saner

[EmptySky]

I'm very sorry about your loss.

[Phanta]

Your post Brain thrust me back to 2005, as I was going through my Eckhart Tolle phase. I recalled a topic entitled “Carrying the Past.” So I dug around and found where I had taken modified notes. Below is what I found.

 

Wow.

 

I'm going to read that book.

 

Awesome. Thanks for sharing.

 

Phanta

 

Edit: I just looked the title up on Amazon.com and the #2 book that came up was A New Earth, An Old Deception: Awakening to the Dangers of Eckhart Tolle's #1 Bestseller by a Christian writer who find Tolle's ideas very dangerous.

 

Boy, we live in a strange world.

[The Seeker]

There's a thin line between sincere and thoughtful concern and emotional manipulation. One of the main reasons I haven't told my family that I'm not a Christian anymore is I'm trying to postpone this dynamic of them throwing camouflaged bits of emotional blackmail and eternal warnings at me and having to deal with the fact that I love them and want to remain respectful to them. Fear of you going to hell may very well be an honest concern of your dad, but phrasing it out as "I am sad you are going to hell" and being repetitive about it falls better under the category of manipulation.

[ilovemybrain]

There's a thin line between sincere and thoughtful concern and emotional manipulation. One of the main reasons I haven't told my family that I'm not a Christian anymore is I'm trying to postpone this dynamic of them throwing camouflaged bits of emotional blackmail and eternal warnings at me and having to deal with the fact that I love them and want to remain respectful to them. Fear of you going to hell may very well be an honest concern of your dad, but phrasing it out as "I am sad you are going to hell" and being repetitive about it falls better under the category of manipulation.

 

I think you're absolutely right - it is emotional manipulation, and it's what he's always done. I'm tired of it, and I have a feeling I won't be attending very many family gatherings from now on if I can help it.

 

Thanks everyone else for all the encouragement. It means a lot to me. I haven't heard from my dad since this email exchange the other night, so I'm hoping he won't bring it up again.

[ilovemybrain]

There's a thin line between sincere and thoughtful concern and emotional manipulation. One of the main reasons I haven't told my family that I'm not a Christian anymore is I'm trying to postpone this dynamic of them throwing camouflaged bits of emotional blackmail and eternal warnings at me and having to deal with the fact that I love them and want to remain respectful to them. Fear of you going to hell may very well be an honest concern of your dad, but phrasing it out as "I am sad you are going to hell" and being repetitive about it falls better under the category of manipulation.

 

I think you're absolutely right - it is emotional manipulation, and it's what he's always done. I'm tired of it, and I have a feeling I won't be attending very many family gatherings from now on if I can help it.

 

Thanks everyone else for all the encouragement, too. It means a lot to me. I haven't heard from my dad since this email exchange the other night, so I'm hoping he won't bring it up again.