R. S. Martin Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I'm not sure if this is the place for this "announcement," but I figured people here might be interested to see what is posted. On William Lane Craig's forums for "Reasonable Faith" (I didn't choose the name), a Christian posted that he has evidence for God's existence. I started a thread asking, "Christians, what is your evidence?" It is onto its fourth page. People along the entire spectrum from hard-core atheist to true believer (Christian) participate and I would say it's a reasonably civil discussion. Christians are coming up with some really honest answers. Also some in-depth ID discussion. Here is the beginning. I'm not looking for more participants unless someone is really eager to join. I think they have answered all the questions they can. Just figured we got some good ideas that people here might like to see and/or discuss. Just one thing: Don't get hung up with the silly little post on the first page about the miracles of Jesus being "compelling evidence." Read on to Page 4 where I take it apart with Brian G and take it from there. There's other discussions that start here and there and continue for pages. That's because there's two or three atheists in there with their own pet Christians in tow. Or however one explains this sort of thing. The way I do is just pick a character or discussion and follow it; I never read all the posts of such mega-threads even if I started them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest I Love Dog Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Interesting discussion! Your arguments were solid and logical. Obviously, there is no proof of the existence of the Christian god. Christians depend on faith. One quote from the Christian: "I also think a child can have a basic understanding of Christianity. Many children do. They understand that there is a God who loves them and sent his son to die for their sins. It's true that this basic understanding leaves many things unanswered. But a child's understanding of evolution will leave many things unanswered as well." They don't understand that there's a god, they believe it because they trust the person who tells them. They also believe that Santa Claus loves them, or punishes them if they are naughty. They believe in the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny. That doesn't make any of them real, even a god, just because they believe it. Children are information sponges in their younger years, it should be illegal to teach them nonsense. We can teach them about evolution because we have plenty of evidence up to a high level that it is correct science. There is no such evidence for the Christian god, not even a wisp of evidence. As far as understanding Christianity itself, I still don't understand how the god sending his son down to Earth inside of a normal human being just to be executed saves the World from sin. It didn't work anyway, however it was supposed to work! If there was any truth in Christianity and its god then surely after 2000 years a greater percentage of the World's population would believe in it? 25% of the World's population believing in something does not make for a good track record. If the Christian god really existed then I'm sure that it would have surely been able to tell the whole World(not just Judea) that he/she/it existed. Just a couple of my ideas/thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted January 26, 2011 Author Share Posted January 26, 2011 Thanks for sharing your ideas, ILoveDog. It's always good to find others who agree with me, but even if I were the only person in the world who had my experience that still would not change my experience of the world. I was a bit hesitant to respond before I was sure what was going on over at those forums. I could not access them for about 24 hours. I got no "banned" message; just a "Firefox cannot find _____ server." I didn't know whether that is the way things are if one is banned by IP address. But when I saw you posting during the time I couldn't access the forums, along with a quote from the Christian post, it seemed like evidence that the forums weren't down. Maybe I really was banned. Maybe they didn't like that I was posting evidence left and right that the Christian god didn't exist. But in the past they used to warn me when I was out of line with my posting. I thought I had reformed completely. Except I'm still very clear with my position that god does not exist. I had thought that was okay, according to the owner's ideas of how things should be run. But maybe the rules changed without notice. Finally, this afternoon, I went over to the public library to see if I could access the forums from there. If it was an IP thing, I should be able to get in with another computer. If the forums really were down, I couldn't. Then I ran up against something that said only registered members could get into a certain place, so I made up another account on the spot. Hadn't meant to do that. Later, that new account didn't work but my rsmartin account worked. I went home and it's working again. It's still spotty but mostly it's working. I don't know what happened but I can post again. The thing is, if they banned me for no other reason than that I provided solid evidence against their arguments, I figured that showed the paucity of their position. The only people with no enemies are those who kill them all, right? I've now put in a plea that if the mods have a problem with my posts to please inform me and give me a chance to improve. And also to inform me if the rules have changed. So anyway, todate they do not see their position so hopeless as to have to annihilate the opposition. That says something for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted January 28, 2011 Author Share Posted January 28, 2011 One by one we debate the Christians around their convoluted circles until they demonstrate that they will only repeat themselves or lie their way out. What amazes me most completely is that one Christian actually admitted that his church affiliation determines factual reality. Obviously, he didn't put it in those words and he ridiculed me for interpreting it that way. Here's the original quote: As for his mother, she bodily ascended to heaven hence we'd never find her either. It does not bode well. That's not something I believe. I am not Roman Catholic. FROM Post 83 Snakey is the atheist and Bill is the Christian. I took it from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted January 28, 2011 Author Share Posted January 28, 2011 Addendum to above post: "His mother" refers to Jesus' mother, the Virgin Mary, whom some Catholic pope or another says was assumed bodily into heaven. Forgive me if I've got the wording somewhat incorrect but like Snakey says, she was supposedly taken to heaven so there's no evidence available for Christians to prove that Jesus or his mother ever existed. Whereas the body of George Washington, with whom Bill Clute wishes to compare evidences for Jesus at the moment, can be found. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
par4dcourse Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Game, set, match to Ruby. Thanks for an interesting half-hour's reading. Primary xian lesson learned: " Hahahahahhahahahahahhahahahaha" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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