We'll Meet Again................(i'm Singing)

[Margee]

Quick question: Does it say ANYWHERE in the bible that it promises that we will all meet again?

 

The uncles, aunts, sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, friends, our children................................?

 

Where did we get this idea?

[♦ Fuego ♦]

It's on page 323, but only the really spiritual can see it... :-)

 

Ok, perhaps it comes from The Revelation 20:11 where everyone gets resurrected, then on into chapter 21 where all the True Believers™ get their tears wiped away and live happily ever after. Perhaps the idea of seeing them right after death comes from the story of Lazarus the beggar going to Abraham after dying.

[walker]

Quick question: Does it say ANYWHERE in the bible that it promises that we will all meet again?

 

The uncles, aunts, sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, friends, our children................................?

 

Where did we get this idea?

I don't know of a place in the Bible where it promises that.

 

Where did people get this idea? I think they want it to be true.

[florduh]

I guess if all the saints (believers/saved) end up in Heaven (a single location) it can be assumed they will all be together with each other in he presence of the Lord. That's why some Christians fret about not seeing their unsaved kin on the other side. Of course the fact that their mother/son/uncle is burning in Hell apparently won't put a dent in their joy once the believer reaches Heaven. Here on Earth it seems to drive them crazy.

[pratt]

not exactly remember where it was BUT there was a question posed onto jesus on "whose wife is it anyway after passing the 7 brothers...."

 

New sexless bodies with no sexual/earthly relationships?

[BrotherJosh]

I guess if all the saints (believers/saved) end up in Heaven (a single location) it can be assumed they will all be together with each other in he presence of the Lord. That's why some Christians fret about not seeing their unsaved kin on the other side. Of course the fact that their mother/son/uncle is burning in Hell apparently won't put a dent in their joy once the believer reaches Heaven. Here on Earth it seems to drive them crazy.

 

You know that's something I often wondered about, the concept of hell in relation to eternal bliss in heaven...I forget the origins of this thought process so I am paraphrasing here...imagine there is a perfect and happy world. This world is the absolute utopia for all of it's citizens, no need is unmet, every desire is sated. People live happy and productive lives. However, every year a random child is chosen who will then be tortured in unending agony for that year, culminating in their sacrifice at the end of the year. The problem is, is that this world is only provided for, if this child is tortured for that year. Would you want to live in that society? I know this doesn't fit exactly with many of the "concepts" of hell, but it is rather interesting. How could I be happily living in heaven, and yet know that certain people, friends even family members were enduring eternal torture?

[Margee]

I remember walking in to a 'world renowned' spiritualist, (he had never met me in my life) and within an hour he said my dead sister's name, and he pegged my mom and dad with stuff that blew my mind. I had been to many of these people who made some good guesses, but this was quite amazing.

 

When he told me my sister's name and said she was just fine - I really believed him at the time and I found a bit of relief thinking that she really did come to him in the spirit. When he talked about my mom - I thought I'd fall off the chair, he 'pegged her' so good.

 

But did they come to him or was that a 100% good guess of getting their names and personalities right off the bat? Where did she come from in his mind? What atmosphere? Why could he 'feel and see' her, and I couldn't? Even right now - I find myself to be asking my girlfriend who died last week to 'give me a sign'. Nothing so far.

 

Have any of you had a good experience with these people who claim they see the dead? I still wonder in the bible where it does say that we'll all meet again.

[LivingLife]

Hey Margee

 

Sorry to hear about your girlfriend.

 

As for your your signs, I once went through a process of inner healing and I tought the guy ministering to me was HS led as he pegged much but always with "did this happen to you" type of opener.

 

Of course wanting to be pure for biblegawd, I opened up and in a way was still therapeutic.

 

One of the incidents, was I was raped (well almost) by our neighbors son (didn't get his dick up my ass but tried very hard) I was about 9 or 10 at the time and he was about 17. It never caused me any anxiety but this memory was allegedly preventing me from experiencing gawd more fully so I was led to believe.

 

I was convinced that this was real. Fact is at the time, I was down in the dumps and was not experiencing the holy spook anointing like the rest of the congregation was, and I was in the P&W team to boot. I accepted my healing b/c I had made this real in my mind as an issue that needed to be dealt with. Prior to that, it never bothered me and hardly ever entered my thought processes. I didn't turn out gay and had a few other "gay moments" with straight male friends but this one was the closest I got to getting screwed.

 

There were other issues like astral travel that I toyed with, falling from heights and all this was cast out of me and of course it was all very real b/c I made it so.

 

How these fortune tellers are able to be so "accurate" is a bit disconcerting but I think they play you w/o you being aware. Probably just good guesses based on what info he/she was able to get out of you. I do not think it would be too hard for folk to draw conclusions about one's parents based on the possibility that one sort of admits one is a total screw up.

 

Now if this person was able to tell your fortune with your simply sitting there with your mouth shut, maybe then there would be some credence to this being "real". Con men use the technique pretty well with leading questions and the biggest con men of all happen to be pastors, they are trained in what type of questions to ask it however is called counseling.

 

Even I have developed the skill to suss people out and draw conclusions that are pretty damn close. No majik spook involved as I still have that ability post my deconversion. I think we call it intuition.

[SilentLoner]

Its an appealing idea and the religious leaders know it. Who doesn't want to see people they loved again after death?

 

Lets not forget how the catholic church just up and abandoned the concept of limbo to appeal more to developing countried with high infant mortality rates.

[dB-Paradox]

I remember walking in to a 'world renowned' spiritualist, (he had never met me in my life) and within an hour he said my dead sister's name, and he pegged my mom and dad with stuff that blew my mind. I had been to many of these people who made some good guesses, but this was quite amazing.

 

When he told me my sister's name and said she was just fine - I really believed him at the time and I found a bit of relief thinking that she really did come to him in the spirit. When he talked about my mom - I thought I'd fall off the chair, he 'pegged her' so good.

 

But did they come to him or was that a 100% good guess of getting their names and personalities right off the bat? Where did she come from in his mind? What atmosphere? Why could he 'feel and see' her, and I couldn't? Even right now - I find myself to be asking my girlfriend who died last week to 'give me a sign'. Nothing so far.

 

Have any of you had a good experience with these people who claim they see the dead? I still wonder in the bible where it does say that we'll all meet again.

The best way to meet a spiritualist or psychic is with complete skepticism. I was thinking about the movie Enemy Of The State with Will Smith when you talked about how this person knew the name of your deceased sister. In the Will Smith film, he gets fooled into believing he's met a man named Brill. But when the real Brill confronts him, Smith's character says, "He said he was Brill" to which Brill asks, "did he say it, or did you say it and he picked up on it?" Sometimes I think we give away more information than we realize, and cunning people use this to their advantage.

 

As for where Christians get the idea that we will all be together in heaven...Luke 16:22 is a good reference. "The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side." This seems to imply that the beggar went to be with Abraham in heaven. Based on this, I believe Christians infer that they will be with their deceased loved ones again.

 

The story of the rich man and Lazarus is interesting, because even though Abraham and the rich man are talking and can see each other, Abraham says that there is a "great chasm" between them so that no one from hell can get into heaven and no one from heaven can get to hell. Furthermore, the rich man asks that Lazarus be sent back from the dead to warn his brothers of hell, to which Abraham answers, "They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them." and then goes on to say, "If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead." But the rich man asked the wrong request. He should have asked that he himself be sent back to warn his brothers. I bet they'd be convinced then! The director of the story should have added that in! It would have made the antagonist seem a little less ruthless!

[Kyle]

It's their way of coping with the finality of death. However, since my deconversion, I feel better about death. Rather than looking forward to a grand meet up in the sky, I'm able to reflect on the time I had with that person and truly mourn without false hope. Loss is sad, but it is just the way nature works.

[stryper]

while I can't answer the sepcific question Margee, I can say that based upon the teaching I follow, reincarnation happens. So you will see people again in other lives.

 

Inbetween your sould goes to another plane to plan for the next life and review the one just past.

 

So, yes you will. So mourn the phsyical loss, but know it is not the end.

[Margee]

while I can't answer the sepcific question Margee, I can say that based upon the teaching I follow, reincarnation happens. So you will see people again in other lives.

 

Inbetween your sould goes to another plane to plan for the next life and review the one just past.

 

So, yes you will. So mourn the phsyical loss, but know it is not the end.

 

I love this belief stryper, cause I find it comforting. Thanks

[mwc]

I remember walking in to a 'world renowned' spiritualist[...]within an hour[...]getting their names and personalities right off the bat?

"Within an hour" is not "right off the bat." Right off the bat would have been the ability to give you all this information as the first words out of their mouth as you came in the door. I can say that what you experienced, even though I wasn't there, was not anything like that. You've already admitted this much and if I were a "psychic" I would use this information to my advantage (read: to take advantage of people like yourself).

 

Hot reading. Cold reading.

 

mwc

[Denise]

Quick question: Does it say ANYWHERE in the bible that it promises that we will all meet again?

 

The uncles, aunts, sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, friends, our children................................?

 

Where did we get this idea?

 

Here is what I cam across, hope it helps anyways:

ONE YAHOO ANSWER There are no verses that will tell you that. If you have believed and trusted that the Lord Jesus Christ died for your sins then when you died you will get a heavenly body that never will die. All your memory of what happen to you on earth will be take away. How could you be happy in heaven for eternity if some of your love one were cast into hell? You will be known in heaven by the rewards you won why on earth. How many crown you won by winning souls to Christ not by the people you knew. 1 Corinthians 13: 12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. Philippians 3: 21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

 

Isaiah 26:14 They are dead, they shall not live; they are deceased, they shall not rise: therefore hast thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish.

 

Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

 

Ecclesiastes 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.

 

Psalms 115:17 The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence.

 

1 Corinthians 2:9, heaven will consist of: "Things which eye has not seen and ear has not heard, and which have not entered the heart of man, all that God has prepared for those who love Him."

 

That last one is pretty darn clear of NOT meeting people we knew on earth in the afterlife in the christian world.

[walker]

You know that's something I often wondered about, the concept of hell in relation to eternal bliss in heaven...I forget the origins of this thought process so I am paraphrasing here...imagine there is a perfect and happy world. This world is the absolute utopia for all of it's citizens, no need is unmet, every desire is sated. People live happy and productive lives. However, every year a random child is chosen who will then be tortured in unending agony for that year, culminating in their sacrifice at the end of the year. The problem is, is that this world is only provided for, if this child is tortured for that year. Would you want to live in that society? I know this doesn't fit exactly with many of the "concepts" of hell, but it is rather interesting. How could I be happily living in heaven, and yet know that certain people, friends even family members were enduring eternal torture?

I recently read a concept of hell described as a place where the doors are locked on the inside. I thought that was an interesting idea.

 

You indicate that there are many concepts of hell, but you seem to like the "eternal torture" one! Why?

[BrotherJosh]

I recently read a concept of hell described as a place where the doors are locked on the inside. I thought that was an interesting idea.

 

You indicate that there are many concepts of hell, but you seem to like the "eternal torture" one! Why?

 

I know, I heard that quite some time ago, a rather silly concept but whatever. The eternal torture one is the mainstream view of most Christianity, it's not whether or not I like it, but the fact is most Christians (not yourself from what I've read) believe in an eternal hell, based on Gehenna, Matt 8:12, 22:13 and various other Biblical writings.

 

The main point I am trying to make is that of how most Christians view Heaven in relation to their beliefs of Hell.

 

 

 

[Margee]

Quick question: Does it say ANYWHERE in the bible that it promises that we will all meet again?

 

The uncles, aunts, sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, friends, our children................................?

 

Where did we get this idea?

 

Here is what I cam across, hope it helps anyways:

ONE YAHOO ANSWER There are no verses that will tell you that. If you have believed and trusted that the Lord Jesus Christ died for your sins then when you died you will get a heavenly body that never will die. All your memory of what happen to you on earth will be take away. How could you be happy in heaven for eternity if some of your love one were cast into hell? You will be known in heaven by the rewards you won why on earth. How many crown you won by winning souls to Christ not by the people you knew. 1 Corinthians 13: 12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. Philippians 3: 21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

 

Isaiah 26:14 They are dead, they shall not live; they are deceased, they shall not rise: therefore hast thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish.

 

Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

 

Ecclesiastes 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.

 

Psalms 115:17 The dead praise not the LORD, neither any that go down into silence.

 

1 Corinthians 2:9, heaven will consist of: "Things which eye has not seen and ear has not heard, and which have not entered the heart of man, all that God has prepared for those who love Him."

 

That last one is pretty darn clear of NOT meeting people we knew on earth in the afterlife in the christian world.

 

Wow Denise - All these years in Christianity, I just assumed that I was going to see all my loved ones again?

 

I can always remember people of the church using the scripture :''Every knee shaw bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is lord''. Which meant that MAYBE - they would all get one last chance to accept Jesus as their savior and be 'saved' and go to heaven. So these family members (not my Dad - he was an atheist) might get one last chance at heaven. Even my Dad! Wow - now I need to grieve this fact that I had them on earth and that's it!

 

I really believed that I would be together again with my dad, mom and sister again someday. Bummer!

[walker]

I can always remember people of the church using the scripture :''Every knee shaw bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is lord''. Which meant that MAYBE - they would all get one last chance to accept Jesus as their savior and be 'saved' and go to heaven. So these family members (not my Dad - he was an atheist) might get one last chance at heaven. Even my Dad! Wow - now I need to grieve this fact that I had them on earth and that's it!

 

I really believed that I would be together again with my dad, mom and sister again someday. Bummer!

In the first testament phrases like “he died and was gathered to his people” are used. Here are a few examples:

 

Gen. 35:29 - Isaac’s death

Gen. 49:29, 33 - Jacob’s death

Num. 27:13 - Moses’ (and Aaron‘s) death

 

Revelation gives an image of those who chose relationship with God living together -

 

Rev. 21:3 - “ … God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.”

 

But there are also those who chose separation from God - they have a separate place.

 

As far as “every knee shall bow …” - I believe everyone will meet God face-to-face when they die, and they will realize who He is and what is True. I believe people can choose to be with Him at that moment. However, I also believe people can realize who He is (and bend their knee) yet still choose to be separated from Him.

 

"Saved" just means being in relationship with God. It starts on earth and continues to the next life. It's not an entrance ticket to heaven one gets here and then produces at the Pearly Gates.

[walker]

I recently read a concept of hell described as a place where the doors are locked on the inside. I thought that was an interesting idea.

 

You indicate that there are many concepts of hell, but you seem to like the "eternal torture" one! Why?

I know, I heard that quite some time ago, a rather silly concept but whatever. The eternal torture one is the mainstream view of most Christianity, it's not whether or not I like it, but the fact is most Christians (not yourself from what I've read) believe in an eternal hell, based on Gehenna, Matt 8:12, 22:13 and various other Biblical writings.

 

The main point I am trying to make is that of how most Christians view Heaven in relation to their beliefs of Hell.

I think the “locked doors” concept is filled with meaning.

 

I do believe in an “eternal hell” - an eternal place of separation … I just don’t believe the “fiery torture” thing. I believe such concrete language gives us an image of “hell” but it wouldn’t be faithful to Jewish literature to give these passages a literal meaning.

[anzgoatee]

I recently read a concept of hell described as a place where the doors are locked on the inside. I thought that was an interesting idea.

 

You indicate that there are many concepts of hell, but you seem to like the "eternal torture" one! Why?

I know, I heard that quite some time ago, a rather silly concept but whatever. The eternal torture one is the mainstream view of most Christianity, it's not whether or not I like it, but the fact is most Christians (not yourself from what I've read) believe in an eternal hell, based on Gehenna, Matt 8:12, 22:13 and various other Biblical writings.

 

The main point I am trying to make is that of how most Christians view Heaven in relation to their beliefs of Hell.

I think the “locked doors” concept is filled with meaning.

 

I do believe in an “eternal hell” - an eternal place of separation … I just don’t believe the “fiery torture” thing. I believe such concrete language gives us an image of “hell” but it wouldn’t be faithful to Jewish literature to give these passages a literal meaning.

 

So as a Christian, you don't follow Jesus and believe what he says? Or you put your own spin on what he said.?

 

Jesus Christ, the Son of God, described HELL as:

 

The place after death where MOST will end up (Mt. 7:13,14

A place of outer darkness where there will be weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth (Mt. 24:51; 25:30).

A place to be avoided even if it means losing the physical members of your body (Mt. 18:8,9).

Prepared for the devil and his angels (Mt. 25:41 cf. Rev. 20:10).

A place where the fire is not quenched (Mk. 9:43-48).

A place of regret, torment in fire and no water (Lk. 16:19-31).

 

The LAKE OF FIRE (second death) is:

 

A fiery lake of burning sulfur (Rev. 21:8).

Where death and Hades will be thrown (Rev. 20:14).

Where the smoke of those tormented there goes up forever and they find no rest (Rev. 14:11).

[walker]

I think the “locked doors” concept is filled with meaning.

 

I do believe in an “eternal hell” - an eternal place of separation … I just don’t believe the “fiery torture” thing. I believe such concrete language gives us an image of “hell” but it wouldn’t be faithful to Jewish literature to give these passages a literal meaning.

 

So as a Christian, you don't follow Jesus and believe what he says? Or you put your own spin on what he said.?

 

Jesus Christ, the Son of God, described HELL as:

 

The place after death where MOST will end up (Mt. 7:13,14

A place of outer darkness where there will be weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth (Mt. 24:51; 25:30).

A place to be avoided even if it means losing the physical members of your body (Mt. 18:8,9).

Prepared for the devil and his angels (Mt. 25:41 cf. Rev. 20:10).

A place where the fire is not quenched (Mk. 9:43-48).

A place of regret, torment in fire and no water (Lk. 16:19-31).

 

The LAKE OF FIRE (second death) is:

 

A fiery lake of burning sulfur (Rev. 21:8).

Where death and Hades will be thrown (Rev. 20:14).

Where the smoke of those tormented there goes up forever and they find no rest (Rev. 14:11).

I agree with everything you cited. Absolutely. But I don't agree that the images are meant to be understood literally. Jesus used human language and concepts to give us an idea of things beyond our known world.

[anzgoatee]

I agree with everything you cited. Absolutely. But I don't agree that the images are meant to be understood literally. Jesus used human language and concepts to give us an idea of things beyond our known world.

 

Howver you look at it, it's scary language to use. O.k., so people 2000 years ago were much simpler and didn't understand things as we do today, but even so, when you are considering a god of love, there doesn't appear to be much love handed out with the words that were used.

 

Why scare people? A god of love should act like a god of love, no? Or have the words re-written for people of today in nice words.

 

It was pretty much the Romans who designed Christianity, and I agree the original Jewish Gehenna was much more acceptable, but not scary enough for the Romans, masters of fear tactics!

 

Just a thought!

[BrotherJosh]

I think the “locked doors” concept is filled with meaning.

 

I do believe in an “eternal hell” - an eternal place of separation … I just don’t believe the “fiery torture” thing. I believe such concrete language gives us an image of “hell” but it wouldn’t be faithful to Jewish literature to give these passages a literal meaning.

 

Oh I can see the "meaning" in the phrase, I just don't put much by it.

 

Well, you can believe what you want to believe. How would it be faithful to Jewish literature? There are many concepts of Hell in Judaism either based off Gehenna, Daniel 12, and even souls rising above a Purgatory to the Olam Habah. People have nit picked what they want to believe out of religious texts for quite some time. Whether or not there is fiery torture is beside the point, because it is still based on a system of divine punishment that is saying finite deeds equal infinite punishment.

[par4dcourse]

I agree with everything you cited. Absolutely. But I don't agree that the images are meant to be understood literally. Jesus used human language and concepts to give us an idea of things beyond our known world.

 

Howver you look at it, it's scary language to use. O.k., so people 2000 years ago were much simpler and didn't understand things as we do today, but even so, when you are considering a god of love, there doesn't appear to be much love handed out with the words that were used.

 

Why scare people? A god of love should act like a god of love, no? Or have the words re-written for people of today in nice words.

 

It was pretty much the Romans who designed Christianity, and I agree the original Jewish Gehenna was much more acceptable, but not scary enough for the Romans, masters of fear tactics!

 

Just a thought!

 

Punishment without chance of rehabilitation is just revenge. Not a very god-like character trait.