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Emptyness And Desire To Go Back Is Sneeking Up On A Recent De-convert..


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Lately, I've been feeling as if I made a wrong choice, when I decided to stop trying to get in touch with God after 6 months of trying.

At the moment, I feel he's probably there, but then my mind reminds me that I tried so hard and got so far, and that in the end it didn't even matter..

Should I acknowledge these feelings and follow them, trying to find God again, or should I ignore them?

 

Trying to look at it objectively, I feel it'd be unfair for me to ignore it, as that would be like a Christian shouting "LALALALALALALALALA!" upon facing doubt.

 

Is there anything to lose by giving God a shot again? To me, it's really a win-win situation. If I become convinced by it again, it's not like I'd be going into some abusive fear-dominated fundie-fest, as that is pretty much non-existant here in Norway.

I feel as if I'm approaching the fence again (my testimony-post was called "sitting on the fence, leaning to one side"), and it sucks having insecurity about stuff as important as this..

 

-Daniel

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if you feel like he might be there, go with that.

 

But that said, reason should trump feelings, if you find there is some evidential reason to go in that direction, great. But don't just do it because you don't feel good, it will leave you up for grabs.

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it's not like I'd be going into some abusive fear-dominated fundie-fest

 

That's the kind of cult group I grew up in. It's because of their abuse that I finally found my way out of christianity. If I had just been a casual believer, not taking anything literally, then I doubt I ever would have left. My belief in Jesus would likely have been so airy-fairy having no literal scriptural promises to solidly base my beliefs on, and therefore no way to 'test' whether there was sufficient evidence for the God I believed in. I could've just floated through life believing in "a God".

 

 

But because I tried for years to take the bible and Jesus literally and pray for the sick, "pray without ceasing", fast, and believe that "whatever things I asked for would be given to me", then I was setting myself up for eventual departure because those promises simply would never come to pass in a tangible, beyond-all-doubt manner. And if the bible's promises simply weren't coming to pass (along with all the odd contradictions), why should I believe the God of the bible? If Jesus or God's words were modified and corrupted by men, then that's not my fault. That's God's fault if he can't provide us with an accurate record of how to serve him.

 

At this stage I think there's circumstantal evidence for a God, just not the bible God.

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Hi Daniel! This is the dilemma I've been in for the last 10 years. In and out - in and out - in and out. I've been doing this sincerely for 30 years. The first 10 years I tried not to question anything. It was like a big, happy family and the music and the services - I lived for it. It was my life for a long, long time and I kept waiting for god to make me into the perfect Christian and have this perfect, normal life. I longed for a personal relationship with the lord. NEVER HAPPENED! Oh, Don't get me wrong - I thought for sure I felt it a few times.....................

 

Too many yucky things kept happening in my life!

 

I'm out right now and almost totally convinced that 'bible god' does not exist. BUT -if I was to be really honest - I keep searching and hoping - why not - what have I got to lose?

 

Maybe I'll cross the line from agnostic to atheism some day. Right now - I'm just trying to be gentle on myself.

 

As I've said on many posts - If there is a god out there somewhere - he knows my heart.................................................:shrug:

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To hold a belief in god - any god - one must rely solely upon faith.

 

"Faith is a cop-out. If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits."

- Dan Barker

 

A lie that makes us feel good is still a lie.

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Jesus Christ, God, Yaweh, whatever you want to call it, even Moses exists only in mythology. If any of these people were real, there would be zillions of writings existing in other cultures concerning these great wonders and the people that performed them. We don't have that. What we have are copies of a copy. No one has been able to identify who wrote what books. There are a lot of claims but no way to nail down authorship. There are no originals. Even the books of the OT were not written until the Jews began to appear out of Babylonia about 500 years before the common era. The Jews did not exist until this time. They brought a Babylonian mystery religion with them. There never was an Exodus. No parting of the Red Sea, no manna, no ten commandments.

 

Biblically, the OT prophet Jeremiah claimed the law was never given to Moses and that the scribes lied about what they wrote. He claimed that truth had perished from the land. The Bible is full of tales, many of which refer to mythological animals such as unicornes, cockatrices, fauns, satyrs, and talking asses and talking snakes, just to name a few. Over the years, Christians have rewritten the bible and given modern names to the mythological animals claiming these were the animals all along. The stories were written to mention these mythological animals because those who wrote the stories thought these animals were real. They existed in his mythology which means no god inspired or dictated such stories. The Christians base their religion on the idea that it is a descendant of Judaism. It is not. It is a bastardization of the Jewish religion. It caused the Islam religion to grow and flourish as the result of the crusades in which Christians indiscriminately murdered Christian Arabs too. Christians claimed the crusades were necessary because of the Muslim threat. The world is not a safer place because of Christianity. Christianity has too much blood on its hands for me to sing its praises.

 

What are you going to base your belief in now that you know the truth? You cannot take the blue pill once you take the red one.

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i understand what you are going through. i am stil lforced to go to church so the emotional controlling propoganda is thrown at me consistantly but i hold firm to atheism.

 

the sub concious brain (the largest part of the thought procces) can be influenced by anything invoulontarily no matter how hard to try to stop it with the concious mind. and note i said influence not control. though with enough influence control can ensue such as in children born into christanity or islam or what ever. only through extreme realization can you escape somthing so tramatising and in the procces for a time you gain a anti christian zeal but as the christian zeal wears off so does the atheist zeal. you and me will probly be tempted the rest of our life by christianity but there must be strong ideological and theoretical thought before re entering christianity. just look at history look at what the chatholic church has done in its past and look what god him self has ordered. then go back look at the reason why you left christianity in the first place. was it control? was it the blood? was it the arrogance? for me it was a combonation of all 3. i my self was beinging to be tempted back into christianity i even let it go as far as to start feeling conviction but i put a stop to it becosue 2 things 1. m preacher recently got back from senegal west africa where he went o na mission trip, he said that when the musslims got up at 5 AM to pray evry morning he called it the msot demonic thing he had ever heard ( what a load of shit i bet he hasnt heard any one pray other then other christians) and then he started singing amazing grace infront of his host while he was doing the musslim chant. my whole church laughed and agreed wit hthis but what they fail to see is their going agianst the bibles command to love and respect. what if this guy was about to convert to christianity? but it wouldent becosue a christian made fun of him. christianity is a failed religion, it is one of the greatest lies in the history of man. when you are inside christianity you only see the wonders but that is the greatness of the church blindness and arogance. and second i was able to rember why i left christianity in the first place. i am not trying to keep you from going back to the faith but rember you will probly be tormented beteewn the manifestation of god by the subconcious brain and your logical thinking it might be misreable and also you would be giving up your freedom mentaly as a person being re traped in the faith.

 

good luck nad the best of wishes i hope you make the right choice for you but i like what HeriticZero said. "you cannot take the blue pill once you have taken the red one."

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As you can see, there are varying opinions on your question. Ultimately, of course, it is your life and your decision. Personally, if I had any significant remaining doubts about whether bible god exists, I would not ignore those doubts. Rather, I would examine them carefully, think them through, and try my best to come to the truth. Therefore, my advice is to do what it takes for you to know and accept the truth. Ignoring doubts or making excuses for them does not help you deal with the issues you are facing. Go at them headon, but make sure that what you are after is the TRUTH and accept nothing short of that.

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I think it's important to honor that part of you that doubts. Give it some time and attention. If you decide to let go of God again, treat that part of you gently.

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Lately, I've been feeling as if I made a wrong choice,<SNIP>

At the moment, I feel he's probably there,...

 

Maybe you should examine why you feel like this. Perhaps there is an underlying feeling of wanting it to be true or wanting to feel like you used to about the whole issue. IOW, you miss the feeling of certainty. The Bible answered the big questions, and all you had to do was accept them.

 

The belief system was in charge, and now you may feel lost without it. I say that because Christianity is not simply about God, but mostly about controlling beliefs concerned with living this life. The God of Christianity is a superhuman parent.

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Hi, Daniel. I think you should always acknowledge your feelings and doubts. No, there's nothing to lose by giving God another chance. Here's how my thinking has evolved. I've come to separate the "Bible-God" idea from whatever god may or may not be. I view the Bible as a book that was written by various people who were doing the same thing as you and I are doing - trying to understand and relate to the mystery of god. Unfortunately, "the church" has made these writings into the "Word of God". Intellectually, I consider myself an agnostic, but emotionally, I do have a god concept of what I think god might be, provided god exists. My viewpoints of god are more valid to me than what the Bible writers viewpoints are - what I'm saying is that it works for me. What works for me likely won't work for you. The knowledge is within you - it's a real job sometimes to get it out. I take it your quote was from Linkin Park's "In the End" - I love that song!

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The way I look at it is we don't know so it's not worth worrying about. I don't even know what a god is supposed to be, much less if one exists or not.

 

How important is it to make a decision about something you don't even know about? It doesn't even make sense to try.

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To Kaiser and Discern,

While I understand the emotional uproar one feels inside when Christians do something bad, I never really understood how one could criticize Christianity as a belief-system for acts done that weren't in line with the Christian dogma.

I don't see it like "this man is christian and did something bad, so christians are bad", but rather "this man did something bad, he's a christian but in this case, that can't possibly be the reason for his non-christian act"

 

When I'm talking about giving God another shot, I'm not talking about giving christianity as I've experienced it another shot.

I'm talking about giving God the benefit of the doubt, if what I thought was christianity, really wasn't, and I threw the baby out with the bathwater.

 

 

 

 

@Eugene39: Yeah, I'm still a Linkin Park fan, actually. I love their new album. Almost Radiohead-esque. Their genres are all over the place, and they don't stick to what people think they should sound like. It makes for some great music! So far away from their teenage-angst beginnings:P It'd be a shame if 30+ year old men sang about that sort of stuff anyway :grin:

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Deal with your emptiness how you will, its your life. Me personally I can never go back, if I ever did I would be plagued with why if there is some powerful god that this god does not do anything to fix all the problems we have. Among other questions.

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I'm talking about giving God the benefit of the doubt, if what I thought was christianity, really wasn't, and I threw the baby out with the bathwater.

As Foxy said, I don't know what your goal is. It seems you want there to be a god, but one that suits you. You'll just have to make him up, for there is no baby in that bath water.

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I can see how there's confusion. My point is this:

I gradually left Christianity because of a doubt inside that wouldn't let go and kept growing. Something was wrong.

This ended up with me eventually de-converting. Now, that same feeling I had as a christian, is upon me again..

What I'm wondering is if I feel this way because I left God and not just organized Christianity as I knew it. I'm feeling that there is an answer out there that involves God/the supernatural, but that it isn't Christianity. I scared to go there, because I don't, like Dr. House here said, want a God that I've tailored to myself only to later realize that I've been emotionally caught up in something that was untrue, yet again..

Looking at what I just wrote, I think I AM getting emotionally caught up, but this time in the insecurity.

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Hmmm... Last night I peeked and saw Mom putting my presents under the Christmas tree. Dad put some toys in the stocking I had faithfully hung up on the mantle. I wish I hadn't seen that - this can only mean there is no Santa Claus after all. Depressing.

 

Wait! Santa is seen in all the stores in December. Santas stand on street corners and are in the TV commercials. There must really be a Santa Claus but he's just not exactly the way my parents had described him to me. Maybe he doesn't really come down chimneys and perhaps reindeer don't really fly, but that doesn't mean there is no Santa at all! I shall devote the rest of my life searching for the real Santa, for what a sad world for the children if he really didn't exist. He must exist; I just haven't found him yet.

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Hmmm... Last night I peeked and saw Mom putting my presents under the Christmas tree. Dad put some toys in the stocking I had faithfully hung up on the mantle. I wish I hadn't seen that - this can only mean there is no Santa Claus after all. Depressing.

 

Wait! Santa is seen in all the stores in December. Santas stand on street corners and are in the TV commercials. There must really be a Santa Claus but he's just not exactly the way my parents had described him to me. Maybe he doesn't really come down chimneys and perhaps reindeer don't really fly, but that doesn't mean there is no Santa at all! I shall devote the rest of my life searching for the real Santa, for what a sad world for the children if he really didn't exist. He must exist; I just haven't found him yet.

 

Yeah, pretty much. Add to that, the only reason you search for Santa in the first place is because someone told you stories about him. Were it not for that, you wouldn't even wonder.

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What the hell guys!? Santa is real. End of story. Reindeer exist, right? Christmas presents exist. And no one would have invented Christmas with the tree and presents and such unless it was real. Come one. No one would make up a story like that. There must be some truth to it. And all the eyewitness accounts!? Or all the stories about him. Sheesh you guys... spreading lies about Santa like that. :vent:

 

Oh, and I forgot, the minimal facts. At least 70% of scholars believe the facts about Santa Claus are accurate, for instance that he comes every Christmas and gives presents, or that he flies a sled pulled by reindeer, so it's proven. Haberchristmas got his PhD proving this.

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Daniel,

 

Doubts will always be there no matter which side of the fence you're on. Go back to Christianity, and eventually you'll begin to doubt whether God even exists, as you already had. Stay an apostate from the faith and you'll doubt whether or not you're making the wisest choice. And with the strict doctrines of the Christian faith, you can't be both. So, you're forced to choose. This is possibly where the doubt comes from in the first place! Isn't religion such a wonderful thing!

 

By the way, your name...it's also mine. "God is my judge" or more specifically, "El is my judge". It's something that I always felt proud of as a Christian. I still like my name, but not as much for its meaning any more. And I don't know if this will help, but in thinking about the god I used to worship, I had to wonder....why is this omnipotent being having such a hard time grabbing my attention? Why isn't he using his supernatural powers to reveal himself to me? Perhaps he's not as omnipotent as I once thought...or not even there at all!

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Bet'cha can't! Oh, you might sit in a pew and smile, but once you've seen the myth for what it is, there's no going back. The brain is like that. It'll keep sayin' "what a load this is."

 

Give it a try, can't hurt, but we'll see you back here in a a few.

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