Why Are You Christians So Insincere With Your Hell Beliefs?

[Thumbelina]

God answers us when we come to Him.

 

You mean "when we CALL Him". Dial "Et cum spiritu tuo". That's, E C S 22 O, and call collect. If the Father answers, ask for Jesus.

 

edit: Only Catholics will get the reference to Dominus Vobiscum.

 

 

 

Nah dude, I said what I meant and I meant what I said. God takes the INITIATIVE ( See Rev 3:20 ) and He answers us when we choose to go to Him.

[Thumbelina]

Muslims, like Centauri, believe they can be saved by works,

Being saved by works is what the Bible teaches.

 

Nope, the apostate church tried the penance thing and we all know how that turned out. That teaching turns people into slaves.

 

I follow biblical exegesis while you (seem to) and other skeptics want personal eisegesis.

 

That's a real knee slapper.

Is your nose growing longer???

It should be projecting about three feet from your face after this whopper.

 

Darlin' (beloved), I see you're getting even more sassy around the holidays LOL. Now Centauri, you are usually so R2D2-ish that I would love to see you doing a "real knee slapper"

 

Liars will be in the lake of fire and I don't intend to be there, my dear.

[Thumbelina]

If there is anyone that is actually interested in why I cannot answer these questions:

 

 

God will "create circumstances that will show the unbeliever that he would like them to come to him" regardless of whether or not someone else prays for that individual.

True or False?

God will not refrain from creating "circumstances that will show the unbeliever that he would like them to come to him" simply because someone else refrains from praying for him.

True or False?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

with true or false answers, I shall give my reasons.

 

The first question is a loaded question in that it is stated in a way as to tell the believer

"Aha, you do not need to pray and evangelize then!"

The bible says differently --> Ezekiel 33:1-6 ; vs 6 has more cross references to support evangelism.

 

The second question is another loaded question with the intent to "show" that God is a respecter of persons.

 

God is NOT a respecter of persons. He just won't save a person against their will.

 

Haha. As another pointed out, these are *not* "loaded" questions in the way you want to claim they're loaded. The statements are either true or false. Your reluctance to answer the questions does demonstrate how unfounded your position is, though.

 

I did answer the questions based on what the bible says, it's just not in the way you want them to be answered. Your word is above scripture but for me scripture is above man's opinions.

They are loaded questions with the goal of demonizing God.

The answer to your questions is: It depends.

"Therefore faith prays in such a manner that it commits everything to the gracious will of God; it lets [God] determine whether it is conducive to his honor and to our benefit."

Martin Luther, in a sermon on Matthew 8:1-13

 

I did say in my previous posts that God gives everyone a MEASURE of faith, they are without excuse. If that person CHOOSES not to respond to that little bit of faith, they are NOT resisting the devil, then God may leave them be, to a certain extent i.e. God sometimes practices tough love to self-sufficient people. He needs to let them see a NEED for Him. Alas, some people are just bent on being disobedient to God and they will never acknowledge Him as sovereign..

 

IF Abraham did not pray for Lot then Lot and his daughters would have perished with the rest of the depraved people of Sodom and Gomorrah.

 

Moses interceded for his rebellious brethren and therefore saved them. God was also testing Moses, sort of showing off Moses' good character to Angels and to men as it were. Moses reflected God's character in showing that mercy triumphs over justice; the people DESERVED to be killed but God and Moses wanted mercy for them.

 

Here's a summary of some of the reasons I gave for God intervening or not intervening in certain instances in my posts to you.

 

God intervenes because someone is praying for an individual thereby restricting the devils' activities in that person's life or it may be that person doing their own sinful thing but God can get their attention through another's prayer.

 

God intervenes because He knows the precise moment that a person's heart is open so He intervenes SEEMINGLY (believers are always praying for the world at large) without intercessory prayer. Prayer is key, the bible says so.

 

The devils may be extremely interested and diligent in taking down certain faithful individuals but PRAYER counteracts their activities.

 

A person may be BENT on not obeying God (eg. Pharaoh, the poster boy for atheism) and God may leave them alone but God allowed them to exist to compare and contrast their unholy character to His Holy one. God may have wanted to teach salvific lessons to His children. God invited them to come to know Him but they refused and kept refusing so god will NOT force Himself on them.

 

Ultimately, humans have freedom of choice to follow God or not. We are under probation and for most of us (some people already committed the unpardonable sin or grieved away the HS) the only thing we have is the dash between our birth day and the day of our death.

 

In keeping with Christianity teaching me about not being judgmental, poor Cits mentioned that He did not get good answers to his questions in the past and I suppose Cits can be quite weary of Christians and their doctrines so I can understand where he is coming from at least.

 

 

Cits said: Haha. No, Thumby, you to *NOT* know where I'm coming from.

Oh, but I do John 12:32 says: "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

 

 

Cits, I have noticed you since I've joined this site and based on my observations I think you misunderstand God's character which is why you were no longer drawn to Him. I don't think you apostatized because you were rebellious, I think you genuinely misunderstand the gospel.

 

 

Cits said: By the way, phrasing your assessment as though I "did not get good answers" is a death-blow to Christianity, since the answers I got were *Christian* answers. Pretty much all the thoughtless nonsense you post are exactly the kinds of things I was fed by Christians, so if those answers are not good, then your posts are also not good.

 

Christianity will never die but atheism would.

Christian answers do not necessarily mean biblical answers. Eg. If a certain Christian church takes Gen 38:9 out of context in order to forbid birth control but the MOTIVE behind misinterpreting the text is a proverbial revenge of the cradles. The Christian sect wants political as well as religious control of the people. What does the bible say about that?

Gen.38:9 has to do with protecting the lineage of the Messiah and not about forbidding birth control. Jesus says "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's." therefore Christians ought not to force their beliefs on anyone. Forced faith is false faith and Jesus allows freedom of choice.

Christian teachings are not to be checked by other Christian teachings but by what the bible says and if their teaching matches the Word.

 

 

Cits said: But that's enough for now. You still didn't answer the true or false questions above, so I probably shouldn't have bothered responding at all. Of course, I really didn't expect you to answer them, since your severely flawed perspective will be revealed as fallacious if you answer them. Perhaps later I'll go back and take a look again at the two you did answer. For now, take care....

 

 

Sorry Cits, I cannot go against the bible and my conscience and respond to the answers the way you want me to answer them. I see God's love, mercy and JUSTICE in the biblical narratives.

[centauri]

Muslims, like Centauri, believe they can be saved by works,

Being saved by works is what the Bible teaches.

 

Nope, the apostate church tried the penance thing and we all know how that turned out. That teaching turns people into slaves.

But you're the apostate.

You completely ignore both the Old and New Testaments regarding the need for works in order to be saved.

In the Old Testament, that's clearly taught in Ezek 18:20-27.

In the New Testament, belief, confession of belief, repentance, baptism, some works of charity, and maintaining belief are required for salvation.

That's what the Bible teaches, so don't try to claim that it doesn't exist or was invented by the church.

 

I follow biblical exegesis while you (seem to) and other skeptics want personal eisegesis.

 

centauri:

That's a real knee slapper.

Is your nose growing longer???

It should be projecting about three feet from your face after this whopper.

 

Thumbelina:

Darlin' (beloved), I see you're getting even more sassy around the holidays LOL. Now Centauri, you are usually so R2D2-ish that I would love to see you doing a "real knee slapper"

 

Liars will be in the lake of fire and I don't intend to be there, my dear.

It's too late, you're already treading lava.

You keep denying the Bible, while trying to maintain this facade about following "biblical exegesis".

[centauri]

Gen.38:9 has to do with protecting the lineage of the Messiah and not about forbidding birth control.

What lineage would that be?

Specifically, what are the scriptural requirements concerning the lineage of an expected king?

[mymistake]

I did answer the questions based on what the bible says, it's just not in the way you want them to be answered. Your word is above scripture but for me scripture is above man's opinions.

They are loaded questions with the goal of demonizing God.

 

Are you trying to sound ignorant? They are loaded questions because they assume God exists. Prove that God exists. You cannot do that so God isn't anything. God isn't good. God isn't bad. God is a myth.

 

Any question that assumes God exists is a loaded question but not for the reason you are protesting. Now either prove God exists or quit complaining about something you do yourself. Your position is a complete self-contradiction.

[NotBlinded]

 

 

 

Thumb, you sure have the "law" memorized. Nice and shinny cup on the outside.

[NotBlinded]

This is the question I also posted on Yahoo:

 

I've noticed an interesting trend among the Christian people. According to 99% of the Evangelical Christians hell is a very real place of torment and everlasting pain awaits everyone who doesn't accept Jesus.

 

At the same time Christians aren't doing everything to protect people around them from hell... This is quite disturbing. If they sincerely believe in Hell, they should make EVERYTHING possible every single person they know be aware that Hell exists and accept Jesus as their Savior.

 

Yet, most Christians seem indifferent towards the fact that the world around them is dying, that every single minute many people on Earth die and many of them die without being Christians... Most Christians go to the cafes, meet with their friends, laugh and do nothing so more people can be saved.

To address the op, it's like someone once said, "If people actually believed in hell, they'd be screaming with terror in the streets frantically trying to get loved ones to listen.". Paraphrase...

[centauri]

Moses interceded for his rebellious brethren and therefore saved them. God was also testing Moses, sort of showing off Moses' good character to Angels and to men as it were. Moses reflected God's character in showing that mercy triumphs over justice; the people DESERVED to be killed but God and Moses wanted mercy for them.

Moses talked God out of his plans because God realized that it would be a public relations nightmare to kill people after they were rescued from Egypt.

Moses also reminded God of his promise to Abraham.

 

Exo 32:11-14 (NLT)

But Moses tried to pacify the Lord his God. “O Lord!” he said. “Why are you so angry with your own people whom you brought from the land of Egypt with such great power and such a strong hand?

Why let the Egyptians say, ‘Their God rescued them with the evil intention of slaughtering them in the mountains and wiping them from the face of the earth’? Turn away from your fierce anger. Change your mind about this terrible disaster you have threatened against your people!

Remember your servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.You bound yourself with an oath to them, saying, ‘I will make your descendants as numerous as the stars of heaven. And I will give them all of this land that I have promised to your descendants, and they will possess it forever.’”

So the Lord changed his mind about the terrible disaster he had threatened to bring on his people.

 

It still didn't stop 3,000 people from being killed.

 

Exo 32:27-28 (NLT)

Moses told them, “This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: Each of you, take your swords and go back and forth from one end of the camp to the other. Kill everyone—even your brothers, friends, and neighbors.”

The Levites obeyed Moses’ command, and about 3,000 people died that day.

 

A person may be BENT on not obeying God (eg. Pharaoh, the poster boy for atheism) and God may leave them alone but God allowed them to exist to compare and contrast their unholy character to His Holy one. God may have wanted to teach salvific lessons to His children. God invited them to come to know Him but they refused and kept refusing so god will NOT force Himself on them.

Pharaoh wasn't left alone. God manipulated Pharaoh to make sure that he wouldn't obey.

This was made certain right from the beginning of God's instructions to Moses.

 

Exo 4:21

And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

 

The King of Heshbon got the same treatment.

[OnceConvinced]

 

 

At the same time Christians aren't doing everything to protect people around them from hell... This is quite disturbing. If they sincerely believe in Hell, they should make EVERYTHING possible every single person they know be aware that Hell exists and accept Jesus as their Savior.

 

 

I kind of disagree. I would see the opposite. If hell is real then Christians should never even be talking about Jesus at all. They should be avoiding preaching or witnessing because if you reject Christ you go to hell. Better that every one die ignorant, because then according to most Christians you won't go to hell!

 

No matter what way you look at it, Christians clearly don't really seriously believe the bible or the teachings their churches make. Either that or they just don't have Jesus's love or the holy spirit in them... which of course would mean they weren't real Christians at all!

[OnceConvinced]

Santa is the word Satan transposed and he believes in rewards through works.All religions believe in salvation through works but bible based Christianity.

 

And did you know that "God" transposed is "Dog" and that "Evangelist" is very close to "Evil Angel" transposed?

 

I guess we should start calling God Dog.

[★ Citsonga ★]

Your word is above scripture but for me scripture is above man's opinions.

 

"Scripture" IS man's opinions.

 

They are loaded questions with the goal of demonizing God.

 

Wrong. They are intended to show the error of your thinking.

 

Cits, I have noticed you since I've joined this site and based on my observations I think you misunderstand God's character which is why you were no longer drawn to Him. I don't think you apostatized because you were rebellious, I think you genuinely misunderstand the gospel.

 

I believed pretty much the same stuff you tout here, so if I "genuinely misunderstood" the gospel, then you do too.

 

Sorry, Thumby, but it's ridiculous trying to reason with such an unreasonable person as you. As long as you demonize those of us who don't agree with you and make excuses, there's no hope for you. I really am growing tired of your utter nonsense. Enjoy your delusion.....

[mymistake]

Muslims, like Centauri, believe they can be saved by works,

 

 

Could you please not spread misinformation about other people. Thanks a bunch. You actually made me waste the time to check out your claim.

[Thumbelina]

If hell is real then Christians should never even be talking about Jesus at all. They should be avoiding preaching or witnessing because if you reject Christ you go to hell. Better that every one die ignorant, because then according to most Christians you won't go to hell!

 

 

And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? 1 Peter 4:18

http://bible.cc/1_peter/4-18.htm

 

 

Where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? - What hope is there of their salvation? The meaning is, that they would certainly perish; and the doctrine in the passage is, that the fact that the righteous are saved with so much difficulty is proof that the wicked will not be saved at all. This follows, because:

(a) there is the same difficulty in their salvation which there was in the salvation of those who became righteous; the same difficulty arising from the love of sin, the hardness of the heart, and the arts and power of the adversary.

( No one can be saved without effort, and in fact the righteous are saved only by constant and strenuous effort on their part.

But the wicked make no effort for their own salvation. They make use of no means for it; they put forth no exertions to obtain it; they do not make it a part of their plan of life. How, then, can they be saved?

 

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 2 Corinthians 5:10

 

 

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Rom 1: 19,20

[Jessie]

Christianity will never die but atheism would.

 

Christianity already is dying... it is a slow, tedious death, and we won't live to see its final moments, but it is dying. The United States is farther behind than Europe in letting go of this toxic belief system but we'll catch up eventually. I intend to do all in my power to help this decline. People deserve to be free, and they deserve to know when someone is lying to them.

[Thumbelina]

This is the question I also posted on Yahoo:

 

I've noticed an interesting trend among the Christian people. According to 99% of the Evangelical Christians hell is a very real place of torment and everlasting pain awaits everyone who doesn't accept Jesus.

 

At the same time Christians aren't doing everything to protect people around them from hell... This is quite disturbing. If they sincerely believe in Hell, they should make EVERYTHING possible every single person they know be aware that Hell exists and accept Jesus as their Savior.

 

Yet, most Christians seem indifferent towards the fact that the world around them is dying, that every single minute many people on Earth die and many of them die without being Christians... Most Christians go to the cafes, meet with their friends, laugh and do nothing so more people can be saved.

 

This is a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. You tell skeptics about the good news and they complain and say "don't, don't". When they aren't being preached to, they complain and say we don't care Fickle humans.

 

 

 

*Rambling Post*

 

The OP clearly wants people to care about his eternal soul. I have seen SEVERAL people on this website expressing similar sentiments to the OP.

 

 

Is my posting here a H.U.F.WOT.

A Hopeless, Useless, Futile, Waste of Time?

 

I don't know but I believe the bible and I believe that God wants His gospel message to be told. I certainly am learning about people and myself by posting here. I must admit this site is better than the other sites for unbelievers that I have seen out there. There are some nice people on this website too.

 

When Christians discuss the bible it may be seen as nagging by some or Christians may be seen as being trouble-makers ( 1 Kings 18:17 ) by others. Christians ought to expect to get some heat when they take a stand for Jesus ( John 15:18-21 ); my wimpy, shy self learned that a while back when I was going through a spiritual revival. Satan was mad because I was getting closer and closer to God so he sent some trouble my way and wimpy me started crying and complaining and right at the time I was discouraged, I felt impressed by God to watch a program on the DVR, I did not recall what it was about but as I listened the host said that Christians are in a war and they are soldiers and you do not hear a soldier whining and saying "Why are they shooting at meee?!!!!" A soldier EXPECTS to be shot at! Well, I felt better and stronger and was glad that God was encouraging me. I had a lot of instances with God coming to my rescue just when I needed Him. I even had several instances when He made me watch a recording on the DVR when I did not know what the message was but I needed to hear the message at that precise moment.

 

How does a Christian know when to back off from a fickle mob that's shouting "Crucify, crucify!"? Sometimes it's plain ol' common sense, sometimes it's that still small voice saying "leave it alone", sometimes the Christian may ignore that still small voice and the mob may rend them but praise God, Jesus is the resurrection and the life and He can resurrect a Christian

 

I also mentioned in a # of posts that I was and can be a judgmental type of person but Christianity has been teaching me that that is not good/sinful to do. Only God can search the minds and hearts of individuals ( Revelation 2:23 ). The bible teaches not to judge/condemn others (Luke 6:37 ). N.B. It does not mean to ignore atheistic shenanigans or that a Christian completely turns a blind eye to others' faults. It teaches to look beyond people's faults and to see their need.

 

Since I've been here, I have been surprised to see certain encounters between Christians and former Christians, Christians were accusing former Christians of not being true Christians and I was like "Why are they doing that? They do not know these people's history." I knew/know that Christianity teaches people to "judge nothing before the time", God gives people chances in order to repent and God will bring everything to light in the judgment ( 1 Corinthians 4:5 )Therefore condemning others and being judgmental is wrong.

 

Unfortunately, a lot of Christians, myself included, can and do fall into the sin of being judgmental.

 

A lot of people here are weary with Christians and Christianity but I refuse to believe that anyone here committed the unpardonable sin ( Hebrews 6:4-8 ; Matthew 12:31 ). Heck, people on this website do not even understand what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit or the unpardonable sin is --> Blasphemy Against The Holy Spirit.. I have spoken to Christians who do not even know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit or the unpardonable sin is. It is so easy to understand if one permits the bible to expound itself.

I was also happy to see that there are SOME people who do not mind debating the bible.

 

I have learned that a Christian is not responsible for a person accepting the gospel Matthew 24:14 but it will be beautiful if people respond to the gospel though Romans 10:15 ; James 5:19, 20 I also know and believe that faith should not be forced.

[agnosticator]

Is my posting here a H.U.F.WOT.

A Hopeless, Useless, Futile, Waste of Time?

 

Now you're catching on...

[bornagainathiest]

Thumbelina wrote...

Is my posting here a H.U.F.WOT.

A Hopeless, Useless, Futile, Waste of Time?

 

Not just A HUFWOT, Thumbelina.

Not just one.

Nope, in fact there are at least three (3) HUFWOT's in play here.

 

1.

Thumbelina believes that Christianity is right/true/real and therefore, anything else isn't. Bible-based Christianity is the most accurate description of reality there is, therefore it should be used at all times as a measure of what's right/true/real and what isn't. Since (by definition) anything that isn't Christianity isn't right/true/real, anyone who isn't a "True" Christian (insert her definition of what "True" is, here) cannot be right, cannot see the truth and cannot see reality as it really is. So long as Thumbelina holds to this, she automatically devalues any other p.o.v. other than her own.

 

So, what would be the point of entering into any kind of dialog with someone who can never see anything right, true or real in anything you say? Doing that would be a hopeless, useless and futile waste of time.

 

2.

Thumbelina begins all of her interactions with people from the following starting points.

A. An extremely negative view of human nature, as described and informed by the Bible.

B. An automatic position of distrust and mistrust, as a result of A.

 

So, what would be the point of entering into any kind of dialog with someone who doesn't trust you but instead, trusts the words of an ancient book? Doing that would be a hopeless, useless and futile waste of time.

 

3.

Ex-christians are people who have made the conscious decision to reject God, Jesus and the Bible.

 

So, what would be the point in them entering into any kind of dialog with someone who persists in trying to force them to go back to these things? Doing that would be a hopeless, useless and futile waste of time.

 

Any one of these three HUFWOT's is enough reason to give up on her, but when they're constantly acting in parallel, without any hope of change....

 

Draw your own conclusions, friends.

 

BAA.

[Gallifrey]

I may have missed this in the discussion, but isn't there the raw biological reasoning? Human evolution provided our best survival mechanism - our intelligence COMBINED with a very strong need for social bonds/groups. From early man's small groups to clans, etc., we as a species are wired to focus on our immediate groups. This is not to say we cannot think beyond this and for even a brief moment feel the realization that we are all connected/part of the same species, and our sympathy/empathy finds awareness in our minds and sometimes actions. This does take effort though to maintain as our wiring is still for the more immediate members of our group/clan/family/friends. I think this even explains the verse in the bible where Jesus says that even the "wicked" know how to love their own (or something close to that).

[Thumbelina]

Is my posting here a H.U.F.WOT.

A Hopeless, Useless, Futile, Waste of Time?

 

Now you're catching on...

 

 

Not really, my dear, a girl can HOPE, can't she? *rhetorical question* cuz you (you're) bad.

[agnosticator]

Is my posting here a H.U.F.WOT.

A Hopeless, Useless, Futile, Waste of Time?

 

Now you're catching on...

 

 

Not really, my dear, a girl can HOPE, can't she? *rhetorical question* cuz you (you're) bad.

 

Magic words^tm around here will get your mouth washed out with soap, my dear...

[OnceConvinced]

Christianity will never die but atheism would.

 

Christianity already is dying... it is a slow, tedious death, and we won't live to see its final moments, but it is dying. The United States is farther behind than Europe in letting go of this toxic belief system but we'll catch up eventually. I intend to do all in my power to help this decline. People deserve to be free, and they deserve to know when someone is lying to them.

 

Oh yes, Christianity is definitely dying. People just need to look outside of their own little corner of the world. Living in New Zealand I can see that it's becoming more and more atheist all the time and from what I understand its the case with many other countries. As people are more educated Christianity will continue to dwindle as will other similar religions.

[centauri]

Christianity will never die but atheism would.

But that doesn't say anything about Christianity never dying.

Rom 14:11

For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

 

The God of mainstream Christianity is not Yahweh or Jehovah, and that's the deity this verse refers to.

The God of mainstream Christianity is a three headed hybrid where Christians declare Jesus as God.

 

Isa 42:8

I am Jehovah, that is my name; and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.

 

God doesn't give his glory to others, and that includes Jesus.

 

In context, the original quote that Paul lifted declares that Jehovah is a singular being, there are no others, and there are no other saviors.

There is none else.

 

Isa 45:21-23

Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

 

Paul then pushes Jehovah aside and inserts Jesus into the quotation.

Philip 2:10

That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

 

I seriously doubt if that type of revisionist theology is pleasing to the God of the Old Testament.

Christians that endorse this type of thing have a false sense of security.

[bornagainathiest]

A lot of people here are weary with Christians and Christianity but I refuse to believe that anyone here committed the unpardonable sin ( Hebrews 6:4-8 ; Matthew 12:31 ). Heck, people on this website do not even understand what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit or the unpardonable sin is --> Blasphemy Against The Holy Spirit.. I have spoken to Christians who do not even know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit or the unpardonable sin is. It is so easy to understand if one permits the bible to expound itself.

 

Oh vey! Jospeh Heller would be proud of this one!

 

The Ex-Christians in this forum cannot be real Ex-Christians because they haven't committed the unpardonable sin.

Only Thumbelina has the proper and Biblically-sound definition of what the unpardonable sin actually is.

Since we don't agree with her definitions, we therefore can't have committed that sin.

Therefore, we all still ripe for salvation.

 

Catch-22 strikes again!

 

By making the conscious and deliberate decision to REFUSE TO BELIEVE what we are saying about rejecting God, Thumbelina is doing the following.

 

1.

She is saying that we are either liars or we are mistaken or both.

 

2.

God will accept our freely-made choices - but she won't!

 

3.

It's what she wants that important. What we want with our lives MUST play second fiddle to what she wants for us. For example...

"Careful there, Par, depression is the really dark side of anger and I don't want you to go there. I want you to be happy!"

Thus speaks a true fanatic. YOU WILL BE HAPPY - BECAUSE I WANT IT!

 

4.

It doesn't matter if God is a respecter of persons or not - Thumbelina certainly isn't!

 

5.

Even if the Bible says that we all have free will, she REFUSES to accept this when it comes to our rejection of God. This makes her not only disobedient to God, but also a hypocrite and an idolater. She is placing her own selfish will above that of God.

 

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

To Citsonga:

 

You still want to try and get a simple Yes or No from Thumbelina?

 

If so, why not ask her this?

 

"Do you accept that I'm an Ex-Christian who's freely chosen to fully and finally reject Jesus - Yes or No?"

 

I wonder if she'll dodge that one too?

 

Thanks,

 

BAA.

[Thumbelina]

Christianity will never die but atheism would.

But that doesn't say anything about Christianity never dying.

Rom 14:11

For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

 

The God of mainstream Christianity is not Yahweh or Jehovah, and that's the deity this verse refers to.

<snip>

 

 

 

I get to be scissor hands this time

 

Hey you Centauri, you're being R2D2-ish again, both Jews and non conformist Christians believe in a Creator God. Atheists do not believe in any God. That text says that EVERY knee will bow to God and that includes the knees of atheists, ergo atheism will be obsolete.