Asimov Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 Moral edification. jf 102813[/snapback] What do you find preferable, the Communist Manifesto? jk 102830[/snapback] Well, its sort of a toss-up between that, and Mein Kampf. 102843[/snapback] Those damn jews.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 Those damn jews.... OH NO YOU DIDN'T!! You DID NOT just type those three words out on this forum... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 I'm surprised LM hasn't run in here and shit all over the place for my comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 I'm surprised LM hasn't run in here and shit all over the place for my comment. I don't think she's a Jew anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerise Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 What do you find preferable, the Communist Manifesto? jk Are those our only two options? Either we learn morality from the bible or we learn it from Marx? Methinks I smell a cow chip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerise Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 Those damn jews.... Asshattery for asshattery's sake shall be saved for the Lion's Den. So sayeth the first book of Cerise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dianka Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 I would have liked a mytholical and cultural value option. 102194[/snapback] I agree. If th Bible was held to the same regard as say, the Odessey, I would find it to be a good read. I voted for burn it, but of course that would re-establish the void that inspired the Bible in the first place. A better position would be to keep it as a reminder that, yeah been there, and we all know where it ends. I am re-thinking my vote. I think a better solution would be to uncover as much history as we can and teach new generations the the destructive nature of the Bible. I am personally in awe of the Bible. No other book has ever inspired so much hatred and violence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 ...............But now I have voted, and I took the first option. It does not mean that I am ready to burn my bible, but I does mean that it is hard for me to see any intellectual value in it. 102252[/snapback] Nah. I wouldn't burn it. I've still got six, plus a Septuagint and Apocrypha. Good resource material when someone tries to pull a fast one on me. And THAT is the lone "value" that I see in keeping a bible around. I mean, let's face facts: Like it or not, hate it or love it, The Holy Bible® has been THE most influential book of all time. Whole nations have been influenced and mangled predicated upon its misinterpretations. This fact alone BEGS for it to be studied up close and personal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essence Posted November 20, 2005 Share Posted November 20, 2005 I needed an "other" choice, but chose, none of the above.. Some parts of it are as valuable as Aesop's Fables..emphasis on "Fables".. There are two things I take from it and I suppose you could say "live by".. "Treat others as you would be treated." and.. the loving your neighbor thing.. although on the last one, its not always the case. I try to start out that way, that is, form no negative opinion until experience tells me I should. The rest of it is good to induce overwhelming feelings of guilt.. Consider that commandments were confined to tribal sons in Jacob. Thus, "neighbor" was defining a brethren tribe. "Love thy neighbor as thyself" defined the purpose of "thou shalt not kill". For it you study the purposed commandments, you will see that they were given to the sons of Jacob only in teaching loyalty to themsleves as an independent nation called Israel. Remember? The God of Israel commanded his children to kill and slaughter all other people in land of Canaan "without pity and sparing none". All people in Canaan land who had breath within them was to be destroyed, including animals. When Gawd told the Israelites to love themselves, the message was not meant for anyone else. Christians haven't yet "come to the knowledge" of the "truth" of the story "as it is written". Christians still believe the God of Israel is their Gawd also. God always hated the "uncircumcised" people as an "abomination" unto him. In other words, people who were not sons of Jacob in the land of Canaan had their own god and refused to take on the ritual of circumcision, and probably because it hurt and was very painful process. What do you think about this interpretation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 I voted that there are good concepts to be found if you sift through the shit, but that response doesn't go nearly far enough. The Babble is mostly shit, and there are very, very little gems to be found there, and nothing really original. The best thing off the top of my head is Jesus' command to "do unto others as you'd have done unto yourself" - the "Golden Rule" basically. Of course, that too doesn't go far enough either, for what if others do badly unto you and goodly treatment of them will only encourage more abuse? That's off the topic, of course, but an example of the little niceities to be found in the Babble. Skeptic's Annotated Babble does a good job of compiling the good bits about the Babble whilst it skewers the majority of the sick book. There are little good things to be found there, but nothing you can't find in other religions or even discern yourself. After all, all religions are man-made, and anything good to be found in them first originated in a human's brain. Though I voted that there are good concepts to be found, in the end, the Babble is best as a heat source, or a backup supply of Charmin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 The question is interesting and we should credit the author for sparking interesting discussion. However... I too wanted another option. I was thinking of "value" and what it contributes to me or the world so I took the best option and said it was worth calories to heat my home. I however considered that the bible actually had a negative value in that I would pay to have it erradicated from the solar system provided we could trash the Koran and all companion texts. I also considered that it had an intellectual value as data (not as literature but rather evidence) which I felt was not represented. It occured to me that it serves the same purpose as the poor saps in the ditch on the first snow storm of the year. Mongo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted November 29, 2006 Share Posted November 29, 2006 Shame I can't change my vote. Nowadays, being further removed from Xianity than ever, I consider the Babble to be complete and irredeemable trash. It's fit only for the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
currentchristian Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 None of these choices suits me perfectly, either. The Bible is a philosophical anthology that contains many pearls, as I see it. It is a record of the Hebrew/Israelite/Jewish/Christian search for an understanding of the Source (i.e., what is usually called "God" in English). It is a trustworthy record, in my view, of the life of Jesus. It is inspired by spiritual energy, but sometimes faulty and in some cases terribly outdated. It should not be worshipped or idolized. But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. -CC in MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. Telling me what I am to think is for Fanatics and Nazis - not to mention Xians Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
currentchristian Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. Telling me what I am to think is for Fanatics and Nazis - not to mention Xians My view ("seems to me," I wrote) was not directed at anyone, but toward the first option in the poll: "The true value is the few calories of heat you can get, if you burn it." This may have been somewhat tongue in cheek, but it seems to me that burning books is never a good idea no matter how insidious the book might be. No personal offense meant to anyone. -CC in MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 At the Dollar General, the xian bible is worth $5.99. There are two things I take from it and I suppose you could say "live by".. "Treat others as you would be treated." and.. the loving your neighbor thing.. Both of these aphorisms predate the bible, so go ahead and toss it out. Hello everyone, Well I guess now we have a more balanced vote. Glad to see that was an option here. Why is it so crazy for someone to believe that the Bible is the infallabile word of the only true God? Why was it crazy for David to spend thousands of years seeking the Blue Fairy, in A. I. Artificial Intelligence? If there were an Only True God, he would have no need of Infallable [sic] Words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artur Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jun Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 I hear it's sturdy enough to use as a prop under wobbly furniture, and as a door stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 I chose the first option, not because I advocate the burning of books, but because I find that the Wholly Babble's pages have great value as rolling papers. If there were a couple of other categories, I'd say the book has value as a study in how the mythology of a particular people can develop over the course of a millenium or two. It deserves a place on my shelf right next to Homer's Iliad, the Bhagavhad-Gita, and The Poems of the Elder Edda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 And when they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord carried Philip away, and the eunuch saw him no more, and went on his way rejoicing. But Philip found himself at Azotus, and as he passed through he preached the gospel to all the towns until he came to Caesarea. And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you. And He led them out as far as (AZ)Bethany, and He lifted up His hands and blessed them. While He was blessing them, He parted from them and was carried up into heaven. Let's see now. People being teleported from one place to another. Re-animated hero's walking through walls. Zombies on parade. Levitation into the clouds. Isn't it obvious what the bible is? A first-century comic book. A thousand years from now maybe people will be worshipping the Incredible Hulk instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 I hadn't the slightest idea how to respond so I read all the other answers first. I guess that sort of gave me a feel for what the options mean. I'm not ready to burn it mainly for reasons stated by others. I don't embrace it for obvious reasons. I just don't know how to feel about it. Life without the bible is inconceivable to me, meaning I can't imagine life without the bible on about the same level as I can't imagine life without four seasons like we have in this part of the world where I have lived all my life. I know in many parts of the inhabited world there are fewer than four seasons. Likewise I know many people get along just fine without the bible. I voted for the fourth option: There are both literary and philosophical value to be found in the bible. I would have liked the third option except I wasn't sure if these literary and philosophical values are all that "good." CC said: But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. If you take it upon yourself to dictate what I should think and feel and do, then perhaps at the very least I have a right to tell you to keep such unfriendly thoughts to yourself. There should probably have been a rule that Christians are not allowed to respond. I know I'm prejudiced but I don't apologize for that. Not to a person who presumes to label me as a fanatic, nazi, or inquisitor. If you want to get slippery and claim you meant it only as a joke, that won't work. It's a most nasty joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. I don't know who said the above quote, but it doesn't strike me as a nasty joke. It seems to me that they are merely saying that burning books is not the act of reasonable people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
currentchristian Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 I hadn't the slightest idea how to respond so I read all the other answers first. I guess that sort of gave me a feel for what the options mean. I'm not ready to burn it mainly for reasons stated by others. I don't embrace it for obvious reasons. I just don't know how to feel about it. Life without the bible is inconceivable to me, meaning I can't imagine life without the bible on about the same level as I can't imagine life without four seasons like we have in this part of the world where I have lived all my life. I know in many parts of the inhabited world there are fewer than four seasons. Likewise I know many people get along just fine without the bible. I voted for the fourth option: There are both literary and philosophical value to be found in the bible. I would have liked the third option except I wasn't sure if these literary and philosophical values are all that "good." CC said: But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. If you take it upon yourself to dictate what I should think and feel and do, then perhaps at the very least I have a right to tell you to keep such unfriendly thoughts to yourself. There should probably have been a rule that Christians are not allowed to respond. I know I'm prejudiced but I don't apologize for that. Not to a person who presumes to label me as a fanatic, nazi, or inquisitor. If you want to get slippery and claim you meant it only as a joke, that won't work. It's a most nasty joke. So let's see if I understand you. I can't say what I think and feel about burning books, but you can say what you think and feel about what I think and feel. Doesn't that seem inconsistent, RubySera? I think your bias against Christians clouds your judgment when it comes to anything I post. You diligently search my posts to find something with which to accuse me, to make me fit your stereotypes, to make me a fiend and a fanatic, a force for ill. I find this unfortunate when anyone does this to anyone. My point was just this: I don't think burning books is a good thing. When I think about all the bookburners in history, they were Inquisitors, Nazis, and religious fanatics. Free thinkers do not burn books, in my view. You may disagree, of course, and have every right to do so. -CC in MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
currentchristian Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 But no matter what one thinks about this it, burning books is for Inquisitions, Fanatics and Nazis, not for freethinkers, free spirits, and open-minded persons. Seems to me. I don't know who said the above quote, but it doesn't strike me as a nasty joke. It seems to me that they are merely saying that burning books is not the act of reasonable people. Precisely what I was trying to say. Among the fundamental values, seems to me, should be allowance for all views and all thoughts. No one should burn anyone's algebra book, romance story, or Bible. First the books are burned, then the people who wrote the books are burned. It's a very slippery slope. -CC in MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuroikaze Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Precisely what I was trying to say. Among the fundamental values, seems to me, should be allowance for all views and all thoughts. No one should burn anyone's algebra book, romance story, or Bible. First the books are burned, then the people who wrote the books are burned. It's a very slippery slope. -CC in MA I don't think anyone here is in favor of striping anyones civil rights, but this question is a little more complicated than that. Let me ask you a question, now I'm sure you are aware that the bible has at least been involved in a few atrocities over the centuries, so hypothetically speaking if you could go back into the past and prevent the book from ever existing and thus possibly stopping many of those atrocities, would you? Of course the next question is how many atrocities will the bible cause in the future. Understand, I'm not interested, at this point, in weather or not the people who did these things "properly interpreted" the bible. For my part, I don't think a "proper interpretation" exists. Of course this is all hypothetical because there is no way for us to simply wipe the book from our memories, but try to cut us some slack...some of us have been hurt quite a bit by Christians, and/or the religion itself. Most of us came from fundamentalist backgrounds of one type or another, so we are probably a fair bit nicer to you than we would have been a few years ago, but remember, that our experiences do color our judgment, and some of us automatically see red the moment we hear the word Christian, so I would ask you not to devalue our experiences, a lot of us have good reason for our resentment. I may be talking with you civilly, but you can go through my older posts and see many times I let my anger get the better of me and I would tell fundamentalists where they could shove their religion in no uncertain terms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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