Why Cant I Just Live In Peace Anymore

[rocklobster]

its still going on. fuck i cant shake these obsessive thoughts that bother me. the fears i still have. i was only in the church for a year and yet this is

bothering more than ever. i cant just ignore these thoughts for some reason. I still feel guilty for things even though i dont know why, or know why i still dont have motivation to persue anything.

 

this whole deconverting thing feels terrible. im so freaked out that jesus will come back someday and just send me to hell. i know i feel worse when im in the church or trying to follow faith.

but why cant i just choose a side and stick with it.

 

i want to just be able to move on without worrying about how all these issues in the world isnt or is god. things like freshwater supplies running out, the drying of the euphrates river.(wich i guess was prophecised)

and things like the light over jereuselem wich i actually just posted.

 

i just want to live the iife i wanted before i got involved in all this. and it feels like i dont even have the strength to make a choice and stick with it. I dont want to follow what this supposed god sais in the bible and i disagree with it. but why does it still torment me.

 

how much longer

[PatrickG]

Hi rocklobster

this whole deconverting thing feels terrible. im so freaked out that jesus will come back someday and just send me to hell.

 

I feel bad for so many people' date=' who share your same troubled soul issues, that a religion has instilled.

 

I was in the religion too, but I found spirituality in spite of the BS.

 

God is love. Love will not send you to hell. Some Christain doctrine is the meanest shit under the sun. If it is mean, it is not God.

 

i know i feel worse when im in the church or trying to follow faith.

but why cant i just choose a side and stick with it.

 

Because you are spiritual. The religion does not teach you to find your own spirituality. To become comfortable with you, you will have to work out your soul issues.

 

You can read some self-help books....ask others.........look here....look there, but the answers are in you.

 

It takes time to work the dents out. Stick with it. You need to become your own best friend though.

 

God is in your inner dialogue.

The only way to get over the issues that you are talking about is to face them.

 

I found memorization helpful. I memorized spiritual stuff that rang my bell. Then I repeated it to myself when I was freaking out. My big thing was love. I studied love. I memorzed that love verse. I memorsed that perfect love casts out fear..........ect ect.

 

God is not about having all the answers right. God is about love. That is it.

The rest is just bs that you can work through or not.

 

Good luck

[Galien]

My relationship with christianity was entirely emotional. After more than enough abuse by christians I walked away. As I looked at christianity more from a logical point of view I realised it all seems pretty ridiculous.

 

At this point if there does turn out to be a god that sends me to hell, I dont really care, I lived for decades of my life in fear and anxiety over this shit and it almost finished me. Staying alive meant challenging this rubbish at every turn until I defeated it.

 

I still care about people, dont do any of the things that I don't want to do, not particuarly interested in runing amok. What I refuse to do is waste any more time feeling like shit over this, and it seems silly for you to as well.

 

Most of this stuff can't be proven or disproven and it seems like a waste of energy that could be put into actually living your life and making the world a better place. If, as the bible says perfect love casts out fear, there is something seriously wrong with the whole christian process that seems to generate more fear than just about anything else on the planet, or its is all total crap. Either way, its not worth hurting yourself over any more.

[Overcame Faith]

My advice is for you to try the intellectual pursuit first. By that I mean for you to convince yourself from an intellectual study, maybe by reading some good books on the subject, about the reasons why Christianity is not a true religion. That helps a lot of people. If you have exhausted the intellectual avenue and still feel this fear, then you should consider some psychological counseling to help you deal with it.

[midniterider]

Try an experiment. Ask god a question and wait for an answer. Dont expect a verbal answer, in person answer, letter, email, text or phone call. But if you feel you are getting an answer, good. Now if this isn't the answer you would like, ask the same question again. But this time imagine you are getting the answer you would like to hear. Do you feel a difference between the source of god's answer and your imagination's answer? Really, there is no difference. Though fear might try to convince you otherwise. Now continue to ask 'god' some important questions. You don't need help from Christians or the bible for this nor does anyone need to know what you are doing. Feel the answer you like forming in your head. I'm not talking questions like, "Should I skip work today" or "Should I not pay the rent" but Christian theological questions like:

 

1. God, will I burn in hell if I abandon Christianity?

 

2. God is there a hell?

 

3. God are you real?

 

4. God do I need to pretend any longer that you exist?

 

5. God do other Christians actually receive messages from you or are they just full of shit?

 

Remember to ignore any answers from your imagination god that make you feel lousy. With practice you will be able to restructure god's answers to always be in alignment with what you feel is best for yourself and your loved ones, anyway. In time, you will even be able to just drop the "god" questions altogether and consider him to be an integrated part of your being, not a separate personality. Because really what is god but a facet of your own personality. Christians just have a delusion that he is separate. It reminds me of multiple personality disorder. But the disorder is shared amongst all Christians and nobody can seem to agree what god is really thinking.

 

 

Consider that a Christian rarely says he is being "led by the lord" to do something he wasn't really planning to do anyway. It just feels good to have the backing of your imagination god.

[chosendarkness]

Religion is so embedded in our culture that when you convert, it seems like you have 'the truth'. But it's the exact same way in a culture that has a religion that's completely different than Christianity. It seems just as much the truth to them as it does to Christians. So basically, you're just like the majority that believe in your culture's religion. In our Christian world, people convert to Christianity as see it as true. In a different society they have a completely different set of spiritual beliefs and see those as true.

 

So really the problem is you're not happy with your culture's religious beliefs, and changing our beliefs isn't easy because we're part of the culture. But seeing it from a larger perspective, you can understand the problem a little better. It's not just about you and your beliefs per se, it's more about how religious beliefs are a part of culture, and leaving them is like leaving a part of ourselves. That's why it's so terrifying.

[PatrickG]

Try an experiment. Ask god a question and wait for an answer. Dont expect a verbal answer, in person answer, letter, email, text or phone call. But if you feel you are getting an answer, good. Now if this isn't the answer you would like, ask the same question again. But this time imagine you are getting the answer you would like to hear. Do you feel a difference between the source of god's answer and your imagination's answer? Really, there is no difference. Though fear might try to convince you otherwise. Now continue to ask 'god' some important questions. You don't need help from Christians or the bible for this nor does anyone need to know what you are doing. Feel the answer you like forming in your head. I'm not talking questions like, "Should I skip work today" or "Should I not pay the rent" but Christian theological questions like:

 

1. God, will I burn in hell if I abandon Christianity?

 

2. God is there a hell?

 

3. God are you real?

 

4. God do I need to pretend any longer that you exist?

 

5. God do other Christians actually receive messages from you or are they just full of shit?

 

Remember to ignore any answers from your imagination god that make you feel lousy. With practice you will be able to restructure god's answers to always be in alignment with what you feel is best for yourself and your loved ones, anyway. In time, you will even be able to just drop the "god" questions altogether and consider him to be an integrated part of your being, not a separate personality. Because really what is god but a facet of your own personality. Christians just have a delusion that he is separate. It reminds me of multiple personality disorder. But the disorder is shared amongst all Christians and nobody can seem to agree what god is really thinking.

 

 

Consider that a Christian rarely says he is being "led by the lord" to do something he wasn't really planning to do anyway. It just feels good to have the backing of your imagination god.

 

My +1 button does not work yet.

 

This could be copied and paisted as the perfect answer for dealing with "talking to god".

 

Dealing with the mind is so important and the practice seems to not be prevalent. Learning to say good things to yourself will change your life.

It is called positive affirmation in New Thought.

[DesertBob]

how much longer

Longer than you'd wish for but not as long as you think.

 

I've been through various grieving and adjustment proceses so many times that I can tell you that it does get better. Although at times you have to be willing to define "better" as "I'm coping more effectively and/or am more used to it" rather than "it went away". My guess though is that this particular issue is one that actually can "go away". You can only keep it alive by feeding it with obsessive thoughts and at some point you get too exhausted to do that and you'll either stop or something else will give. I recommend stopping.

 

"This, too, shall pass". Seriously.

[Falloutdude]

let me just say you're soooo much like me so i'm guessing a big majority of it are things that you can't verify and/or disprove or control which worry you and you have difficulty with, I think emotional recovery will be a bigger issue for you than the intellectual one, then again i don't know how far along you are on that avenue.

 

I will try to write more later

 

FoG

[rocklobster]

thanks everyone for the support.

 

its a mix of emotional and intellectual stress.

 

ive been basically asking those questions over and over for the past couple weeks. asking him if hes there or not. no responses

[chosendarkness]

thanks everyone for the support.

 

its a mix of emotional and intellectual stress.

 

ive been basically asking those questions over and over for the past couple weeks. asking him if hes there or not. no responses

 

Good luck in your transformation. It'll happen, just keep allowing yourself to grow and think. Right now there's someone on the other side of the world going through the same thing, different religion. Lot's of people on this forum are going through it, you're not alone.

[MichaelS]

Hmm, maybe you could study all the horrible things that will happen to you if you don't follow Allah and his prophet Mohammed? Or maybe that would just confuse you more...

 

I don't feel like I have totally shaken this myself, although right now what's going on in my life is more of a reverse Pascal's wager, where I'm debating if I should become more vocal in my opposition to Christianity in an attempt to maybe get people searching for any god that might actually exist. Again, this assumes that there is a god, and I lean towards there being no god, but the question sort of nags at me a bit. Sometimes I wish I could, in the words of Dawkins, "stop worrying and enjoy your life (which I still do from time to time)" but it's hard at times.

[Mike D]

I had the same problem for about 6-12 months, still worrying about "what if it's true?", but as time passed those worries began to fade.

 

One night while I was staying in a motel, I opened up the side drawer looking for a pen - and I found a Bible. And I thought to myself out of habit, "there's God's Word", like I did so many times before when I saw a Bible in a motel room. But then all of a sudden I was struck by the absurdity of it - I used to think this was God's Word, written by the creator of the universe and everything in it, the key to the meaning of life. Yet outside of church, the most holy, sacred and revered book ever written and known to man, can primarily be found only in the side drawer of cheap motels? The complete absurdity of that thought actually made me laugh, because it's also so completely true. But more importantly I laughed because I realized at that very moment that I had nothing left to be afraid of!

[midniterider]

I had the same problem for about 6-12 months, still worrying about "what if it's true?", but as time passed those worries began to fade.

 

One night while I was staying in a motel, I opened up the side drawer looking for a pen - and I found a Bible. And I thought to myself out of habit, "there's God's Word", like I did so many times before when I saw a Bible in a motel room. But then all of a sudden I was struck by the absurdity of it - I used to think this was God's Word, written by the creator of the universe and everything in it, the key to the meaning of life. Yet outside of church, the most holy, sacred and revered book ever written and known to man, can primarily be found only in the side drawer of cheap motels? The complete absurdity of that thought actually made me laugh, because it's also so completely true. But more importantly I laughed because I realized at that very moment that I had nothing left to be afraid of!

 

 

Wow, next cheap motel I'm at , I'm taking their bible and throwing it away.

[Mike D]

Wow, next cheap motel I'm at , I'm taking their bible and throwing it away.

 

[Margee]

still worrying about "what if it's true?", but as time passed those worries began to fade.

 

One night while I was staying in a motel, I opened up the side drawer looking for a pen - and I found a Bible. And I thought to myself out of habit, "there's God's Word", like I did so many times before when I saw a Bible in a motel room. But then all of a sudden I was struck by the absurdity of it - I used to think this was God's Word, written by the creator of the universe and everything in it, the key to the meaning of life. Yet outside of church, the most holy, sacred and revered book ever written and known to man, can primarily be found only in the side drawer of cheap motels? The complete absurdity of that thought actually made me laugh, because it's also so completely true. But more importantly I laughed because I realized at that very moment that I had nothing left to be afraid of!

 

Mike D - this is a VERY important point you have, made here that I have never thought of! If the Bible really was the true word of god - would you not think that we would see this 'manual' in every nook and corner of the earth. Really, besides people's homes, churches,book store and motels - we don't really see it many others places??

[DesertBob]

Mike D - this is a VERY important point you have, made here that I have never thought of! If the Bible really was the true word of god - would you not think that we would see this 'manual' in every nook and corner of the earth. Really, besides people's homes, churches,book store and motels - we don't really see it many others places??

There is a corollary to this point, and that is, if the true word of god were actually transformative as it's claimed to be, people would be lining up around the block to get into every church, ready to cast aside their hurts and their crutches and so forth, and go forth in "newness of life". Failing that, Christians should at least have lower rates of divorce, suicide, mental illness, and so forth. Yet, you don't see this eagerness for church or the Bible (or the equivalents offered by other religions). What you see instead is indifference, reluctance, and a need for people to be flogged into being involved with various guilt trips and other manipulations. Nor do you see statistically significant improved quality of life across the board; indeed, there is some evidence to the contrary, such as slightly HIGHER divorce rates for Christians.

 

Hm ....

[Margee]

Mike D - this is a VERY important point you have, made here that I have never thought of! If the Bible really was the true word of god - would you not think that we would see this 'manual' in every nook and corner of the earth. Really, besides people's homes, churches,book store and motels - we don't really see it many others places??

There is a corollary to this point, and that is, if the true world of god were actually transformative as it's claimed to be, people would be lining up around the block to get into every church, ready to cast aside their hurts and their crutches and so forth, and go forth in "newness of life". Failing that, Christians should at least have lower rates of divorce, suicide, mental illness, and so forth. Yet, you don't see this eagerness for church or the Bible (or the equivalents offered by other religions). What you see instead is indifference, reluctance, and a need for people to be flogged into being involved with various guilt trips and other manipulations. Nor do you see statistically significant improved quality of life across the board; indeed, there is some evidence to the contrary, such as slightly HIGHER divorce rates for Christians.

 

Hm ....

 

And yet another good point Bob!

 

I have often thought if this were the real thing and everybody believed it 100% - wouldn't the corners of the world be overflowing with christians begging us (with love) to come their way because if we don't -We will land in hell??? There is not one christian in my city doing this??

I really didn't give that much of a shit when I was a christian about where you were going - It was all about me!!

I was a 'selfish' christian.......

[Noggy]

http://godisimaginary.com/

[chosendarkness]

 

I have often thought if this were the real thing and everybody believed it 100% - wouldn't the corners of the world be overflowing with christians begging us (with love) to come their way because if we don't -We will land in hell??? There is not one christian in my city doing this??

The modern mind is not capable of believing things like that 100%. There's no reference or context in today's world in which to believe it. In ancient times sure, things like hell and deities controlling crop production must have seemed just as real to them as a hand in front of their face, but our minds have changed since then.

 

I believe this is the reason Christians are so adamant about being right, because there's a conflict with the modern mind trying to accept ancient ideas. The conflict pushes them to try harder and be bigoted about their beliefs. A person who's secure in their beliefs isn't bothered by people who don't believe exactly like them. But with the things Christians try to believe, it's impossible not to be conflicted.

[DesertBob]

The modern mind is not capable of believing things like that 100%. There's no reference or context in today's world in which to believe it. In ancient times sure, things like hell and deities controlling crop production must have seemed just as real to them as a hand in front of their face, but our minds have changed since then.

 

I believe this is the reason Christians are so adamant about being right, because there's a conflict with the modern mind trying to accept ancient ideas. The conflict pushes them to try harder and be bigoted about their beliefs. A person who's secure in their beliefs isn't bothered by people who don't believe exactly like them. But with the things Christians try to believe, it's impossible not to be conflicted.

Indeed. The cognitive dissonance was deafening for me, that's what finally drove me out. Also, it was a tremendous relief, not to have the burden of being right all the time.

[chosendarkness]

The modern mind is not capable of believing things like that 100%. There's no reference or context in today's world in which to believe it. In ancient times sure, things like hell and deities controlling crop production must have seemed just as real to them as a hand in front of their face, but our minds have changed since then.

 

I believe this is the reason Christians are so adamant about being right, because there's a conflict with the modern mind trying to accept ancient ideas. The conflict pushes them to try harder and be bigoted about their beliefs. A person who's secure in their beliefs isn't bothered by people who don't believe exactly like them. But with the things Christians try to believe, it's impossible not to be conflicted.

Indeed. The cognitive dissonance was deafening for me, that's what finally drove me out. Also, it was a tremendous relief, not to have the burden of being right all the time.

 

I fought the cognitive dissonance with everything I had. I wasn't going to let my modern mind interfere with what I knew to be true, so I made a real effort to believe in Jesus 100%. When I talked to Christians about it they looked at me like I was an alien, they had no idea of what I was talking about. I was talking about really believing it, but that was a foreign concept to them. I was able to go farther with it, to somehow make my mind think like an ancient person. I'd point out to the Christians that they really don't believe it, but the reaction was always that they were comfortable and didn't want to believe it 100%. Even the fundamentalists didn't want to go that far.

 

Then after that I realized I didn't really know anything. I realized I was just stuck on trying to make Christianity real because I came from a Christian part of the world. What if I had been born in a different part of the world? When that concept got through, I became an ex-Christian almost immediately.

[Mike D]

 

If the Bible really was the true word of god - would you not think that we would see this 'manual' in every nook and corner of the earth. Really, besides people's homes, churches,book store and motels - we don't really see it many others places??

Yeah and the bibles in the book store are for sale!

 

Well at least here in America we know that if we want to know what the creator of the Universe has to say, we just stop by any Motel 6 or Roadway Inn and get our reading glasses out

[PatrickG]

thanks everyone for the support.

 

its a mix of emotional and intellectual stress.

 

ive been basically asking those questions over and over for the past couple weeks. asking him if hes there or not. no responses

 

How are expecting the response to come?

 

Have you ever reciecved some sort of response?

 

For me I know when I am in the response zone by the way that I feel. This comes from experience.

Post #5 in this thread, by midniterider, is great advice. The response after asking the question is your next thought.

If you don't like the next thought you can change it to the exact opposite of the answer.

 

It goes like this.

 

"God are you there"?

Next thought......"no"

I don't like that answer so I am going to think that exact opposite.

"God are you there"?

"no"........change to "yes".

 

Oh good, I have some other questions since you are here.

You can work out some really heavy questions by asking, listening to your own thoughts, and thinking of alteratives to your own thoughts. You can choose what you want to believe. Write your thoughts down. Write the opposites down. Choose what you want to believe.

 

I am a theist, because I choose to be one, for my own reasons.

[florduh]

Choose what you want to believe.

Or here's a novel idea for sentient beings: Believe that which makes sense and has some evidence. Sheesh.