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Goodbye Jesus

In Between Churches


JayL

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If it weren't for Christianity, slavery would still be a universal practice.

You're being willfully ignorant of factual history and even your own Bible.

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My recommendation for skeptics and atheists is to keep searching and to keep an open mind. You may yet find the true God - the God who embodies Love.

 

I do have a skeptic part of me, but I am not an atheist. I have found a Goddess who is all about love. What now?

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Hello JayL

 

Please tell me how your God of the Bible is different or better than Vishnu:

 

The Vishnu Sahasranama[2] declares Vishnu as Paramatman (supreme soul) andParameshwara (supreme God). It describes Vishnu as the All-Pervading essence of all beings, the master of—and beyond—the past, present and future, one who supports, sustains and governs the Universe and originates and develops all elements within. Vishnu governs the aspect of preservation and sustenance of the universe, so he is called 'Preserver of the universe'.

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I find this attitude very admirable.

 

I find it deplorable that this alleged mighty God didn't do anything to end the horrible institution. Even just calling it a sin for one human to own another human would have done something. But that would not be found in the Bible because many of the men who wrote the Bible thought it essential that men own women.

 

Even as a slave, a person can be a noble human being. That is what Christianity offers. BTW, how is it that you quote KJV? Is that old version your favorite??

 

King James has no copyright. I have no favorite version. You see reading the Bible is painful to me. I cannot read more than a page without feeling betrayed.

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JayL, please answer the following questions for me:

 

Where was God when my mom died of cancer when I was 19 months old?

Where was God while I was being emotionally abused by my step mom, unbeknownst to my dad?

Where was God when my grandpa who I adored, blew his brains out?

Where was God when my dad who I adored, committed suicide by running his car in the enclosed garage with the car windows open?

Where was God when my husband and I cried out to conceive a child, and he did not answer my prayer?

Where was God when my husband's very godly dad (father of 5) suffered fatal traumatic brain injuries in a job-related accident when my husband was six.

Where was God when my husband's elderly very godly mom fell and hit her head on the tub, and also died of traumatic brain injuries?

Where was God when a 5-year-old little guy in our church suffered from leukemia for 2 years and finally died, even though his godly parents, grandparents, and hundreds of christians fasted and prayed for his healing?

Where was God (the one who promises to protect his own) when a godly friend of mine perished in a fire while saving his family?

 

How could a God of Love kill millions of unborn children, infants, toddlers, children, women, men in a worldwide flood?

How can a God of Love send millions to hell to be consciously tortured not for just a quadrillion years, but for an eternity, with no chance of repentance or even total annhilation?

How can a God of Love allow over 6,500,000 children to starve to death in the world every day?

How could a God of Love in the Bible command the slaying of thousands of people in wars, read Numbers 31.

 

I could go on and on. I accepted Christ when I was 18 (I'm 58 now). I was "baptized in the Spirit," and was very involved in the church for 40 years, especially small group ministry. I've been through Bible School, I've been an intercessor. I've experienced what I thought was the presence of God (but now I'm wondering if it was a psychological phenomenon). It's just been within the past year that I've started asking all of these questions (and more), and experiencing a crisis of faith. It seems like a veil has been lifted and all of a sudden I can see things I never saw before. My husband is very devout, and he does not know the extent of my crisis of faith. I love him so much, he is my life, and I don't want to devastate him. All of my friends and my husband's family who I'm very close to are extremely devout Christians. I'm not ready to totally turn my life upside down. I'm not sure how this will all end up.

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Correction: I meant to say, How does a God of Love allow 6,500,000 children starve to death every year (not every day).

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Wow a True Christian™ with the True Gospel™! I ain't never seen none y'all before. Well shucks, you should have all the answers handy if you'se really gots that holy spirit! True or false, the law of sacrifice for attonement of sins was given to Moses by god?

If you stick around here, you may learn something new!!

Wow! A True Christian™ who doesn't answer questions! What a concept! I cannot learn anything from you if you don't answer questions.

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Christianity did not push to abolish slavery. Acceptance was taught throughout the states. Black people were not as welcomed into white homes no matter where a person lived or what the beliefs. Christians also helped murder Indians and rape their wives and daughters. Christians encourage hatred for other humans, not acceptance or equal rights. If they do not do the yelling and screaming, they send love offerings to those who do.

So how did the slavery get abolished in the western world?? Because some atheists campaigned for it?? Dream on.

I didn't say 'some atheists campaigned for it.' But that is the Christian method of clouding issues by putting words in people's mouths they did not say. End of slavery was not due to just Christians campaigning for it, there were atheists who also opposed slavery. Do you think only Christians fought in the Civil War? Morality is not a Christian-only attribute. Christianity was not the reason for the end of slavery in the US, in fact, as others have pointed out, Christianity preached acceptance of slavery and segregation of races. It took secular laws following the Civil War to give equality to minorities, especially former slaves.

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So how did slavery get abolished in the western world? Because of some atheists? LOL Perhaps Charles Darwin campaigned against it?? Learn some history, dude. Your 'tolerance oriented' philosopher Voltaire was making money from slave trades!! If it weren't for Christianity, slavery would still be a universal practice.

 

Where was Christianity during the 1,800 years of its existence when slavery was a common practice? Happily endorsing and going along with it, that's what. And after all, why should they have done otherwise. Jesus never explicitly condemned slavery - you'd've thought if he'd done so if he really had a problem with it! And indeed, as others have pointed out, the Bible itself happily endorses slavery and never once explicitly condemns it. How can it? After all, we are all effectively called to become Jesus' slaves! We're supposed to give everything up for him, do everything he tells us and not question him in any way - and if we don't, then to hell with us!

 

So how can you say that without Christianity, slavery would be a universal practice. Thanks to Christianity, millions of people across the world are trapped in hopeless slavery to a God that doesn't even exist!

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JayL, Satan just told me to bless you.

 

 

Perhaps Satan is inspiring you to use foul language.

 

JayL, when you come to a place where no one believes in biblegod and have wasted many years of their lives in loving, worshipful service to a being that does not exist, and you proceed to say "God bless you" not once, but twice, then you are essentially using that as a means of giving everyone the finger and saying "fuck you!" in your own way. Satan does not exist. You can't stand the fact the we think for ourselves and are no longer a slave to religion like you are. You're actually a terrible xtian- you don't even go to church. I used to be a way better xtian than you are now, and I absolutely guarantee that I know more about the bile than you do.

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So how did slavery get abolished in the western world? Because of some atheists? LOL Perhaps Charles Darwin campaigned against it?? Learn some history, dude. Your 'tolerance oriented' philosopher Voltaire was making money from slave trades!! If it weren't for Christianity, slavery would still be a universal practice.

 

Did I say it was abolished by atheists? You have poor reading comprehension. I am not a dude, either, I am a lady.

 

Christian societies permitted slavery for centuries. That some group of them suddenly started opposing it doesn't mean much. It certainly does not establish the truth of Christianity.

 

 

 

Hey dudette,

 

 

My point is that without Christianity, slavery would still be practiced. Who would oppose it when so much sacrifice is involved?? Atheists like you??? Dream on.

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Wow a True Christian™ with the True Gospel™! I ain't never seen none y'all before. Well shucks, you should have all the answers handy if you'se really gots that holy spirit! True or false, the law of sacrifice for attonement of sins was given to Moses by god?

If you stick around here, you may learn something new!!

Wow! A True Christian™ who doesn't answer questions! What a concept! I cannot learn anything from you if you don't answer questions.

 

 

 

Why should I answer your question when you have such a stupid picture to represent yourself??

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JayL, please answer the following questions for me:

 

Where was God when my mom died of cancer when I was 19 months old?

Where was God while I was being emotionally abused by my step mom, unbeknownst to my dad?

Where was God when my grandpa who I adored, blew his brains out?

Where was God when my dad who I adored, committed suicide by running his car in the enclosed garage with the car windows open?

Where was God when my husband and I cried out to conceive a child, and he did not answer my prayer?

Where was God when my husband's very godly dad (father of 5) suffered fatal traumatic brain injuries in a job-related accident when my husband was six.

Where was God when my husband's elderly very godly mom fell and hit her head on the tub, and also died of traumatic brain injuries?

Where was God when a 5-year-old little guy in our church suffered from leukemia for 2 years and finally died, even though his godly parents, grandparents, and hundreds of christians fasted and prayed for his healing?

Where was God (the one who promises to protect his own) when a godly friend of mine perished in a fire while saving his family?

 

How could a God of Love kill millions of unborn children, infants, toddlers, children, women, men in a worldwide flood?

How can a God of Love send millions to hell to be consciously tortured not for just a quadrillion years, but for an eternity, with no chance of repentance or even total annhilation?

How can a God of Love allow over 6,500,000 children to starve to death in the world every day?

How could a God of Love in the Bible command the slaying of thousands of people in wars, read Numbers 31.

 

I could go on and on. I accepted Christ when I was 18 (I'm 58 now). I was "baptized in the Spirit," and was very involved in the church for 40 years, especially small group ministry. I've been through Bible School, I've been an intercessor. I've experienced what I thought was the presence of God (but now I'm wondering if it was a psychological phenomenon). It's just been within the past year that I've started asking all of these questions (and more), and experiencing a crisis of faith. It seems like a veil has been lifted and all of a sudden I can see things I never saw before. My husband is very devout, and he does not know the extent of my crisis of faith. I love him so much, he is my life, and I don't want to devastate him. All of my friends and my husband's family who I'm very close to are extremely devout Christians. I'm not ready to totally turn my life upside down. I'm not sure how this will all end up.

 

 

 

Thank you so much for this post. Of course, these are really tough questions and it would take a while to reply. But these questions are so important I may address your post continuously. Thanks for opening your heart to write these questions. I will do my best to answer them - although I am really busy during weekdays. But so far your post is the most important I have read in this board. And I believe many of our atheist friends are asking very similar questions.

 

 

Best wishes.

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My recommendation for skeptics and atheists is to keep searching and to keep an open mind. You may yet find the true God - the God who embodies Love.

 

I do have a skeptic part of me, but I am not an atheist. I have found a Goddess who is all about love. What now?

 

 

Love is good! Just don't get into a promiscuous life style.

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JayL, please answer the following questions for me:

 

Where was God when my mom died of cancer when I was 19 months old?

Where was God while I was being emotionally abused by my step mom, unbeknownst to my dad?

Where was God when my grandpa who I adored, blew his brains out?

Where was God when my dad who I adored, committed suicide by running his car in the enclosed garage with the car windows open?

Where was God when my husband and I cried out to conceive a child, and he did not answer my prayer?

Where was God when my husband's very godly dad (father of 5) suffered fatal traumatic brain injuries in a job-related accident when my husband was six.

Where was God when my husband's elderly very godly mom fell and hit her head on the tub, and also died of traumatic brain injuries?

Where was God when a 5-year-old little guy in our church suffered from leukemia for 2 years and finally died, even though his godly parents, grandparents, and hundreds of christians fasted and prayed for his healing?

Where was God (the one who promises to protect his own) when a godly friend of mine perished in a fire while saving his family?

 

How could a God of Love kill millions of unborn children, infants, toddlers, children, women, men in a worldwide flood?

How can a God of Love send millions to hell to be consciously tortured not for just a quadrillion years, but for an eternity, with no chance of repentance or even total annhilation?

How can a God of Love allow over 6,500,000 children to starve to death in the world every day?

How could a God of Love in the Bible command the slaying of thousands of people in wars, read Numbers 31.

 

I could go on and on. I accepted Christ when I was 18 (I'm 58 now). I was "baptized in the Spirit," and was very involved in the church for 40 years, especially small group ministry. I've been through Bible School, I've been an intercessor. I've experienced what I thought was the presence of God (but now I'm wondering if it was a psychological phenomenon). It's just been within the past year that I've started asking all of these questions (and more), and experiencing a crisis of faith. It seems like a veil has been lifted and all of a sudden I can see things I never saw before. My husband is very devout, and he does not know the extent of my crisis of faith. I love him so much, he is my life, and I don't want to devastate him. All of my friends and my husband's family who I'm very close to are extremely devout Christians. I'm not ready to totally turn my life upside down. I'm not sure how this will all end up.

 

 

 

Thank you so much for this post. Of course, these are really tough questions and it would take a while to reply. But these questions are so important I may address your post continuously. Thanks for opening your heart to write these questions. I will do my best to answer them - although I am really busy during weekdays. But so far your post is the most important I have read in this board. And I believe many of our atheist friends are asking very similar questions.

 

 

Best wishes.

 

I can't wait to hear your answers, cause we never asked these questions before. DragnTougnebeg.gif

 

You're a troll.........ya know how I know?? Cause your statements are so dumb!!

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So how did slavery get abolished in the western world? Because of some atheists? LOL Perhaps Charles Darwin campaigned against it?? Learn some history, dude. Your 'tolerance oriented' philosopher Voltaire was making money from slave trades!! If it weren't for Christianity, slavery would still be a universal practice.

 

Did I say it was abolished by atheists? You have poor reading comprehension. I am not a dude, either, I am a lady.

 

Christian societies permitted slavery for centuries. That some group of them suddenly started opposing it doesn't mean much. It certainly does not establish the truth of Christianity.

 

 

 

You solely lack historical perspectives. You think just because slavery is illegal now, that people opposed in the olden days - perhaps you are assuming people back then were just like you.

 

Thruout human history, slavery was an accepted institution. Everyone practiced it - around the world. Heck, African slaves were still being auctioned off in 1974 !! In Mecca !! Did you know that???

 

Christians were the first group in history who opposed the slavery and successfully abolished it. That is a historical fact.

 

So I am asking to you, if not Christians, who?? Atheists?? Give me a break.

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JayL, please answer the following questions for me:

 

Where was God when my mom died of cancer when I was 19 months old?

Where was God while I was being emotionally abused by my step mom, unbeknownst to my dad?

Where was God when my grandpa who I adored, blew his brains out?

Where was God when my dad who I adored, committed suicide by running his car in the enclosed garage with the car windows open?

Where was God when my husband and I cried out to conceive a child, and he did not answer my prayer?

Where was God when my husband's very godly dad (father of 5) suffered fatal traumatic brain injuries in a job-related accident when my husband was six.

Where was God when my husband's elderly very godly mom fell and hit her head on the tub, and also died of traumatic brain injuries?

Where was God when a 5-year-old little guy in our church suffered from leukemia for 2 years and finally died, even though his godly parents, grandparents, and hundreds of christians fasted and prayed for his healing?

Where was God (the one who promises to protect his own) when a godly friend of mine perished in a fire while saving his family?

 

How could a God of Love kill millions of unborn children, infants, toddlers, children, women, men in a worldwide flood?

How can a God of Love send millions to hell to be consciously tortured not for just a quadrillion years, but for an eternity, with no chance of repentance or even total annhilation?

How can a God of Love allow over 6,500,000 children to starve to death in the world every day?

How could a God of Love in the Bible command the slaying of thousands of people in wars, read Numbers 31.

 

I could go on and on. I accepted Christ when I was 18 (I'm 58 now). I was "baptized in the Spirit," and was very involved in the church for 40 years, especially small group ministry. I've been through Bible School, I've been an intercessor. I've experienced what I thought was the presence of God (but now I'm wondering if it was a psychological phenomenon). It's just been within the past year that I've started asking all of these questions (and more), and experiencing a crisis of faith. It seems like a veil has been lifted and all of a sudden I can see things I never saw before. My husband is very devout, and he does not know the extent of my crisis of faith. I love him so much, he is my life, and I don't want to devastate him. All of my friends and my husband's family who I'm very close to are extremely devout Christians. I'm not ready to totally turn my life upside down. I'm not sure how this will all end up.

 

 

 

Thank you so much for this post. Of course, these are really tough questions and it would take a while to reply. But these questions are so important I may address your post continuously. Thanks for opening your heart to write these questions. I will do my best to answer them - although I am really busy during weekdays. But so far your post is the most important I have read in this board. And I believe many of our atheist friends are asking very similar questions.

 

 

Best wishes.

 

I can't wait to hear your answers, cause we never asked these questions before.

 

You're a troll.........

 

 

 

Hey, that save me time, my 'lady friend'.

 

 

Call me what you will. I only answer serious questions.

 

 

Thanks for saving me some time.

 

 

Adios.

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[quote name='JayL' timestamp='1323113149' post='708015

 

 

Thank you so much for this post. Of course, these are really tough questions and it would take a while to reply. But these questions are so important I may address your post continuously. Thanks for opening your heart to write these questions. I will do my best to answer them - although I am really busy during weekdays. But so far your post is the most important I have read in this board. And I believe many of our atheist friends are asking very similar questions

 

 

Hey, that save me time, my 'lady friend'.

 

 

Call me what you will. I only answer serious questions.

 

 

Thanks for saving me some time.

 

 

Adios.

you never answered any of mine seriously!! Do you even read all these questions we ask? Answer intelligently and then I'll treat you like the nice person you probably are!!biggrin.png

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Wow a True Christian™ with the True Gospel™! I ain't never seen none y'all before. Well shucks, you should have all the answers handy if you'se really gots that holy spirit! True or false, the law of sacrifice for attonement of sins was given to Moses by god?

If you stick around here, you may learn something new!!

Wow! A True Christian™ who doesn't answer questions! What a concept! I cannot learn anything from you if you don't answer questions.

 

 

 

Why should I answer your question when you have such a stupid picture to represent yourself??

 

Wow. Just wow. Looks like, when you can't think of anything rational to say, you just resort to making fun of someone's icon. Very impressive, NOT!

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Call me what you will. I only answer serious questions.

 

So far you dodge more questions than you answer.

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Wow a True Christian™ with the True Gospel™! I ain't never seen none y'all before. Well shucks, you should have all the answers handy if you'se really gots that holy spirit! True or false, the law of sacrifice for attonement of sins was given to Moses by god?

If you stick around here, you may learn something new!!

Wow! A True Christian™ who doesn't answer questions! What a concept! I cannot learn anything from you if you don't answer questions.

 

 

 

Why should I answer your question when you have such a stupid picture to represent yourself??

 

Wow. Just wow. Looks like, when you can't think of anything rational to say, you just resort to making fun of someone's icon. Very impressive, NOT!

 

 

 

I hate looking at stupid icons. There is this guy who has ugly monkey as his face.

 

Come on. Do I need to answer the monkey guy as well???

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JayL, please answer the following questions for me:

 

Where was God when my mom died of cancer when I was 19 months old?

Where was God while I was being emotionally abused by my step mom, unbeknownst to my dad?

Where was God when my grandpa who I adored, blew his brains out?

Where was God when my dad who I adored, committed suicide by running his car in the enclosed garage with the car windows open?

Where was God when my husband and I cried out to conceive a child, and he did not answer my prayer?

Where was God when my husband's very godly dad (father of 5) suffered fatal traumatic brain injuries in a job-related accident when my husband was six.

Where was God when my husband's elderly very godly mom fell and hit her head on the tub, and also died of traumatic brain injuries?

Where was God when a 5-year-old little guy in our church suffered from leukemia for 2 years and finally died, even though his godly parents, grandparents, and hundreds of christians fasted and prayed for his healing?

Where was God (the one who promises to protect his own) when a godly friend of mine perished in a fire while saving his family?

 

How could a God of Love kill millions of unborn children, infants, toddlers, children, women, men in a worldwide flood?

How can a God of Love send millions to hell to be consciously tortured not for just a quadrillion years, but for an eternity, with no chance of repentance or even total annhilation?

How can a God of Love allow over 6,500,000 children to starve to death in the world every day?

How could a God of Love in the Bible command the slaying of thousands of people in wars, read Numbers 31.

 

I could go on and on. I accepted Christ when I was 18 (I'm 58 now). I was "baptized in the Spirit," and was very involved in the church for 40 years, especially small group ministry. I've been through Bible School, I've been an intercessor. I've experienced what I thought was the presence of God (but now I'm wondering if it was a psychological phenomenon). It's just been within the past year that I've started asking all of these questions (and more), and experiencing a crisis of faith. It seems like a veil has been lifted and all of a sudden I can see things I never saw before. My husband is very devout, and he does not know the extent of my crisis of faith. I love him so much, he is my life, and I don't want to devastate him. All of my friends and my husband's family who I'm very close to are extremely devout Christians. I'm not ready to totally turn my life upside down. I'm not sure how this will all end up.

 

 

 

I am sorry. My mistake. I thought you were answering my post. It was that dumb Eve gal.

 

I will address your questions seriously.

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Love is good! Just don't get into a promiscuous life style.

 

Who are you to tell other people what to do with other consenting adults? You would presume that it's your business?

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[quote name='JayL' timestamp='1323114334' post='708025'

 

 

Why should I answer your question when you have such a stupid picture to represent yourself??

 

Wow. Just wow. Looks like, when you can't think of anything rational to say, you just resort to making fun of someone's icon. Very impressive, NOT!

 

 

I hate looking at stupid icons. There is this guy who has ugly monkey as his face.

 

Come on. Do I need to answer the monkey guy as well???

I think I'm bbbb--uuuu---teee----full!

Come..... eat an apple with me.......firedevil.gif .

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You solely lack historical perspectives.

 

This from the one who said historical perspective makes Jesus a great guy?

 

You think just because slavery is illegal now, that people opposed in the olden days - perhaps you are assuming people back then were just like you.

 

Perhaps you use the strawman argument despite the fact that you claim to have a university education.

 

Thruout human history, slavery was an accepted institution. Everyone practiced it - around the world. Heck, African slaves were still being auctioned off in 1974 !! In Mecca !! Did you know that???

 

Christians were the first group in history who opposed the slavery and successfully abolished it. That is a historical fact.

 

So I am asking to you, if not Christians, who?? Atheists?? Give me a break.

 

If Christianity were true then why didn't God stop slavery centuries earlier? At the very least God could have forbid Christians from owning slaves. Sure Christians have done good things from time to time but that doesn't make your invisible friend real.

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