I Can't Move On.

[Guest ChristineE]

Oh, and there is one thing which I should probably underline. My other mentors (Mac aside) have never hurt me. Ever. I'm not sure I'd even be alive were it not for their presence in my life

[Guest ChristineE]

Oh, and of course I lean on my husband a lot for support. a LOT. I love him dearly. my relationships with my mentors are close yes, but platonic.

[London]

Christine I want to suggest that you go see a non-religious mental health professional just to get a different perspective on this.

Call your doctor and get a referral or call a local clinic for a referral. Be specific that you would like a non-religious provider, that way you will have a more neutral experience. Ask for a 2 hour appointment if you can. Explain the whole story to this person, leave nothing out. They will be able to help you. They can only help you if you are 100% honest about the whole story.

 

Caring and abuse can seem like the same thing when you are really messed up in an abusive situation. Do something good for yourself and at least get a professional opinion.

[Guest ChristineE]

Okay... Well I see a therapist once in a blue moon for panic attacks. I guess I could ask her. I don't know, all this seems a little over-the-top don't you think? I'm not even that depressed at the moment. I find the idea of actually paying to see a doctor about this to be a touch overwhelming. You all seem to think I really do need this though. Maybe there's something I'm not picking up on.

[London]

You don't seem depressed to me either. You seem distraught. Bouncing back and forth with an abusive relationship, terrified that god will harm you.

 

No one wants you to leave here. I see everyone in this thread is concerned. And please stay. But do have someone assess your situation. It can't hurt. And it really should help you put it in perspective.

It's one thing to have the xians reeling you in, and another to have us non-believers pulling the other direction. But to have a professional who is required to remain neutral discuss it with you is a very healthy thing to do.

[Guest ChristineE]

Thank you all dearly. I've no idea why it's so hard to simply let go and leave. I don't want this any more than I'm sure anyone wanted their Christian Experience.

 

Except for some parts. Mac was kindly and gentle sometimes. He would affect a ridiculously overblown Irish accent (stemming from his Ren Faire days, before he converted) for the sake of cheering me up. He''s a fairly good musician. He'd sing for me. He even WROTE a song for me, but it had something to do with Christ as well, so I did not listen very closely and do not remember the words. Once as I was in the throes of a panic attack he tapped his mic rhythmically. I asked him what he was doing and he said, "Emulating a heartbeat. I heard somewhere that calms people down. How are you now, calm yet?" Not really but at least he made me smile. If I had a quarter of every time I've heard from him, "I really do hope you feel better dear" I'd probably have enough to buy Starbucks for all my friends. If only that weren't immediately followed by "...And I hope that you do see how badly you need Christ"

[jackbauer]

I understand what it's like to get addicted to something that causes you mental anguish. My experience in fundymentalism was like that. My exposure to it was through websites which triggered my deep seated fear of death (making it a million times more terrifying with their description of hell). It's like I knew it was bad for me, but I couldn't get over the fear without going on several websites refuting the idea of eternal torment. I found myself in a cycle of trying ease my fears but would only end up finding stuff that would reaffirm them. Thus, the idea of living for an afterlife became an addiction for awhile until I had to logically see religion for what it was.

 

Ironically, I still enjoy discussing and ranting about theological ideas. I now realize the religious people make extrodinary claims and rely on logical fallacies. Unfortunately, that doesn't stop the occasional "What if I'm wrong" thought from coming back, but I'm letting logic take over.

[Xerces]

If you were indoctrinated from a young age it can make it very hard. I didn't get away from religion until my late teen years. My sister is in her thirties and she is still religious. Because of me abandoning religion though, my younger brother has taken a more agnostic stance to it all.

[Guest Valk0010]

Why have mentor's?

[Guest ChristineE]

Well I was a real wreck before I found my mentor Azron. He and I met just after Mac had managed to almost convince me to turn to Christianity. I very much needed mentors like him then. Now I have them to have someone to spill out things like this to. That, and I am very close to them. They helped me, and I tend to become very close very quickly to those who are willing to take me in. I'm not in the near-suicidal state I was in then, but I feel they still help me.

[Xerces]

There's a difference between helpful advice and letting someone else make decisions for you. You're essentially saying you need other people to help you make decisions because you aren't confident enough to make your own, and that you're probably even scarde to make them on your own.

[Guest ChristineE]

They don't really tend to make decisions for me, because to be honest they tend not to say much apart from "Stay away from Macolyis". Which I can almost never do for longer than a few weeks. i keep them around not to tell me what do do, but so I've got someone in whom to confide. They're less mentors and more... well what do you call someone who continually consoles you and does their best to convince you your problems are psychological and not the wrath of God?

 

Forgive me, but I'm going to make a self-diagnosis as to why I can't seem to stay away from Mac:

 

It's not that I can't accept what you're saying is probably true. I can and I do. But some things remain, and I've just not let go of them yet. I return to Mac not because I believe any of his doctrine any more. I go back because the emotions of fear, shame, grief, and above all NEEDING him to continually comfort me to make all three leave for a time... those left-over feelings are so powerful that they drive me to the same undeniable behaviors I had back then. Someone on here informed me and the world about flashbacks. I probably have them. Not as in I believe it's 2007 or something.. I mean that Mac and his teaching instilled deeply painful feelings in me. The remnants of those feelings... they resurface and suddenly out of the blue I'm upset because I suddenly feel just like I did way back when.

[London]

I mean that Mac and his teaching instilled deeply painful feelings in me. The remnants of those feelings... they resurface and suddenly out of the blue I'm upset because I suddenly feel just like I did way back when.

 

This is why I think you need someone to help you sort this all out. If you can't break free from this and properly put it to rest, it will always haunt you. And it can morph into something even worse.

 

It's just like a cut that won't heal. Ignore it long enough and it gets infected. Eventually it will do enough damage that you will lose a part of you forever. And it does not have to be that way.

[Zephie]

From what I've read this Mac guy sounds like a douche and he's just screwing with you. You are better than that. Please get some professional help to work through these things. The people here at Ex-C are great as well.

[Akheia]

Christine, I don't think you're in a place right now where you can pick trustworthy "mentors." I submit respectfully that you have no clue in the world what that word even really should mean. I don't think you've displayed good boundary-making behaviors and I also don't think you're in a place where you're strong enough to avoid deliberately getting into hurtful and potentially harmful situations. You know that opening yourself up to those whackjobs is bad, but somehow you can't get out of the mind-ruts you've dug yourself. You've begun the painful process of recognizing that your deceptions and "trolling" are cries for attention, and you've begun to realize that you're not picking healthy people to "mentor" you. But that's a start you could have hit a long time ago with better help from professionals. You do realize that most of the world, when we realize that we're AIMing with someone harmful, block them immediately? Why can't you do that? Why do you keep allowing this to happen to you? Why do you keep going back to these situations? The panic attacks are a big sign that you're already not dealing with your anxieties in a constructive way (I had them for years from PTSD--and yes, therapy/meds helped me and I have been largely attack-free for a decade or so now).

 

I really think you would benefit from a professional therapist--the one who helps you with panic attacks should also be qualified to help with your self-destructive patterns of deception and harmful relationships, since they're all likely inter-related. The day my panic attacks really went away was the day that I realized that all that time I'd been screaming in my soul for someone to hold me and tell me it'd all be okay, that I'd actually been the one I'd been screaming for. My body loved me, and it wasn't till I realized that and worked with it, not against it, and listened to its many intuitions that I got free. I learned how to set boundaries, how to avoid harmful people, how to recognize when it was safe to self-disclose and when it wasn't, how to manage my at-the-time-considerable rage. I did not reach that peak by myself, though. Therapy saved my life.

 

Pick up the phone. Make the appointment with that therapist. If you have a printer, print out this thread and take it with you. I hope your next post here is about how you actually moved to heal yourself.

[Guest ChristineE]

But Mac's the only whackjob I've met. The rest of them are just shoulders to cry on. And they've all been Atheists. Really, I swear, the others haven't done a thing in the world to hurt me. And yes, if I really do go get therapy I'm printing this out and making the psychologist read it so I don't have to actually repeat this story...

[Akheia]

"If"? "IF" you "really do go get therapy"? If you don't, what steps are you going to take to address these issues and heal yourself?

[Guest ChristineE]

There's plenty I could do otherwise. One therapy session surely wouldn't hurt, but if I choose not to do that... I could lean on my husband, I could take up painting as he suggested to give me more to do, I could try to enjoy my part-time volunteer job, I could spend more time out-of-doors, I could make an attempt to eat healthier, I could make a similar attempt to cure my insomnia (even if I'm doubtful that would work as I've taken every sleeping aid known to man)

 

And I could stay here and talk to you all.

 

Even if I am too cowardly to get therapy that doesn't necessarily mean there's nothing at all I could do, that I'm helpless. It's time to do something.

 

On that note, my husband's home from a business trip today. As soon as I'm finished typing this post I'll tell him what you all have said and talk about therapy. He might be open to it, or he might say it's too expensive, or that he'll work to cure me himself, or that a huge flaw of mine is that I listen too much to people on the internet. I asked him several months back if I needed counseling, and he said all three things to me. I thought it was very sweet that he'd take time out of his life and work with me full-time as would a therapist. He specifically said he'd be willing to take time off to work with me. Isn't that romantic? It's not that he would ever deny me medical help, it's just that I don't think he sees the gravity of the situation. He did read over this whole post yesterday though. So he knows exactly what I've gone through. People who've been Atheists all their lives have a hard time understanding this I find.

[agnosticator]

.. I mean that Mac and his teaching instilled deeply painful feelings in me. The remnants of those feelings... they resurface and suddenly out of the blue I'm upset because I suddenly feel just like I did way back when.

 

Mac instilled these terrifying feelings, so you:

 

I go back because the emotions of fear, shame, grief, and above all NEEDING him to continually comfort me to make all three leave for a time... those left-over feelings are so powerful that they drive me to the same undeniable behaviors I had back then.

 

HE is the one that terrorized you, so he could comfort you? WTF? Are you listening to yourself? This is classic psychological ABUSE! He's emulating the Biblegod by being kind and tender to you so he can guarantee you'll be back for more abuse! He's not your friend. Friends listen and comfort without manipulating and victimizing for their own pleasure. He enjoys treating you like this because he gets off on the power and control over you!

 

Please go contact Marlene Winnell:http://www.marlenewinell.net/ She can talk with you or maybe recommend someone for you.

[agnosticator]

...it's just that I don't think he sees the gravity of the situation. He did read over this whole post yesterday though. So he knows exactly what I've gone through. People who've been Atheists all their lives have a hard time understanding this I find.

 

That is why you need to talk with Ex-Christians, but moreso with Dr. Winnell. She can get you through this.

[Guest ChristineE]

I spoke with Dr. Winnell. She explained that there was a part of me that was a vulnerable child who was easily influenced and easy scared. That It was up to me to be the mother to this child (my eyes are watering!) and protect her and love her. Other than that, she basically repeated what you guys have told me, She was great though. She's got such a calming voice. She said to keep talking to you guys and maybe seek counseling too. Personally I still don't believe I need it. I asked my husband if I was overreacting by seeking therapy and he said, "Maybe a little bit". I have to agree. But I'm gonna stay here with you guys and I'm going to stay away from Mac. Those two things are imperative. Other than that my plan is to eat well, sleep well, and try to see the beauty in life. Wish me luck (and I'm secretly hoping none of you are disappointed in me that I don't want to seek full-time therapy. I'm sorry. I just don't think it's for me)

[agnosticator]

I'm glad you spoke with her. If you ever feel overwhelmed with the desire to visit Mac, GET HELP, ok?

[London]

He might be open to it, or he might say it's too expensive, or that he'll work to cure me himself, or that a huge flaw of mine is that I listen too much to people on the internet. I asked him several months back if I needed counseling, and he said all three things to me. I thought it was very sweet that he'd take time out of his life and work with me full-time as would a therapist. He specifically said he'd be willing to take time off to work with me.

 

This concerns me. It's one thing to have a spouse who is right by your side supporting you while you seek professional help, and a whole other thing to have someone that close to you controlling your world view. Even if he is a therapist, psychologist, etc, he should not be the one treating you.

 

It is very important that you have someone who has no vested interest in the outcome. Well, except to say that you get healthy.

 

I don't think you need to go to therapy every week for the next 10 years. I just think it's beneficial to see someone for a short time. Someone who can give you better tools to see the situations and be able to avoid getting sucked into unhealthy scenarios.

 

I get the feeling that you are looking for "something". And your search keeps ending up in these unhealthy situations. Does this sound right to you? If I'm way off here just ignore the rest of this post.

 

If it sounds like you... I suggest you find an activity that occupies your time better. Well, maybe a few activities. When we are involved with our interests and our own lives in general, we tend to find more meaning in it. The search for "something" is no longer an obsession. Having a purpose is fine. But obsessing over having a purpose can run you off the "healthy" road.

 

I just wanted to make a comment about being an atheist. Most of us here have all come from a religious past. Some more abusive than others. Some are still in that environment right now. Very few people here, to my knowledge, grew up without religion.

 

I know you want to think Mac could be a good person if things were different, but we all see that he is not different and that leopard does not change it's spots. Many of us see the behaviors we experienced personally. That's why we urge you to seek help. So glad you spoke to Dr. Winnell.

[bornnormal]

Please excuse me for my harsh words, but let me be the voice of reason here. As my grumpy granddad would have said to me in a similar situation:

 

"It is time to get your head out from your behind! Get over yourself, go out, find a job and start working hard! Get a decent workout at least 2-3 times a week! Get a proper education!

I presume you are lost in your thoughts and in yourself, because there are no meaningful activities in your life. All you do is sit in front of the computer and whine about your insecurities to total strangers. Get a life! A real life!"

...Granddad over and out.

 

Please excuse me if I got your situation all wrong. If that's the case, then I cannot add anything else to what the others said. Get professional help!

Cheer up, life is great!

[Guest ChristineE]

I just got a job actually. It's only 12 hours a week. I thought it would help me to improve, but after a couple weeks of being there my life somehow feels even less meaningful. All my life, since childhood, I found far greater pleasure in keeping to myself and staying by myself rather than being around others. I learned to read children's novellas by the age of 4. Rather than running around with other kids I preferred to sit and read, or color. As an elementary school student I would sit contentedly at the far corner of the playground dreaming up fantastic stories. In middle school I was the quiet kid who had no friends. My panic attacks had set in at age 11 anyway, so social situations frightened me. I was glad for the most part that no one talked to me. In high school I had one very close real-life friend. One was all I needed. I never in my life went to a party or anything. I liked it that way. The only thing I didn't much care for was my dad inviting me to the junior prom... LOL.

Point being, I've never known about, cared about, or liked the outside world. I have gotten a real job and I find it stressful yet boring, even though the field of herbal medicine (I work as an herbalist's apprentice) is something I thought I really wanted to study. It's true that a few relaxing hobbies to get my mind off things (painting for instance) would do me good. But no more posts about me needing a life. I don't LIKE having a life.

 

[/rant]

 

Post-Script: Please don't let my boss see this!!!