The Tragedy That Is Shame

[Dory]

I've only posted one topic on here so far, and that was way back just after my conversion when dealing with the raw emotion of it all.

 

This time, it's starting to hit me that I'm just left with a heck of a lot of shame for who I am. I basically came out gay last year, everyone was fine with it, except me, and my church. I sort of guessed it some 2 years back, but a load of bollocks 'God will change you' from church people kept me repressed and ignorant for all that time. After a horrendous few months at the end of last year where I was getting seriously mentally ill, depressed, nearly suicidal, I finally went to see a counsellor - a non religiously associated counsellor - and got the help I finally needed. It was the hardest time of my life, but all through that process I was faithful. About 2 months ago, I just got up and thought 'What the frick did I put myself through!?', God never showed up once, for all the tears and heartache that I had to go through.

 

My conversion was originally an emotionally charged one, and as I started to read and educate myself, it became a more intellectual one.

 

The shame of being me is a lot less than what it was several months ago since I pulled the plug on religion.. but I'm still so sensitive around the area of sex/relationships, since I never really went after any of it as a teenager (trying to be all 'holier than thou'). Being gay isn't the thing that bothers me like it used to, it's more the whole unhealthy perception of sex/sexuality/relationships that Christianity has left me with that makes me feel ashamed and less than nothing.

 

Does this get better? Or does anyone have any tips to over come shame? I'm starting to feel angry about it all now, I'm 21 so I guess I've got loads of time to find a gf and just settle down, but there's still a lot of shame and fear attached to falling in love with someone.

 

Thanks,

 

and thankyou for this forum. I check it every day and get a lot from reading peoples testimonies/articles/etc.

[Zephie]

There are a couple of Pdocasts from Living after Faith and Thinking Atheist that deal with sex. My understanding is that is takes time.

*hugs* I'm sorry that you've been shamed by others for being who you are.

 

Welcome to Ex-C!

[♦ ficino ♦]

Hello Dory! First, welcome! Second... I envy you!! You're 21, you have seen through Christianity at a young age, you have an exciting life ahead of you, and you know who you are. You're way ahead of where I was at 21 - I wasn't out as gay, nor honest about it with myself, and I was getting deeper into the "cult." I relate to the way such influences can make you ashamed to be yourself and ashamed about the sexual side of you. Like you, eventually I got sick of waiting for God to stop screwing me over, and that led to seeing all the contradictions.

 

I definitely think it gets better. If you are open to people and to yourself and to the beauty in the world, it gets very good indeed. I understand that the UK is considering gay marriage. So exciting!

 

As your circle of friends expands, and as you settle into your skin as post-Christian, you'll gain confidence, and the shame part will get weaker. Eros is so much part of the glue that holds people together intimately - I haven't found it possible without it. As you open yourself to the good of pleasure and joy in just being a human being, the residue of the shame - which is totally socially induced - will keep weakening. When you meet someone and take the risk, you'll see how the reality of the other person is so much more powerful than the shame voices left over in your head. As you go along, you may have your heart broken at least once, but I am sure that you will see that happiness comes most from saying "yes".

 

Keep posting on here, Dory!

[FeelHappy]

21 is young, in my opinion it takes longer than that to really get to know yourself, give yourself time.

[Positivist]

I really feel for you. I have seen awful treatment of gay/lesbian people at the hands of the church/Christianity. You know, the "pray the gay away" load of crap. It is so heartbreaking!

 

Good for you for seeking therapy. Yes, you are who you are and you need to love yourself and let others love you for who you are. Find people of like mind. Affirm yourself and let others affirm you. There is a lot of shame and self-hatred to overcome once you've come out of Christianity.

 

We are here for you too!

[mymistake]

I've only posted one topic on here so far, and that was way back just after my conversion when dealing with the raw emotion of it all.

 

This time, it's starting to hit me that I'm just left with a heck of a lot of shame for who I am. I basically came out gay last year, everyone was fine with it, except me, and my church. I sort of guessed it some 2 years back, but a load of bollocks 'God will change you' from church people kept me repressed and ignorant for all that time. After a horrendous few months at the end of last year where I was getting seriously mentally ill, depressed, nearly suicidal, I finally went to see a counsellor - a non religiously associated counsellor - and got the help I finally needed. It was the hardest time of my life, but all through that process I was faithful. About 2 months ago, I just got up and thought 'What the frick did I put myself through!?', God never showed up once, for all the tears and heartache that I had to go through.

 

My conversion was originally an emotionally charged one, and as I started to read and educate myself, it became a more intellectual one.

 

The shame of being me is a lot less than what it was several months ago since I pulled the plug on religion.. but I'm still so sensitive around the area of sex/relationships, since I never really went after any of it as a teenager (trying to be all 'holier than thou'). Being gay isn't the thing that bothers me like it used to, it's more the whole unhealthy perception of sex/sexuality/relationships that Christianity has left me with that makes me feel ashamed and less than nothing.

 

Does this get better? Or does anyone have any tips to over come shame? I'm starting to feel angry about it all now, I'm 21 so I guess I've got loads of time to find a gf and just settle down, but there's still a lot of shame and fear attached to falling in love with someone.

 

Thanks,

 

and thankyou for this forum. I check it every day and get a lot from reading peoples testimonies/articles/etc.

 

I've struggled with shame my whole life. I came from a fundy family. They put me on a shame trip very early. They used shame as a weapon. It was the way I was raised.

 

I use self talk.

 

Try telling yourself that you have the right to live, love and be happy. "I have the right to live, love and be happy".

 

I've gotten to the point where instead of having a shame meltdown I just say out loud "No regrets". As I say it I feel it. It's the exact opposite of the Christian repenting of your sins.

 

Work on yourself. Become a stronger person. Overcome you baggage. Then you will find a nice partner. You will discover sex is real and God isn't. That is why Christians use shame to scare people away from sex. They don't want to lose Christians to the real world.

 

If you have any more questions feel free to PM me anytime.

[Dory]

Thanks everyone, all the comments really help. I got a book recently, 'Leaving the Fold' which has been immensely helpful, and I will take all your tips into account too.

 

Thanks.

[London]

Dory, welcome to Ex-C, nice to hear your voice.

 

One of the things the cult wants you to do is feel bad about sex and who you naturally love. It's all about control.

It takes a little time but it does go away. It's a cult, and they want you to be unhappy. But I know there is some cute girl just waiting to steal your heart.

 

Religion is our enemy, they hate us. So the best way to combat that is to accept who we are, and work to be happy, healthy people in spite of their attempts to make us hate ourselves.

 

Religion is the evil of the world.

 

There is more to me than my sexuality, but I am most definately all gay, all day. And being gay isin't just about sex, we also have the capacity to love, xians don't have that.

 

You shouldn't feel shame for expressing any kind of love as a part of your sexuality. You are human, sex is a part of our humanity and our relationships and a facet of love. (wow, that really sounded like I'm some tree hugging, ganja smoking, hippie. LOL)

 

It gets better over time.

 

 

And sadly, I am not from the UK.

[blackpudd1n]

Dory, Rome wasn't built in a day. Don't try and undo all that brainwashing all at once- you will end up in a right royal state. The process of any form of healing happens at its own pace; however, you can be aware of what is going on inside of you and challenge your thoughts as they arise. This will help you feel more in control.

 

Christianity has impacted on my sexual life in a major way. The shame I have felt for my natural urges is indescribable, but I keep working on it, talking about it, challenging my thoughts, researching and examining my attitudes to all aspects of human sexuality, and it is slowly getting better, I am slowly feeling freed of the shame. And when I get stuck, I go and see a therapist, because she is really good at playing devil's advocate, challenging my thinking, and helping me to see things from a different perspective.

 

Another thing that helped me to examine my attitudes was the movie Kinsey. I highly recommend it.

[Overcame Faith]

Hi, Dory, and welcome to ExC.

 

Shame is when other's disapprove of something we do or of who we are and we accept their disapproval in our own minds. It sounds like you have taken major steps towards realizing this and I'm glad. Don't worry about what others say or think. Rather, examine your own life and learn to accept yourself for who you really are. It's actually something we all have to work through whatever the issue.

[Margee]

Dory, I am so glad you joined us!! Welcome.

 

Dory, I feel that the more your mind lets go of the so-called sin that we were all ingrained with.....you will accept yourself for exactly who you are, knowing that it is completely natural for some to have been born gay. Also, as the poison of religion drops off - you can be able to understand that you are full human and will make lots of mistakes. You don't need to be ashamed anymore. Work on the characters flaws you don't like about yourself and keep all the rest. Don't let anyone ever tell you again who you should be!!

 

hope to hear more from you!!

[Dory]

Dory, I am so glad you joined us!! Welcome.

 

Dory, I feel that the more your mind lets go of the so-called sin that we were all ingrained with.....you will accept yourself for exactly who you are, knowing that it is completely natural for some to have been born gay. Also, as the poison of religion drops off - you can be able to understand that you are full human and will make lots of mistakes. You don't need to be ashamed anymore. Work on the characters flaws you don't like about yourself and keep all the rest. Don't let anyone ever tell you again who you should be!!

 

hope to hear more from you!!

 

THIS.

 

As religious drops off, bit by bit, I'm noticing character flaws that were just covered up before. For example, I'm sitting nervously for a phone call, after leaving a message saying I need to apologise to her for something I said to someone else about her - which wasn't my place to say at all. I feel pretty sick about it, I always manage to stick my foot in it and yes, I feel pretty ashamed and worried that it will affect my friendship with her - but it's a learning curve. This is natural shame, for something I know I've done wrong and know that I need to apologise even though she would never have known otherwise - but its the right thing to do, and I need to suffer the consequences. I feel strong in that, ashamed, but for good reason, not a divine one.

 

thanks margee, I know I'll need the help and support from all you guys over the next months and years.

[Margee]

Dory, I am so glad you joined us!! Welcome.

 

Dory, I feel that the more your mind lets go of the so-called sin that we were all ingrained with.....you will accept yourself for exactly who you are, knowing that it is completely natural for some to have been born gay. Also, as the poison of religion drops off - you can be able to understand that you are full human and will make lots of mistakes. You don't need to be ashamed anymore. Work on the characters flaws you don't like about yourself and keep all the rest. Don't let anyone ever tell you again who you should be!!

 

hope to hear more from you!!

 

THIS.

 

As religious drops off, bit by bit, I'm noticing character flaws that were just covered up before. For example, I'm sitting nervously for a phone call, after leaving a message saying I need to apologise to her for something I said to someone else about her - which wasn't my place to say at all. I feel pretty sick about it, I always manage to stick my foot in it and yes, I feel pretty ashamed and worried that it will affect my friendship with her - but it's a learning curve. This is natural shame, for something I know I've done wrong and know that I need to apologise even though she would never have known otherwise - but its the right thing to do, and I need to suffer the consequences. I feel strong in that, ashamed, but for good reason, not a divine one.

 

thanks margee, I know I'll need the help and support from all you guys over the next months and years.

 

I'll be here Dory...We WILL help each other to grow!!

[Dory]

Dory, I am so glad you joined us!! Welcome.

 

Dory, I feel that the more your mind lets go of the so-called sin that we were all ingrained with.....you will accept yourself for exactly who you are, knowing that it is completely natural for some to have been born gay. Also, as the poison of religion drops off - you can be able to understand that you are full human and will make lots of mistakes. You don't need to be ashamed anymore. Work on the characters flaws you don't like about yourself and keep all the rest. Don't let anyone ever tell you again who you should be!!

 

hope to hear more from you!!

 

THIS.

 

As religious drops off, bit by bit, I'm noticing character flaws that were just covered up before. For example, I'm sitting nervously for a phone call, after leaving a message saying I need to apologise to her for something I said to someone else about her - which wasn't my place to say at all. I feel pretty sick about it, I always manage to stick my foot in it and yes, I feel pretty ashamed and worried that it will affect my friendship with her - but it's a learning curve. This is natural shame, for something I know I've done wrong and know that I need to apologise even though she would never have known otherwise - but its the right thing to do, and I need to suffer the consequences. I feel strong in that, ashamed, but for good reason, not a divine one.

 

thanks margee, I know I'll need the help and support from all you guys over the next months and years.

 

I'll be here Dory...We WILL help each other to grow!!

 

thankyou <3

[mymistake]

As religious drops off, bit by bit, I'm noticing character flaws that were just covered up before. For example, I'm sitting nervously for a phone call, after leaving a message saying I need to apologise to her for something I said to someone else about her - which wasn't my place to say at all. I feel pretty sick about it, I always manage to stick my foot in it and yes, I feel pretty ashamed and worried that it will affect my friendship with her - but it's a learning curve. This is natural shame, for something I know I've done wrong and know that I need to apologise even though she would never have known otherwise - but its the right thing to do, and I need to suffer the consequences. I feel strong in that, ashamed, but for good reason, not a divine one.

 

May I suggest the idea that it isn't shame but guilt? The way it was explained to me is that shame and guilt are different emotions. Sure they are similar and easy to mix up. Shame is long term and isn't tied to anything you did wrong. Guilt is short term and you only feel guilt when you actually mess up. So when you make a mistake you feel guilt so you go make things right. Shame is something others make you feel when they are trying to control you.

 

Just think about it and see if it works for you.