Popular Post jblueep Posted July 30, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2012 I have several threads about my (former) good friend P (former pastor's wife), and how she has rejected me and cut off all communication since I came out as a non-believer to her. It was shocking because I thought we were very close, like brother and sister close. Wise or not, I had to send a final good bye to her. I tried a nice goodbye a few months ago thinking she may still see the person I am a re-engage our friendship. But it was met with total silence. I had to do a gut level honest goodbye this time. I expect no response and I'm hoping I can let it go now. *****Message I sent below***** P, The wound you left in me is deeper than any friend before you. Every time I listen to a sermon where you or [her husband, former pastor] try to explain why we lost our faith, it just drives the knife deeper. The knife twists because it would have been so easy for you to privately learn the truth instead of speculating publicly about it. I would have loved it if you could have treated me as I treated you and if you could have been a part of helping me work this faith thing through. It's ironic and utterly painful that I spent all those hours helping you through the rejection of other Christians, only for you to then turn around and reject me for nothing more than a thought crime. Your hypocrisy is brutally painful to live with. My heart truly hurts, and all you had to do to prevent that was to be my friend. It's mostly painful because I still love you deeply. I would give my life for you because you were and always will be my sister. Yet, I know you probably won't even read this email and are very unlikely to respond if you do. "In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends." - Martin Luther King Jr. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentknight Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Quite a touching letter, and well written. Though I wonder, do you really believe she could have helped you through this crisis in faith? Or is it that you simply wanted her to understand and accept your loss of faith? Maybe I'm reading it wrong. Currently, the biggest issue I'm dealing with is people TRYING to help me with my faith. I don't want help, I want my unconditional love. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 This would have probably got me put in the bitter atheist catagory. But if I had someone treat me the way she treated you, I would have told them to blow me(and a bunch of other expletives) and never contact me again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 Quite a touching letter, and well written. Though I wonder, do you really believe she could have helped you through this crisis in faith? Or is it that you simply wanted her to understand and accept your loss of faith? Maybe I'm reading it wrong. Currently, the biggest issue I'm dealing with is people TRYING to help me with my faith. I don't want help, I want my unconditional love. Thank you silentknight. By "helping me work this faith thing", I just meant discussing it with me honestly as friend. I thought I had earned that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 This would have probably got me put in the bitter atheist catagory. But if I had someone treat me the way she treated you, I would have told them to blow me(and a bunch of other expletives) and never contact me again. Yeah, I figured she need another "why people become atheists" reason for her next sermon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdaddy Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Flush, and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 Flush, and move on. Unfortunately it's come to that. I tried my best, but it's clearly no use anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Positivist Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 It's ironic and utterly painful that I spent all those hours helping you through the rejection of other Christians, only for you to then turn around and reject me for nothing more than a thought crime. Powerful letter, J! Gawd, this whole thing is so heart-breaking. Christianity is an illusion lacking substance, and I believe P is fighting for her faith. She had to cut you and 2H out because your message is a threat to her beliefs. I bet if she stayed as your friends, she'd deconvert soon enough...and I think she knows that deep down and is terrified. So sad, J! My love to both you and 2H. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdaddy Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Flush, and move on. Unfortunately it's come to that. I tried my best, but it's clearly no use anymore. Everyone has double or triple-flushers. Just means it was a big shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 It's ironic and utterly painful that I spent all those hours helping you through the rejection of other Christians, only for you to then turn around and reject me for nothing more than a thought crime. Powerful letter, J! Gawd, this whole thing is so heart-breaking. Christianity is an illusion lacking substance, and I believe P is fighting for her faith. She had to cut you and 2H out because your message is a threat to her beliefs. I bet if she stayed as your friends, she'd deconvert soon enough...and I think she knows that deep down and is terrified. So sad, J! My love to both you and 2H. Thanks Pos, and I think you're right. Most pastors can't be more than a hair width away from deconverting. After all, they KNOW the truth, but they can't take the risk of losing everything they've built their lives on, so they won't ever really look behind the curtain to see if the wizard is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akheia Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 And your ex-pastor is a lot more fragile than most to begin with. I've seen soap bubbles with more coherence and strength. I also agree that she probably won't read it, and probably won't answer if she does. It's way easier to write lying sermons vilifying your ex-congregants than it is to honestly talk to them and learn the truth, but if she didn't demonize you, her already-tenuous grip would falter further. So demonize she must. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wings Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Hey J, really sorry for your loss.... it's easy to say that she's not worth it, but that doesn't lessen the pain or give closure. Sometimes being ignored hurts more than being debated/argued/hated. I echo what everyone else says, she's probably more afraid than anything. I hope that someday she joins you on 'this side' and you can all laugh off those crazy christian days. Until then, I'm wishing you all the love and support you need from those you have around you! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 Well, P didn't read my email. She made her husband read it and respond for her. His response (below) was basically to deny, deflect, and put it back on us. I posted my FINAL response to them below as well. The good news is that 2honest and I are finally done with them. Period. Forever. ****Pastor to me**** Jason, Hey, [pastor) here on P's computer. She saw that you sent her a message and asked me to read it for her. I am really a bit perplexed at your message. Somehow you perceive that her "preach" a week ago was directed at you? I can say with complete honesty that it had nothing to do with you or April, or your decision. Honestly, we have recently been through some deep processing of "The Father's Heart" and have had some amazing personal experiences. P was truly speaking from a place of personal experience concerning things she had "head knowledge"/"saber" about but now has "heart knowledge"/"conosere" and experience with the Father's heart toward her personally. We began this journey a year ago, scratched the surface last October, but really experienced in June. So, we have both been living from and sharing from the well within us of our own experiences. She really has come to terms with your decision.She has accepted it (that you have made such a decision). She does not really understand, but doesn't feel that she needs to. It is not her decision to understand. She really is simply pursuing her own path and relationship (with God). Both P and I are saddened that you would perceive her (or mine) words as a knife causing a wound. We really don't think about your decision anymore. We felt wounded initially by your conclusions. We have noticed an occasional facebook post that seemed to be intentionally directed (or unintentionally). But, honestly, we have believed in your best intentions even on this journey. Although our paths have diverged, we have no ill will. Certainly, we hope for you and April to find personal peace. And, yes, we would hope for you to discover in very real terms a personal God who loves you deeply and has not denied you. But, it is your path to walk as you will. It is interesting, maybe disconcerting, that you would still even listen to our "sermons" on the webpage. The only reason that I can conceive is that you think that we are preoccupied with you and are having a "war of words". Believe me, we have moved on. Probably, the absence of communication helps people "move on". Continuing to discuss unresolvable issues only keeps them "stirred up". Please forgive us in your new found "Church of Kindness" manner of loving people. And, please do not think that we are targeting you in any way. We are honestly only trying to help people within our own sphere of influence to know God personally. We have had some pretty amazing stories of personal experiences from people. This is what we live for. Nothing is directed at you or intended to hurt or cause pain. If your current view is the perception that you choose to hold onto, please accept our apologies and know that it will probably be time to stop all communications as they are not effectively relaying the right messages anyway. They seem to become twisted "in the airwaves". We are sorry for the pain that you experienced. ****me to them**** [pastor], I'm sorry, but you missed the entire point of my email. Perceived references in your sermons over the months is not really the issue. What we loved about the [church] was that it was "all about relationship". We really believe(d) in that. THAT is why I tried to communicate several times. THAT is why I took all the blame in the January email. THAT is why I took the blame again last week in my facebook post...you know the one where I tagged you and P and others, apologized, took the blame for my part in the break in relationships, and asked if I could come and hug some necks last Sunday...the one that you and P and no other tagged leader had the decency to respond to. Relationship is why I tried to hold on. I thought it was real. If I was preoccupied with sermons or whatever, it was simply an attempt to hold on in some way hoping that the relationship was real, that you hadn't so easily moved on. I tried to hold on because I still love you. The point of my email today was to finally let go because it hurt me too much to try and hold on anymore. The point was to come to terms with the fact that you were so apathetic to your own relationship message that you didn't initiate a single communication with us for the first six months we were gone...well before you knew we had left Christianity. The point was to let go of the fact that I was a kind and compassionate friend to P and that she dumped me like a piece of trash the moment she found out I didn't believe the same as her. I do appreciate your email in one way. It shows me that there is no hope of a relationship with you going forward. I can now truly move on. I will not initiate any further communication with you or P. I'll sign off with the wisdom of Gotye: But you didn't have to cut me off Make out like it never happened and that we were nothing I guess that I don't need that though Now you're just somebody that I used to know 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Positivist Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Oh this is just so sad and tragic. In my view, communication is being hampered by the digital medium and love is lost as a result. That and offense taken on both sides where none was intended, or so they say. J and 2H, these emails and threads really reveal how difficult it is to maintain former relationships once the worldview and language change and are no longer shared. These threads also reveal the intense personal pain that results from broken relationship. My love to you both. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I totally get how you feel. A very close friendship that was closer than being family and they just blew you off like dust on table. I will never understand how people can pretend to be your friend but drop you so fast when the heat gets turned up. You and 2H are such good people. You will attract so many good people in your lives. P could at least had the f'ing balls to be a grown up and respond herself. That is a huge coward. Hiding behind her spouse the way she hides behind god. And what P's husband wrote was just a load of shit. You deserve a few Tequila shots after that. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deva Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Wow, she didn't even have the guts to respond herself, but had her husband do it for her. And it was a crappy response. It did not even seem genuine to me. I will not initiate any further communication with you or P Wise decision, Jblue. I doubt you will hear anything further from them, either. It must be very tough for you, but you must deal with this loss and move on. . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentknight Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 saddened Religious people love to use that word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadrunner Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Im sorry for your loss J. When people dont understand that all we have is each other and they take this life for granted thats the way they act. Thats exactly why I can't stay on the sidelines forever. They need to be called out for that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdaddy Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I'll sign off with the wisdom of Gotye: But you didn't have to cut me off Make out like it never happened and that we were nothing I guess that I don't need that though Now you're just somebody that I used to know BUUUUUUUURRRRNNNNNNNNNN!!!!111!!!1!!!1!1 sorry, bro. You already know this, but you're a threat to their system. Like a virus. And by god, they have their McAfee 2012 installed and ready to nuke. We're here for ya man. Love 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator TrueFreedom Posted July 31, 2012 Moderator Share Posted July 31, 2012 I am sorry that it came to this, ((jblue)). And here's one for ((2H)). This reinforces my decision only to be completely open about my beliefs with people who I am confident will still have my back. I'll try to keep the rest guessing for now. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 Oh this is just so sad and tragic. In my view, communication is being hampered by the digital medium and love is lost as a result. That and offense taken on both sides where none was intended, or so they say. J and 2H, these emails and threads really reveal how difficult it is to maintain former relationships once the worldview and language change and are no longer shared. These threads also reveal the intense personal pain that results from broken relationship. My love to you both. I agree that face to face is the best, but they wouldn't do that. All I had left was an email. Love you too Pos. I feel a weight lifted this morning. I know that I did it right with integrity, and that they are liars and/or completely delusional. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 I totally get how you feel. A very close friendship that was closer than being family and they just blew you off like dust on table. I will never understand how people can pretend to be your friend but drop you so fast when the heat gets turned up. You and 2H are such good people. You will attract so many good people in your lives. P could at least had the f'ing balls to be a grown up and respond herself. That is a huge coward. Hiding behind her spouse the way she hides behind god. And what P's husband wrote was just a load of shit. You deserve a few Tequila shots after that. Thanks London. You and I will definitely have to have a Tequila shot (or ten) some day 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 Im sorry for your loss J. When people dont understand that all we have is each other and they take this life for granted thats the way they act. Thats exactly why I can't stay on the sidelines forever. They need to be called out for that. Amen. I'm grateful for my new tribe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackpudd1n Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I had always hoped just for their sake that they would practise what they preached. Ah, well. Goodbye (Pastor) and (P). It was fun while it lasted. We'll think of you both and wish you well, and hope to have the satisfaction of showing you both real forgiveness one day... The type of forgiveness only an atheist, ex-C, agnostic, etc. can give you. Give us a call, you've got our number- we'll pick up when you realise that god does not. Until then... So long. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblueep Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 I am sorry that it came to this, ((jblue)). And here's one for ((2H)). This reinforces my decision only to be completely open about my beliefs with people who I am confident will still have my back. I'll try to keep the rest guessing for now. I hear ya. That was in fact the hardest thing about P's actions...she was the one I thought would have my back. Oh well, lesson learned, and I have many new friends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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