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Jesus And The Conquering Of Sin


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”Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.” (Romans 6:9)

 

”For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?” (1 Corinthians 15: 53-55)

 

In the above scriptures we see that Jesus has conquered death through resurrection. What occurred to me today is that this concept does not, literally, make sense when taking in the fact that God is supposedly all-encompassing - in both knowledge and presence.

 

With this in mind, is it not fair to say that God could not have defeated sin or death, simply because he created these circumstances and knew their outcomes, and can do anything at whim?

 

It's like someone claiming victory on a test they themselves created; devised all the questions and knew all the answers.

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Guest Valk0010

 

 

It's like someone claiming victory on a test they themselves created; devised all the questions and knew all the answers.

I have a six word reply to anybody who would do that kind of thing in nonfairytale world.

 

Narcissists

 

So god is a narcissist

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So true.

 

Since God is supposedly omnipotent, death could never have been stronger than God. So it's just a big scheme. God devised the problem and the solution. A big asshole.

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In the above scriptures we see that Jesus has conquered death through resurrection. What occurred to me today is that this concept does not, literally, make sense when taking in the fact that God is supposedly all-encompassing - in both knowledge and presence.

 

It's like someone claiming victory on a test they themselves created; devised all the questions and knew all the answers.

 

Lol, my brain is too tired to think about this except to say, I agree, NONE of it makes any literal sense :)

Good point, POM.

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Great point... And as someone else pointed out in my thread... Jesus was sent by his father to save us from his father because he loves us so much and he's going to torture us. I mean, think it over. It's just so cray.

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Its not impressive when God has a 100 percent survival rate. When i was at church camp they went on a big rave over how the Romans and the Jews couldn't kill our lord and savior and he is alive today! They were all screaming with their and celebrating like they had won a civil rights moment or something. Its not that impressive, I'm sorry, All powerful being versus humans that he created, i don't understand what the frenzy is for.

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This thread totally reminds me of all the Mr. Deity episodes. They are on Youtube. "god" argues about similar things in the episodes and how things don't make sense. Very funny.

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So true.

 

Since God is supposedly omnipotent, death could never have been stronger than God. So it's just a big scheme. God devised the problem and the solution. A big asshole.

 

The brilliant idea to unfuck the world is practically nonsensical when you already have predetermined plans set to begin with. You would think something so obvious would challenge more Christians in their faith in salvation too, but...no. So God is either an incredibly sadistic asshole, or incredibly fucking retarded.

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It's also always bothered me that, in at least one gospel, Jesus yells out about his father forsaking him. Every year in church when they read that part of the gospel the meaning of that is not mentioned, and not one person goes.. "hey... if Jesus is god, and god is perfect... why the hell is he doubting himself?"

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Great point... And as someone else pointed out in my thread... Jesus was sent by his father to save us from his father because he loves us so much and he's going to torture us. I mean, think it over. It's just so cray.

 

I agree completely with your description of it, however, any Christian I say this too will always come back with something like "God isn't going to torture us, it's because we are sinful and fallen in nature. Jesus is saving us from ourselves, not the father. We choose sin over God..." blah blah blah. I just don't know how to combat this thinking. God's supposed plan to save us makes no sense, but these Christians cannot be reasonsed with.

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It's also always bothered me that, in at least one gospel, Jesus yells out about his father forsaking him. Every year in church when they read that part of the gospel the meaning of that is not mentioned, and not one person goes.. "hey... if Jesus is god, and god is perfect... why the hell is he doubting himself?"

 

He only said it to "fulfill prophecy". DUHHHHHH!!!!!

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Great point... And as someone else pointed out in my thread... Jesus was sent by his father to save us from his father because he loves us so much and he's going to torture us. I mean, think it over. It's just so cray.

 

I agree completely with your description of it, however, any Christian I say this too will always come back with something like "God isn't going to torture us, it's because we are sinful and fallen in nature. Jesus is saving us from ourselves, not the father. We choose sin over God..." blah blah blah. I just don't know how to combat this thinking. God's supposed plan to save us makes no sense, but these Christians cannot be reasonsed with.

 

So true, they can't be reasoned with... It quickly becomes "spiritual" and surpasses our own understanding blah blah blah... You just have to step away and look for another opportunity to inject reason back into their minds.

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It's also always bothered me that, in at least one gospel, Jesus yells out about his father forsaking him. Every year in church when they read that part of the gospel the meaning of that is not mentioned, and not one person goes.. "hey... if Jesus is god, and god is perfect... why the hell is he doubting himself?"

 

As I recall, the fundie explanation cop-out was that Jesus was God-in-the-flesh supplanted with human emotions, thus fully experiencing isolation from God (Technically himself?) while bearing our sins.

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I agree completely with your description of it, however, any Christian I say this too will always come back with something like "God isn't going to torture us, it's because we are sinful and fallen in nature. Jesus is saving us from ourselves, not the father. We choose sin over God..." blah blah blah. I just don't know how to combat this thinking. God's supposed plan to save us makes no sense, but these Christians cannot be reasonsed with.

 

It makes no sense because we're responsible for a life we didn't ask for, punished for a crime we didn't commit, and expected to live up to impossible, 'perfect' standards. For all of this we're condemned to eternal punishment for things that are practically out of our control.

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It's also always bothered me that, in at least one gospel, Jesus yells out about his father forsaking him. Every year in church when they read that part of the gospel the meaning of that is not mentioned, and not one person goes.. "hey... if Jesus is god, and god is perfect... why the hell is he doubting himself?"

 

As I recall, the fundie explanation cop-out was that Jesus was God-in-the-flesh supplanted with human emotions, thus fully experiencing isolation from God (Technically himself?) while bearing our sins.

 

So, once again someone makes up a convenient reason? Do they ever state this in the Bible? I don't recall it.

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It's also always bothered me that, in at least one gospel, Jesus yells out about his father forsaking him. Every year in church when they read that part of the gospel the meaning of that is not mentioned, and not one person goes.. "hey... if Jesus is god, and god is perfect... why the hell is he doubting himself?"

 

As I recall, the fundie explanation cop-out was that Jesus was God-in-the-flesh supplanted with human emotions, thus fully experiencing isolation from God (Technically himself?) while bearing our sins.

 

So, once again someone makes up a convenient reason? Do they ever state this in the Bible? I don't recall it.

 

There is actually nothing Biblical to support that claim, as with a handful of other scriptures (Gen. 2:17 comes to mind). God so clearly states that Adam will the die the day he eats of the fruit, and yet he didn't. Why? Because God -really- didn't mean he would experience physical death, but spiritual death. WendyDoh.gif

 

Again, it's another cop-out reason with nothing to back it up.

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