SquareOne Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 I've put up one post on the CARM message boards and a few replies in and I already feel like banging my head against the wall. They're so moronically stupid and ill informed it makes me want to weep. Then it makes me want to kick them in the balls. Then I mellow out... and remember... at least I'm free now... At least... I'm free... And breathe... For your entertainment... Me: Who wrote the Bible? How do you know? And how do you know that the Bible contain's God's word? Xian: "I don't want to be deemed not up-to-date, but the same old answers are still applicable. Who made the worlds ? The chances of this universe coming into being are a ga-zillion to one against, unless there is a creator, based merely on the well-known 2nd law of thermodynamics." I'm interested. Please expand. I am not qualified to teach on the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but in a nutshell, it is saying that everything in this world tends to a state of disorder. Everything falls apart or rusts, or decays, and at the last, produces heat. Heat cannot be converted into other forms of energy with 100 % efficiency; therefore the end of all things will be in the form of heat energy and unless there is an outside force for reorganization, we will be left in a state of chaos This lends strong opposition to the theory of evolution, all by itself and to the pre- existence of God. Why? I don't see the connection. Because, the theory of evolution claims that things in nature are becoming more complex and more organized. The 2nd law says the exact opposite. In other words, the universe is like a clock that was wound up at one time; it is now running and will eventually run down. Who originally wound it up ? THE STUPID! IT HURTS! ... breathe...
sdelsolray Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 That's just the standard misrepresented creationist assertion about entropy. Ask them to distinguish between open and closed entropic systems. Ask them to admit that the Earth is an open system. Case closed. 1
RipVanWinkle Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 I have to keep reminding myself that I was stupid, just like they are. It's tough for me to admit that, but it's true. Now I can't believe I was so stupid. You know, a good number of these pseudo scientists christians who claim the second law of thermodynamics defeats evolution must be lying through their teeth. Or they are as stupid as I was. If the former, they are not real christians. They are not supposed to lie, are they? Disgusting. But I remember that there was a church father who proclaimed that lying in support of God is OK. Eusebius? Can't remember the spelling of his name. God can't do His work without his saints lying, apparently. bill 1
Guest r3alchild Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 What keeps christians from understanding the right theory, cant they understand the bible in the light of the current data. Does the bible say do not understand anything written here if it goes against the light of reason. Now that is a question I ask, does the bible really give christians the reason to discount current facts.
Guest MadameX Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 CARM ha ha Factoid - Matt Slick's* daughter posted here for a while about a year ago *so this poster claimed
Guest Pixie Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 I guess I have read enough on this forum that I also was blinded by the Christian claims for so many years, that I don't have the ability to make fun of anyone right now. I can see the brainwashing and now it makes me sad.
ExCBooster Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 Ouch. That's so stupid, it's almost... precious. I think my very favourite part about the argument that guy used, with the Second Law of Thermodynamics proving God... is that if he'd actually understood the Second Law, the very famous thought experiment of Maxwell's Demon would refute the possibility of the existence of God. If you don't want to read the short link there and play with the cute applet, Maxwell's Demon was a thought experiment, set up to refute the Second Law. The Second Law of Thermodynamics states that in a closed system, entropy, or disorder will always increase. (This is arguably why time flows only one way). Suppose you have a room full of gas, with molecules whizzing about at all kinds of speeds. There's a trapdoor between the two chambers of the room, which are at first the same temperature. Now, if there were a little demon operating the trapdoor, and sorting out the slow cold molecules from the fast hot ones, the thought experiment supposes that the demon's sorting would reduce the entropy in the system, by adding order. It's a real noodle-scratcher - until you consider the demon itself. The demon, in order to do the sorting, picks up information from the system from watching the particles, and is itself the source of entropy increase. D'oh! Second Law still holds. Let's do another thought experiment, taking the Universe at large as our system, and God the Creator as the switch operator. "Watchmaker" style, as this nitwit seems to assume - let's throw in omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent, too, or, you know, it wouldn't be God. God's initial state before being the First Cause would by definition have to contain all the possible states of the system before it was set in motion. After all, I'm sure He's busily planning to plant all those fossils, just to be a dick, etc. For every subatomic particle, and every possible interaction in the universe, ever. This massive overload of entropy, before the beginning, is impossible, according to observation of the Cosmic Background Radiation (very smooth, and a lot less disordered than the clumps of matter we see today), among other things, and is a flagrant violation, not just of observed states, but also of the Second Law of Thermodynamics that said twit so glibly invoked. ... And God vanishes in a puff of logic.
SquareOne Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 ExCBooster thanks for your reply - I wish I understood it! But. I can say I know this argument... The evolution of species actually supports entropy, because the larger animals get, and the more voluminous in number they become - the more resources they consume, and the faster they convert potential energy to heat energy, thus in their own small way hastening total heat death. Huzzah for the second law!
Thurisaz Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 That's just the standard misrepresented creationist assertion about entropy. Ask them to distinguish between open and closed entropic systems. Ask them to admit that the Earth is an open system. Case closed. Fuck it, just ask them why it's called a law of thermodynamics if it's all about disorder. That will crash their line of bullshit thought nicely all of its own. That said, it's not stupidity per se. I'm quite sure many of their brains work decently well, they're just running on windoze 3.11 in a world populated by Unix. 1
Inqui Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 I've put up one post on the CARM message boards and a few replies in and I already feel like banging my head against the wall. They're so moronically stupid and ill informed it makes me want to weep. Then it makes me want to kick them in the balls. Then I mellow out... and remember... at least I'm free now... At least... I'm free... And breathe... For your entertainment... Me: Who wrote the Bible? How do you know? And how do you know that the Bible contain's God's word? Xian: "I don't want to be deemed not up-to-date, but the same old answers are still applicable. Who made the worlds ? The chances of this universe coming into being are a ga-zillion to one against, unless there is a creator, based merely on the well-known 2nd law of thermodynamics." I'm interested. Please expand. I am not qualified to teach on the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but in a nutshell, it is saying that everything in this world tends to a state of disorder. Everything falls apart or rusts, or decays, and at the last, produces heat. Heat cannot be converted into other forms of energy with 100 % efficiency; therefore the end of all things will be in the form of heat energy and unless there is an outside force for reorganization, we will be left in a state of chaos This lends strong opposition to the theory of evolution, all by itself and to the pre- existence of God. Why? I don't see the connection. Because, the theory of evolution claims that things in nature are becoming more complex and more organized. The 2nd law says the exact opposite. In other words, the universe is like a clock that was wound up at one time; it is now running and will eventually run down. Who originally wound it up ? THE STUPID! IT HURTS! ... breathe... Am I the only one who read the italicised stuff in Ken Ham's voice?
SquareOne Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 I'm also pissed off, because despite announcing my deconversion, not one of these people who are supposed to be loving have said anything even approaching "I'm sorry to hear that you lost your faith in Christ". They just immediately get intellectual or turn the knives on whether I was genuine. Where's the compassion?
wndwalkr99 Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 I'm also pissed off, because despite announcing my deconversion, not one of these people who are supposed to be loving have said anything even approaching "I'm sorry to hear that you lost your faith in Christ". They just immediately get intellectual or turn the knives on whether I was genuine. Where's the compassion? I'm sorry to hear that, SquareOne On a more serious note, this is how you know you've made the right choice. 1
Guest r3alchild Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 I have a account at carm and I read that whole thread. I was going to post a comment but I think its best to leave it alone. I noticed that some of there posts lacked that very thing you just said (love) but you were met with hearts that are cold, calculating and sterile. Maybe you can give to them what they wont give to you.
SquareOne Posted March 11, 2013 Author Posted March 11, 2013 On a more serious note, this is how you know you've made the right choice. You're absolutely right.
ConureDelSol Posted March 11, 2013 Posted March 11, 2013 I've put up one post on the CARM message boards and a few replies in and I already feel like banging my head against the wall. They're so moronically stupid and ill informed it makes me want to weep. Then it makes me want to kick them in the balls. Then I mellow out... and remember... at least I'm free now... At least... I'm free... And breathe... For your entertainment... Me: Who wrote the Bible? How do you know? And how do you know that the Bible contain's God's word? Xian: "I don't want to be deemed not up-to-date, but the same old answers are still applicable. Who made the worlds ? The chances of this universe coming into being are a ga-zillion to one against, unless there is a creator, based merely on the well-known 2nd law of thermodynamics." I'm interested. Please expand. I am not qualified to teach on the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but in a nutshell, it is saying that everything in this world tends to a state of disorder. Everything falls apart or rusts, or decays, and at the last, produces heat. Heat cannot be converted into other forms of energy with 100 % efficiency; therefore the end of all things will be in the form of heat energy and unless there is an outside force for reorganization, we will be left in a state of chaos This lends strong opposition to the theory of evolution, all by itself and to the pre- existence of God. Why? I don't see the connection. Because, the theory of evolution claims that things in nature are becoming more complex and more organized. The 2nd law says the exact opposite. In other words, the universe is like a clock that was wound up at one time; it is now running and will eventually run down. Who originally wound it up ? THE STUPID! IT HURTS! ... breathe... Wait...what...just...WHAT?!
SquareOne Posted March 11, 2013 Author Posted March 11, 2013 I've put up one post on the CARM message boards and a few replies in and I already feel like banging my head against the wall. They're so moronically stupid and ill informed it makes me want to weep. Then it makes me want to kick them in the balls. Then I mellow out... and remember... at least I'm free now... At least... I'm free... And breathe... For your entertainment... Me: Who wrote the Bible? How do you know? And how do you know that the Bible contain's God's word? Xian: "I don't want to be deemed not up-to-date, but the same old answers are still applicable. Who made the worlds ? The chances of this universe coming into being are a ga-zillion to one against, unless there is a creator, based merely on the well-known 2nd law of thermodynamics." I'm interested. Please expand. I am not qualified to teach on the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but in a nutshell, it is saying that everything in this world tends to a state of disorder. Everything falls apart or rusts, or decays, and at the last, produces heat. Heat cannot be converted into other forms of energy with 100 % efficiency; therefore the end of all things will be in the form of heat energy and unless there is an outside force for reorganization, we will be left in a state of chaos This lends strong opposition to the theory of evolution, all by itself and to the pre- existence of God. Why? I don't see the connection. Because, the theory of evolution claims that things in nature are becoming more complex and more organized. The 2nd law says the exact opposite. In other words, the universe is like a clock that was wound up at one time; it is now running and will eventually run down. Who originally wound it up ? THE STUPID! IT HURTS! ... breathe... Wait...what...just...WHAT?! Gaaaawd, that's what. 1
Galien Posted March 11, 2013 Posted March 11, 2013 These arguments are stupid. Most christians are operating out of their emotions, so they are hardly likely to even give logic the time of day. I didn't come out of christianity because of logic or reason, because my connection to it was not about either of those things. You will almost never drag a christian away from it who is emotional. Just won't happen because they simply do not care about logic or reason or proof or science. I still don't care too much about those things because of my makeup.
mymistake Posted March 11, 2013 Posted March 11, 2013 That's just the standard misrepresented creationist assertion about entropy. Ask them to distinguish between open and closed entropic systems. Ask them to admit that the Earth is an open system. Case closed. Fuck it, just ask them why it's called a law of thermodynamics if it's all about disorder. That will crash their line of bullshit thought nicely all of its own. That said, it's not stupidity per se. I'm quite sure many of their brains work decently well, they're just running on windoze 3.11 in a world populated by Unix. Ask them to explain the first and third law of thermodynamics. Most of them can't because they only memorized the one used by apologetics.
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