Hunter93 Posted June 24, 2013 Author Share Posted June 24, 2013 UPDATE: I'm actually going to see my conselour again this Wedensday. The reason is that this OCD/Scrupulosity/Anxiety is affecting school performance and I'm worried about that. I'm the process of CBT(or rather, just started) but I am not sure about ERP. As for my last post, it's true that prayer and believing in God is what helping me calm down at the moment. I'm too scared to do any serious research on anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesG Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 If prayer is calming you down use it. You don't have to deconvert all at once just ease into it. just treat prayer as a psychological tool to help you buy time for proper counseling and/or medical help(prescription drugs) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 25, 2013 Author Share Posted June 25, 2013 Say my psychiatrist today. Going to be taking a new medicine. But, he thinks I should withdraw from my summer class since my OCD is severe. I have not decided yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 27, 2013 Author Share Posted June 27, 2013 My counselor said that OCD is uncertainty. I definitely believe that. If anyone else with OCD/Scrupulosity saw this thread, I hope thet realize they are not alone. It's tough, but I feel in time, I'll get better. But, something else is on my mind. Something doesn't add up in regards to Satan. I don't think it's a good idea to do serious research until I start to feel better but there are some things that REALLY don't add up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhim Posted June 27, 2013 Share Posted June 27, 2013 Hunter, just a thought for your consideration. You've talked about how you're currently scared out of your mind and how invoking Jesus' name is helping to quell that fear. If you feel that "converting" back to Christianity is a temporary solution to all this, then by all means do so. However, I think you know at a higher level that this is just a trick you're using to calm your mind. So I would very, very strongly suggest that you not speak to any Christians or go anywhere near a church. Getting socially involved with Christians will make it all the more difficult to get back out when you come to your senses. By all means tell yourself that you're a Christian if it makes you feel better. But one need only look at the many ex-Christians here on this forum who attend church and other social obligations to avoid revealing themselves to the Christian community to realize how strong of a pressure Christian community can exert. Do yourself a favor: if you must convince your subconscious that you've converted back to Christianity to stop being paralyzed with fear of hell as you currently are, at least look out for yourself and don't get involved with any actual Christians. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
directionless Posted June 27, 2013 Share Posted June 27, 2013 Hunter, in case it might work for you, I feel a lot better psychologically after I do some cardio exercise. My problem is mostly depression though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 27, 2013 Author Share Posted June 27, 2013 Hunter, in case it might work for you, I feel a lot better psychologically after I do some cardio exercise. My problem is mostly depression though. I could try. Hunter, just a thought for your consideration. You've talked about how you're currently scared out of your mind and how invoking Jesus' name is helping to quell that fear. If you feel that "converting" back to Christianity is a temporary solution to all this, then by all means do so. However, I think you know at a higher level that this is just a trick you're using to calm your mind. So I would very, very strongly suggest that you not speak to any Christians or go anywhere near a church. Getting socially involved with Christians will make it all the more difficult to get back out when you come to your senses. By all means tell yourself that you're a Christian if it makes you feel better. But one need only look at the many ex-Christians here on this forum who attend church and other social obligations to avoid revealing themselves to the Christian community to realize how strong of a pressure Christian community can exert. Do yourself a favor: if you must convince your subconscious that you've converted back to Christianity to stop being paralyzed with fear of hell as you currently are, at least look out for yourself and don't get involved with any actual Christians. I think my fear of hell may have increased but it's still more or less a fear of Satan. But, like I said in my last post, I've beginning to notice things aren't adding up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhim Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 I think my fear of hell may have increased but it's still more or less a fear of Satan. But, like I said in my last post, I've beginning to notice things aren't adding up. That's good, and it means that at some point soon you intend to move past Christianity. All I'm saying is that when that time comes, it's going to be really hard if you've acquired a group of Christian friends who pressure you to remain Christian. Best to let any "conversion" to Christianity happen solely in your mind, and not tell any Christians about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 28, 2013 Author Share Posted June 28, 2013 Is it true that Satan is not used as a proper noun in Scripture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenstar Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 I know a little about this.. early in the OT 'satan' is a title.. not a name. A role played by a member of god's 'court' in accordance to god's will... in the story of Job we see the original role of 'the satan'. This meaning changed over time and with exposure to other beliefs, such as Zoroastrianism - which has a dichotomous cosmic principle... a good force and an evil one in a power struggle. This was never a part of Hebrew belief until much later. A Jew would never believe that any being had any say over God's will. It's just not possible in Jewish theology. So... where do Christians get this idea from? Hint: It's not from Judaism. The 'satan' that most of us grew up with in our culture is a patchwork of many different beliefs and a lot of mediaeval hysteria and a lot of Christian fear... the Catholic Church had a lot to do with this as well, as a way to keep the flock under their wing. Danté and Faust also have to be given credit for forming our modern concept. Knowledge truly will set you free... but take care of your health first... and take your time. I have anxiety and a panic disorder too, one day at a time, easy does it.. etc... be gentle with yourself. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 29, 2013 Author Share Posted June 29, 2013 That's one thing that doesn't add up to me. How did Satan become this literal evil being the New Testament if Satan in the Old Testament was a title and not a name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centauri Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 That's one thing that doesn't add up to me. How did Satan become this literal evil being the New Testament if Satan in the Old Testament was a title and not a name? It's the process of evolution, and wonderful example of it. Persian duality may have played a large part in this metamorphosis. Keep in mind that Jewish beliefs were not immune from influence and Jews were, according to the Bible, carried off to exile in "Persia". Duality, or good and evil, is a recurring theme in many belief systems. Some of this can be seen in the Christian Gnostics as well. Good cop / Bad cop is another way to look at it. In standard Christianity, people cannot bear the idea of "God" creating anything "bad". They create a surrogate to blame and be to afraid of because they've been taught over and over that "God is love". Satan is a whipping boy, a Lex Luthor character. There is no rebellious "Satan" in the Old Testament. There is not one instance where Satan ever disobeys a command from God in the Old Testament. Satan means the adversary and in the Old Testament, Satan is God's servant who tests humans. He's an adversary to humans, not to God. God creates all things, including evil (Isa 45:7). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 There's a movie I saw recently that I thought was pretty good, a woman, an artist, did a gallery show and one of her pieces was a contract for her soul, to be sold to a buyer. I'll try to think of the name of the movie; it was multi-lingual, Chris Rock was in it as the husband. Some interesting arguments were made at the end when this crazy guy purchased the contract and refused to give it back to her after she freaked out about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 29, 2013 Author Share Posted June 29, 2013 That's one thing that doesn't add up to me. How did Satan become this literal evil being the New Testament if Satan in the Old Testament was a title and not a name? It's the process of evolution, and wonderful example of it. Persian duality may have played a large part in this metamorphosis. Keep in mind that Jewish beliefs were not immune from influence and Jews were, according to the Bible, carried off to exile in "Persia". Duality, or good and evil, is a recurring theme in many belief systems. Some of this can be seen in the Christian Gnostics as well. Good cop / Bad cop is another way to look at it. In standard Christianity, people cannot bear the idea of "God" creating anything "bad". They create a surrogate to blame and be to afraid of because they've been taught over and over that "God is love". Satan is a whipping boy, a Lex Luthor character. There is no rebellious "Satan" in the Old Testament. There is not one instance where Satan ever disobeys a command from God in the Old Testament. Satan means the adversary and in the Old Testament, Satan is God's servant who tests humans. He's an adversary to humans, not to God. God creates all things, including evil (Isa 45:7). If Satan in the Bible is not a literal being, what confuses me is the verse where it says "It is by the prince of demons that he drives out demons". (Apologies if I got it wrong). I'm also aware that when Jesus rebuked Peter, Jesus was NOT calling Peter "Satan" as in a literal being, he was calling Peter "a Satan". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralet Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 As far as I know: in the new testament the word devil was sometimes translated from the greek "Beelzebub" (in some bibles it is still "beelzebub") which is a "translation" of the name of a certain god that had been worshiped in OT times in Philistines. The Pharisees heard this. So they said, “This fellow drives out demons by the power of Beelzebub, the prince of demons.”Matthew 12:24 Even if the new testament writers believed in Satan as a person, it is still a belief that evolved over time like the concept of hell. Hell evolved from "the grave" in OT to a place of torture in the book of revelation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
directionless Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 I think some of the current ideas about Satan came from the apocrypha and pseudepigrapha books (maybe the Book of Enoch but I'm not sure). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centauri Posted June 30, 2013 Share Posted June 30, 2013 That's one thing that doesn't add up to me. How did Satan become this literal evil being the New Testament if Satan in the Old Testament was a title and not a name? It's the process of evolution, and wonderful example of it. Persian duality may have played a large part in this metamorphosis. Keep in mind that Jewish beliefs were not immune from influence and Jews were, according to the Bible, carried off to exile in "Persia". Duality, or good and evil, is a recurring theme in many belief systems. Some of this can be seen in the Christian Gnostics as well. Good cop / Bad cop is another way to look at it. In standard Christianity, people cannot bear the idea of "God" creating anything "bad". They create a surrogate to blame and be to afraid of because they've been taught over and over that "God is love". Satan is a whipping boy, a Lex Luthor character. There is no rebellious "Satan" in the Old Testament. There is not one instance where Satan ever disobeys a command from God in the Old Testament. Satan means the adversary and in the Old Testament, Satan is God's servant who tests humans. He's an adversary to humans, not to God. God creates all things, including evil (Isa 45:7). If Satan in the Bible is not a literal being, what confuses me is the verse where it says "It is by the prince of demons that he drives out demons". (Apologies if I got it wrong). I'm also aware that when Jesus rebuked Peter, Jesus was NOT calling Peter "Satan" as in a literal being, he was calling Peter "a Satan". Well, I read Satan in Job as being one of God's many sons, an angel who serves as man's accuser in God's court. Zecharia seems to confirm this. I suppose Satan could also be a sort of shape shifter than can manifest in physical form or reside in an energy state. That would be more in line with the New Testament (John 13:27). Also worth noting is that God sends evil spirits to do his work (1 Sam 16:14). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted June 30, 2013 Share Posted June 30, 2013 2 Days in New York was the name of that movie where the woman sells her soul. The arguments to look for are at the end when she's talking to the crazy guy who bought it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 30, 2013 Author Share Posted June 30, 2013 This intrusive thought still seems to be common in OCD. As for Satan, what do you have to say about Satan being the ego? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted June 30, 2013 Author Share Posted June 30, 2013 In regards to my above post, here are two similar articles that say Satan is the ego. I believe this author is indeed a Christian. http://jacobisrael.com/2012/05/07/mans-ego-is-the-devil/ http://jacobisrael.com/category/satan-revealed/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
directionless Posted June 30, 2013 Share Posted June 30, 2013 That makes sense to me (about the ego being a source of problems) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted July 3, 2013 Author Share Posted July 3, 2013 But, one thing bothers me. If Satan is real, why does he bother believers if he even thinks they will pray? If Satan is the "enemy" of God, why would he cause people to pray? Some will say he is prideful but does prideful always mean stupidity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
directionless Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 My mind is playing tricks on me again it seems because I thought I heard "Satan" speaking to me today. But, one thing bothers me. If Satan is real, why does he bother believers if he even thinks they will pray? If Satan is the "enemy" of God, why would he cause people to pray? Some will say he is prideful but does prideful always mean stupidity? That's interesting, because it sounds so much like my thinking from several years ago. So like you said, it doesn't make sense that Satan would scare you into being a Christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter93 Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 Well, I didn't pray at first but it got so bad. Praying/believing is what helping me cope. Though, my last post did have a flaw: One could argue that Satan is simply trying to draw people away. But, shouldn't even the slightest hint of prayer be a deterrent? It also brings up this though: Who, no matter how prideful or arrogant, would even TRY to rebel against an all-powerful God? And I know that Lucifer is NOT Satan as well. So, who exactly is Satan? And why is there so much confusion surrounding this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Well, I didn't pray at first but it got so bad. Praying/believing is what helping me cope. Though, my last post did have a flaw: One could argue that Satan is simply trying to draw people away. But, shouldn't even the slightest hint of prayer be a deterrent? It also brings up this though: Who, no matter how prideful or arrogant, would even TRY to rebel against an all-powerful God? And I know that Lucifer is NOT Satan as well. So, who exactly is Satan? And why is there so much confusion surrounding this? You are addicted to fictional characters. Imagine not being addicted to fictional characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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