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As long as Xtianity claims it and it alone has the TRUTH, and that everybody else is lying or deceived,

there will be wars and rumors of wars. There will be hostile conflict where ever there are christians.

There will be an impassable divide between Xtians and the rest of the world. The Xtians preach humility, but, in fact,they are the most arrogant people in the world. How can one reason with them? Before you try to remove the speck from your neighbor's eye, remove the boulder from your own. bill

Over stated ,But point taken  I don't have the answer, Wish I did.  But tell me ? Hows this working for you???

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If you had started off sincere then maybe this conversation would have gone better.   Okay you want the answers.  Heb 13:8 says Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever.  That means that Jesus

As far as I can tell, this is the pot calling the kettle black.    We're over here minding our own business, and then this guy comes in and pokes with a stick... just like he's saying other people d

Lev 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

 

People use the Bible to justify their actions  And ignorant people blame it on the words of a book????  The bible does not tell anyone to kill gays.  Obviously you ,like many others, choose to repeat something you know little to nothing about.

 

On the other hand, a majority of people on this planet do not use the Bible to justify their actions.

 

Point taken

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what the fuck is he talking about?

 

Sounds like more christian whining... wwwwaaaahhhhh, we aren't be treated fairly!  wwahhh.. we are persecuted!

 

Truth is truth.. and evidence and rational thinking win hands down every time, if it's a game. It's not though... but being all fluff bunny and nicey nice doesn't always work. I'm here because I'm comfortable here, and I can speak my mind within certain parameters... and sometimes my mind is ROYALLY PISSED OFF. at religion.

 

You follow your conscience, I'll follow mine... thank you very much. If it makes you uncomfortable I suggest you go somewhere where people won't challenge you. 

 

sheesh

 

Florduh.. awesome! I give you a thumbs up!

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Troll: THE BIBLE DOESN'T SAY TO KILL GAYS AND YOU ARE ALL JERKS AND IDIOTS ZOMGLOLBBQ!!!!!!!

 

Poster 1: Yeah, I think it does.

 

Poster 2: Yes, it does. Here is the book, chapter, and verse in which it says to do so.

 

Troll: WHERE? SHOW ME PROOF, MUTHAFUCKA!

 

*reads Poster 2's post*

 

Troll: ZOMG, SO WHAT IF IT SAYS THAT?

 

And with that, I'm done here. 

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Troll: THE BIBLE DOESN'T SAY TO KILL GAYS AND YOU ARE ALL JERKS AND IDIOTS ZOMGLOLBBQ!!!!!!!

 

Poster 1: Yeah, I think it does.

 

Poster 2: Yes, it does. Here is the book, chapter, and verse in which it says to do so.

 

Troll: WHERE? SHOW ME PROOF, MUTHAFUCKA!

 

*reads Poster 2's post*

 

Troll: ZOMG, SO WHAT IF IT SAYS THAT?

 

And with that, I'm done here. 

Yep. Troll.

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Dear Ranting Troll:

 

If you intend to engage in meaningful dialog here, please do so very soon. If you have doubts about your fait, we can help you. If you want to lead us to the Lord, please have at it. 

 

But if you're just going to rant and respond to legitimate comments and answers with "Oh yeah? So's your mama" responses, then you can get the fuck out of here right now.

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 The bible does not tell anyone to kill gays.  Obviously you ,like many others, choose to repeat something you know little to nothing about.

 

 

I was a Christian for 33 years.  How many years does a person have to be a Christian before they learn something about being a Christian?

 

Lev 20:13 exists.  My point was that some people take it literally and that is dangerous.

 

Perhaps you are the one who doesn't understand the Bible as well as they think they do.

 

I've had a drivers licence for 46 years. Doesn't prove I can drive today.  Lev 20,13 does exist but it does not command anyone to kill!!

 

My point was that some people take it literally and that is dangerous.     My point is find those people and deal with them.  Assuming and acting on that assumption is doing more harm than Good.  And no better than the "Christians "you rail agaianst

 

 

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

 

 

I don't have the power to find every Christian in the world who has a whacked view of the Bible.  There is just one of me and millions of them.  And what would you have me to do with all those Christians if I could deal with them?

 

Stop acting like a troll.  

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It seems like you are either trolling or have very real and serious doubts about your religion. Clearly you are disassociating the negatives into a separate category of belief. This allows you to both maintain your moral principles and beliefs while they are in conflict. What is your opinion on witch hunting in Africa. The bible CLEARLY says you shall not suffer a witch to live. Parents are burning their kids alive and this is a fairly recent occurrence due to the introduction of Christianity.

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To be honest, (I'm poppin' popcorn!), I don't think this is the right time or place to be accusing an entire forum of being "punk ass kids". It's obvious that you don't understand why this forum exists, and the people who post here regularly. It looks like you just chose a "nonxtian" site, had a few drinks, and decided to tell everyone how you REALLY feel. 

The Lion's Den seems more appropriate if you want to carry on like this. (But nowhere is behavior like this really appropriate).

Making an effort to understand the people here will get you much farther than accusing everyone out right of being punks. You are the one who entered our proverbial house guns a'blazin'. Settle down, sparky. Calm the hell down. This is supposed to be a safe place for people, and your tone is very hostile. 

 

As Floriduh said, if you've got something intelligent to say, now is the time to say it, or be forever written off as a maniac troll. (Meaning: Put the pistols away, and sit down to have a civil, back-and-forth sort of conversation, or get the hell out). 

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 The bible does not tell anyone to kill gays.  Obviously you ,like many others, choose to repeat something you know little to nothing about.

 

 

I was a Christian for 33 years.  How many years does a person have to be a Christian before they learn something about being a Christian?

 

Lev 20:13 exists.  My point was that some people take it literally and that is dangerous.

 

Perhaps you are the one who doesn't understand the Bible as well as they think they do.

 

I've had a drivers licence for 46 years. Doesn't prove I can drive today.  Lev 20,13 does exist but it does not command anyone to kill!!

 

My point was that some people take it literally and that is dangerous.     My point is find those people and deal with them.  Assuming and acting on that assumption is doing more harm than Good.  And no better than the "Christians "you rail agaianst

 

 

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

 

 

I don't have the power to find every Christian in the world who has a whacked view of the Bible.  There is just one of me and millions of them.  And what would you have me to do with all those Christians if I could deal with them?

 

Stop acting like a troll.  

 

No you don't and neither do I. But the two of us can do more together than all the people in the world can do by building walls of hate and prejudice.

 

And the next time someone says;" the Bible says" please verify it before you repeat it. .

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It seems like you are either trolling or have very real and serious doubts about your religion. Clearly you are disassociating the negatives into a separate category of belief. This allows you to both maintain your moral principles and beliefs while they are in conflict. What is your opinion on witch hunting in Africa. The bible CLEARLY says you shall not suffer a witch to live. Parents are burning their kids alive and this is a fairly recent occurrence due to the introduction of Christianity.

Hi James,

 

I might be crazy (I don't drink)Wendycrazy.gif but that is a different topic.  My moral principles and my faith are one and the same so there is no conflict there

 

I got tired of trying the same ole thing and getting the same result.  So I decided to try something different . Lucky You get to deal with it.

 

 

Sincerely

Cliff 

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No you don't and neither do I. But the two of us can do more together than all the people in the world can do by building walls of hate and prejudice.

 

And the next time someone says;" the Bible says" please verify it before you repeat it. .

 

 

I don't build walls of hate and prejudice.  And I did verify that the Bible commands that gays should be killed.  For all your huffing and puffing you were completely wrong.  I actually learned more about the Bible in the first year of leaving Christianity then I did in all my decades as a Christian despite the hours I spent in study.  Starting off with the wrong assumptions can prevent learning.

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Read it again friend    . It says that they shall be put to death        !. That is not the same as kill them.  2.God was making a statement.  not giving a command. 3. That statement was to a particular people at a particular time, under certain conditions  none of which are present today.

The apologetic you're employing here is the type that inspires scorn for believers by unbelievers.

The reason for this is that believers so often can't admit the obvious.

God was indeed issuing a command.

 

Lev 20:13

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

 

The context of Lev 20 consists of instructions to the people concerning punishments for serious crimes..

 

Lev 20:1-2

And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,

Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones.

 

The people are the instruments that carry out the penalty.

See Num 15:32-36 for a very clear example of the death penalty being carried out as commanded by God.

 

God's morals are supposed to be absolute which means they don't change with the times. 

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Nice example of reality denial and backpedaling this morontheist is, no?

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It seems like you are either trolling or have very real and serious doubts about your religion. Clearly you are disassociating the negatives into a separate category of belief. This allows you to both maintain your moral principles and beliefs while they are in conflict. What is your opinion on witch hunting in Africa. The bible CLEARLY says you shall not suffer a witch to live. Parents are burning their kids alive and this is a fairly recent occurrence due to the introduction of Christianity.

Hi James,

 

I might be crazy (I don't drink)Wendycrazy.gif but that is a different topic.  My moral principles and my faith are one and the same so there is no conflict there

 

I got tired of trying the same ole thing and getting the same result.  So I decided to try something different . Lucky You get to deal with it.

 

 

Sincerely

Cliff 

 

I never said you are in conflict I shall clarify. In order to maintain your morals you have disassociated the negative aspects of the bible so you don't have to deal with it. Suddenly anything outside of your morality is not Christian. i.e. slavery genocide witch hunting bigotry segregation.

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All right, Clifford. I really wanna give you the benefit of the doubt, despite having a feeling deep down that you're here to start shit with us. For starters, calling us all punk ass kids is so patronizing when we've got people on this board from high school kids to retirees, and that makes you look ignorant. Second of all, when you make the claims, the burden of proof is on you, not us. Putting the onus on us to prove your claims is dishonest at best. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

 

On the other hand, you might have some legitimate doubts about the faith you lay claim to. Fine. We've had doubts too, and we've faced them head-on. Just don't take it out on us if you want us to take you seriously.

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Read it again friend    . It says that they shall be put to death        !. That is not the same as kill them.  2.God was making a statement.  not giving a command. 3. That statement was to a particular people at a particular time, under certain conditions  none of which are present today.

The apologetic you're employing here is the type that inspires scorn for believers by unbelievers.

The reason for this is that believers so often can't admit the obvious.

God was indeed issuing a command.

 

Lev 20:13

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

 

The context of Lev 20 consists of instructions to the people concerning punishments for serious crimes..

 

Lev 20:1-2

And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,

Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones.

 

The people are the instruments that carry out the penalty.

See Num 15:32-36 for a very clear example of the death penalty being carried out as commanded by God.

 

God's morals are supposed to be absolute which means they don't change with the times. 

 

You all sure like to label things don't you.

 

God's morals are supposed to be absolute which means they don't change with the times.  

 

Where did you get this from?

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Guess I'm not a Christian??? I haven't punished or killed any body ,much less by order of God.

 

 

 

Nah, you are just a Punk Ass Troll.  Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

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God's morals are supposed to be absolute which means they don't change with the times.  

 

Where did you get this from?

 

 

 

yelrotflmao.gif     Punk Ass Troll doesn't even know the Bible.

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God's morals are supposed to be absolute which means they don't change with the times.

 

Where did you get this from?

 

 

 

yelrotflmao.gif     Punk Ass Troll doesn't even know the Bible.

 

That was a sincere and legitimate Question. 

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That was a sincere and legitimate Question. 

 

 

 

If you had started off sincere then maybe this conversation would have gone better.

 

Okay you want the answers.  Heb 13:8 says Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever.  That means that Jesus who loves the whole world was the God who was commanding all the genocide in the Old Testament.  (It's a contradiction)

 

Mal 3:8 says that God does not change.  So, if Trinity were true, then the God who was commanding all the genocide in the Old Testament was also the God who loves the whole world so much that he wants everybody to be saved.  (Again a contradiction)

 

Psalm 119:89 says that God's word is firmly fixed and does not change.  (So it won't become "completed" and it won't get canceled.  There will be no New Covenant.)

 

Numbers 23:19 says that God does not change his mind and God is NOT a Son of Man.  (Wow talk about killing Christianity)

 

 

But just stop for a moment and think about it.  It God's will, law and views of sin change then that would make them relative.  That would mean one day God might love slavery and then a few thousand years later God might hate slavery.  No reason.  God just changes his mind.  That would mean all of God's commandments are arbitrary.  We have to obey because God told us - no other reason.  It makes God a dictator.  It means God is going to punish us for not mindlessly obeying his arbitrary law.

 

So which is it?  Is God a good and just father who is teaching us as best as we will co-operate or did God tell people that they could attack their neighboring countries, murder all of the adults, the women, the elderly, the little boys and spare only the little girls who were still virgins to keep for their own enjoyment?  Do you know what the Bible commands be done to those who try to lead the Jewish people to follow gods they have never heard of?  In the Old Testament God the Son is an unknown God.  The Holy Spirit is an unknown God.  Think about it, idolator.

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That was a sincere and legitimate Question. 

 

 

 

If you had started off sincere then maybe this conversation would have gone better.

 

Okay you want the answers.  Heb 13:8 says Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever.  That means that Jesus who loves the whole world was the God who was commanding all the genocide in the Old Testament.  (It's a contradiction)

 

Mal 3:8 says that God does not change.  So, if Trinity were true, then the God who was commanding all the genocide in the Old Testament was also the God who loves the whole world so much that he wants everybody to be saved.  (Again a contradiction)

 

Psalm 119:89 says that God's word is firmly fixed and does not change.  (So it won't become "completed" and it won't get canceled.  There will be no New Covenant.)

 

Numbers 23:19 says that God does not change his mind and God is NOT a Son of Man.  (Wow talk about killing Christianity)

 

 

But just stop for a moment and think about it.  It God's will, law and views of sin change then that would make them relative.  That would mean one day God might love slavery and then a few thousand years later God might hate slavery.  No reason.  God just changes his mind.  That would mean all of God's commandments are arbitrary.  We have to obey because God told us - no other reason.  It makes God a dictator.  It means God is going to punish us for not mindlessly obeying his arbitrary law.

 

So which is it?  Is God a good and just father who is teaching us as best as we will co-operate or did God tell people that they could attack their neighboring countries, murder all of the adults, the women, the elderly, the little boys and spare only the little girls who were still virgins to keep for their own enjoyment?  Do you know what the Bible commands be done to those who try to lead the Jewish people to follow gods they have never heard of?  In the Old Testament God the Son is an unknown God.  The Holy Spirit is an unknown God.  Think about it, idolator.

For all we "KNOW" God could be a child playing with building blocks in another dimension or we could be nothing more than a lump in giant bowl of cosmic soup.  You might know why we exist on this big marble But I sure don't.  Nor can I tell you what His motivation  or purpose is.  

 

I cannot explain a lot of things , but I can tell you what I believe and why I believe it.  

 

"So which is it": You ask.  My answer is; "God is a good and just father who is teaching us as best as we will co-operate" .

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I cannot explain a lot of things , but I can tell you what I believe and why I believe it.  

 

"So which is it": You ask.  My answer is; "God is a good and just father who is teaching us as best as we will co-operate" .

 

     Well, you did one of those two things.  50% is pretty good...if we were flipping coins or something.

 

     Anyhow, you're exactly right.  Your god is exactly however you've defined it in your opinion.  Well done.  I truly accept this god exists in your mind.  This is how it works and you've nailed it.

 

          mwc

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  Xians and non-Xians ,like little punk-assed kids poking at each other through the fence.,grabbing each others toys and trying to break them, beating each other over the dammed head with rediculess   straw-man  arguments. Patting each other on the back for how insulting, prejudice, bigoted, nasty, insensitive,  narrow fucking minded and just plain stupid you all can be

 

Where's your fucking score card !!!!!   You all are so Dammed consumed with playing the stupid assed game and winning each side has to have it's own score card. Where's Yours????What the Hell is the point value for hurting the feelings of another human being??? for insult, for embarrassing yourself or another in public, Is there bonus points for making fun of  an other's short comings an infirmities???? There has to be penalties for signs of kindness and understanding  Right?!?!?.

 

Got a rule book??I get that you got to pay to play. Somebody 's got to maintain the field (forum) Right?!?!?! So that means you have the right to bash the enemy behind their back for thinks you think they they think do or say???

 

No way any of you can can be accused of breaking any rule. If there was ever any form of guidelines or rules of conduct you all have thrown them out or burned them long time ago.  I get this part ,I really do . . . It's so much easier to make the rules as you go..  Ya makem ,then you breakem ,then you throw em away  easy as one, two ,three..Wendyloser.gif Makes it easier to sleep at night, doesn't it

 

If there are rules hiding around somewhere these would be them.

 

1. Don't give" them" an even break.

2 Get "them" before they get you

3 The only thing better than 5 on one is 7,8,,9, or 1000 on one.

4 Never miss a chance to poke at "them"

5 Do it now, justify it later

6 Always always Always always CLAIM the fame and PASS the blame 

7 Never ever ,ever, ever admit any fault or apologize 

8 Never let your conscience be your guide

9 sympathy is never acceptable 

10 True sincerity is never to be tolerated.

11 Never take prisoners

12 Never play by rules that can be explained or justified

 

What  Dammed PLAYING FIELD ?

 

Got no parameters. . Anything goes ,any  time any place. any way just so it  makes you happy. . "Their " beliefs", their family, their intelligence,  An uneven  field is required. You always have to have the advantage, what ever that may be. Can't be caught looking up to the enemy for any reason

 

 

Is there a point at all to this.

 

I know this is a rant and it is indeed in the right section of this forum but it doesn't seem to have a point other than you cry'n like a girl and the very punk you are referring to.

 

You use the word enemy but who here is your enemy? As far as I can tell (and I am on a dozen of these religious forums) this is one of the most civil atheist/theist forums on the internet. There are others that are nicer in language but they have no real debate or interest in them at all they are bland. This forum is mostly civil people don't go on terrible racist rants and all that. Sure it gets hot and it "seems" there are no rules but how many rules should arguments and debates about these issues really have. They are pretty wild ideas on both sides.

 

I am very happy that you have a strong enough opinion to rant about it like this. It really shows that you are using both your emotion and in the end logic to look at the world. It takes both as a human to be right.

 

You might want to consider stepping back and remembering that before anything we are all human and all together here even if we don't agree. There is no other planet to hop to or secret hidden continent to hide on away from all this percieved punk behavior you refer to.

 

I for one am educated and not a child. You can call me a punk all day and I will never think twice about it. What are your words compared to what I know to be true about myself? What are your thoughts but just another voice in an endless sea of opinions spread around this world ever faster as communications get easier? I think you what came here expecting that people would agree with you?

 

This is a place for EX I repeat EX christians to hang out and discuss. You are free to come here and take part but make no mistake, the reason they are here is to have people OTHER than people like you to talk with. They also come here and learn how to deal with this level of arrogance so they can say I have had enough right to your little entitled arrogant better than me cause you pray face. Sorry about that and I could have used curses and explatives but instead I used words that defined your very attitude in your post.

 

I guess all of my rant is trying to say this one thing:

 

Insert quarter to try again...

 

 

p.s. 

I never give anyone a break including myself. I am now and always accountable for myself period. I will hold you to that standard.

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