Do you think abortion is wrong?

[Japedo]

A Very classy spot on Post SN!

 

I have the same WTF view on the advertisements for family time, it's shameful it even has to be put out there.

 

I've never had an abortion either. I'm married for 16 years and have 4 kids. However, I feel the option should be there for people who need it. I've known quit a few friends who went thru with them. Not one of them regrets it today. People know their own limits and know their own circumstances, It bothers me when people sit on their high horse and paint people as lazy or loose, they are hurtful words that are easily said without knowing the details of peoples lives.

 

Wolf, no Flame war.. Just passionate stances is all. I'm an opinionated women whataya expect?

 

I didn't mean to make ya feel like it was a pissin match.

[greygirl]

My argument makes perfect sense. It is a seperate organism that is in a measurable process of development. Hence it may live in the woman's body for a time but clearly is not the same as her own body. Seems pretty clear to me

 

A tapeworm is a seperate organism. Does it also have the right to inhabit my body without my permission?

 

Pregnancy is very risky. A woman who is pregnant is very much in danger. The fetus is feeding off her, taking nutrients that she needs to survive, causing her internal organs to shift around, permanently changing her body in ways that could have lifelong consequences. Labor and delivery are incredibly painful, and far more women die in childbirth than from abortions. It's not matter of just letting the fetus live in there for a while.

 

Your argument is completely illogical, no matter how determined you are to pretend that it is.

[Taphophilia]

As a mother of teenage daughters, who has talked more than 100 teenage girls, I can tell you that their are only a small number of teenage girls who know the facts about how not to get pregnant, how to get birth control, and how to use it. It's easy to say use birth control, but it's not real life to think that everyone who needs it is going to be educated about it.

 

Parents who don't talk to their kids are the reality. It seems most parents think that by not explaining to their kids about birth control they won't need it, or they will figure it out for themselves. School health class only gives biology lessons and does not educate anything but abstinence. The myths prevail and are reinforced by other girls.

[Asimov]

My argument makes perfect sense. It is a seperate organism that is in a measurable process of development. Hence it may live in the woman's body for a time but clearly is not the same as her own body. Seems pretty clear to me

 

This point has already been talked about, and I agree with greygirl.

 

What does identity have to do with threat level? If something is not a threat, then why kill it, unless for food? And since we don't eat fetuses, there is normally no need to kill a child that does not endanger the mother's life. Of course, each case isn't the same, so flexibilty is logical. I don't see the problem here - except that I view abortion as a medical procedure to be utilized when necessary, not a dogma that no mortal may dare question.

 

I see no compelling evidence and shall remain a happy heretic.

 

What does threat level have to do with what I said? We don't live in the wild, this is not an assessment of "threat" or risk (in a few cases, yes). Abortion is a medical procedure to be utilized when necessary, yes, and who gets to decide when that is necessary? You or the person who's carrying the damn thing?

 

Most abortions occur before the 12th week of pregnancy, and it's not even a fetus, not even close to a human being in all senses of the word at those points when abortions occur. It has no pain receptors, it's brain isn't fully developed, it's organs aren't fully developed, and it is still feeding off the mother for support, life, and sustenance.

 

Identity is very important, and a "zygote" has no identity as a human being. It is mostly a "growth" attached to the mother. Whether the argument is compelling or not, you have no right to dictate whether a mother should or shouldn't give birth.

[Thurisaz]

Thurisaz and Wolfheart, I'm not out adopting or even offering up foster care...are you?

 

Believe it or not, I'm currently considering that seriously.

 

Now, I guess I'll drop out of this thread. Abortion is a hot and difficult topic. I haven't seen any statement in this thread that is completely nonsensical, and I guess we can debate and cuss around for months on end without getting anywhere.

There are things I'd consider worthy of such an unending debate, but this isn't. Not under these circumstances that is. To the rest of you, enjoy the rest of this thread

[Guest DrepmoreH]

In my area you only hear one side of the story and that's the pro-life side. I believe I'm pro-choice because if I got a girl pregnant I'd definitely want her to have an abortion and its not murder like some pro-lifers say. What do you think of this issue as an ex-christian?

 

Its a tricky area really. I do believe that the decision should be completely up to the people involved. Whether or not it is right or moral depends completely upon the set of cirumstances. There are no absolutes. There are however situations where abortion is the best option. Hmmmm.

[Antlerman]

This is the only reply that makes sense to me. We must be responsible for our actions. The truth of the matter is, most people are just self absorbed lazy bastards who would rather discard a life than get off their lazy asses to find a job that would support a child. Adoption is still an option isn't it? I might not be here today if my mother's parents would have decided to abort her. They made a responsible decision when they decided to give her up for adoption.

 

and btw... the morning after pill should take care of the rape victims so there is no need to argue that any further.

You are a prime example of why modern Christianity is failing as a spiritual system. “One size fits all.” You have it all figured out, neat and simple from your perspective from where you live. Go to the bible and make your perspective have teeth by reading it to make it fit your views of how culutre should work in your world.

 

Fuck sociologists, economists, psychologists, scientists, archeologists, and most importantly ----- compassion. "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps and get a job like the rest of us! There is no reason everyone can't get what I got!" Such an overly simplistic view of the world. So nice for you to be so sheltered, and ignorant.

 

BTW, "Judge not, lest ye be judged". Ring a bell?

 

What has Christianity done for you, Narrow_Minded (your new online alias I will call you going forward)? From what I see, not too much to make you any better than carnal minded self-righteous. So far the only thing your showing anyone here is why Christianity is anti-spritiual. Thanks for the lesson in arogance.

[jjacksonRIAB]

In my area you only hear one side of the story and that's the pro-life side. I believe I'm pro-choice because if I got a girl pregnant I'd definitely want her to have an abortion and its not murder like some pro-lifers say. What do you think of this issue as an ex-christian?

 

I hate the issue.

 

I even hate how they call it "pro-life" and "pro-choice". The "pro-life" side makes no sense. It's not even accurate. They only mean humans. A cluster of cells is somehow precious as long as they contain human DNA. Are they 99.4% anti-chimp abortion, then? 50% anti-ejaculation and 50% anti-period?

 

They can shut the hell up.

[Taphophilia]

This is the only reply that makes sense to me. We must be responsible for our actions. The truth of the matter is, most people are just self absorbed lazy bastards who would rather discard a life than get off their lazy asses to find a job that would support a child. Adoption is still an option isn't it? I might not be here today if my mother's parents would have decided to abort her. They made a responsible decision when they decided to give her up for adoption.

 

and btw... the morning after pill should take care of the rape victims so there is no need to argue that any further.

 

I can't believe I missed this jewel.

 

Wow, mcmilliron, you have such of a grasp of the social sciences. Did you major in sociology to have such insight and observations on society? or are you a prodigy?

 

You should really contact a socical scientist at the PhD level because you surely know the solutions to the problems they spend their entire lives studying.

 

Taph

[Guest Emerson]

I think it needs to be legal and I'm for it. Just because we are capable of having children doesn't mean we want them, and there's nothing wrong with NOT wanting children. Its better to not have them, than have them and resent them or have them come back and research you as an adult. I really hate how people think that those who choose to NOT have children are evil, lazy, selfish jerks.

 

Frankly those of us who choose to not have children should be applauded, having children isn't right for everyone. And just because I don't want to have my own doesn't mean I'm against motherhood, apple pies or children. I like children, I just don't want one and I don't want to take care of one.

[Amethyst]

I'd say it depends on the situation, just like a lot of things. I'm not a "black or white" type of person.

 

I'm pro-choice because I don't believe in forcing opinions down people's throats. Who am I to decide what another woman should do with her body? I personally wouldn't get an abortion, but I can understand why people do. I can put myself into their shoes.

 

I can't stand people who are pro-life because that's what they were told they have to be to get to heaven, or whatever. Use your own mind and make your decision either way.

 

I respect people who are pro-life not for religious reasons, but because they don't want to harm others. I can understand that, even if I don't agree with it 100%.

 

However, I personally don't think it's right to say even if the woman is going to die if she has the baby, even if they were raped or it was incest, that they should be forced to carry the baby to term. IMHO that's wrong, and not respecting the mother.

 

Nobody should be forced to do anything. It should be their choice in the end. That's just my opinion, though.

[Ouroboros]

I agree with Amethyst. It's from case to case. I don't like promoting abortion as a different kind of prevention pill. I feel like all life is important and should be protected. But then again, in many situations, it's better if the abortion is done.

 

The question pro-lifers should ask themselves (take from penn-teller bullshit show) if abortion is to be made illegal, what kind of punishment should the mother get? Fines? Jail? Death penalty? Or is it just a slap on the fingers and say "shame on you"?

[Evelyn]

I'm pro-choice. I think this should be a decision that a woman makes in discussion with her doctor and, perhaps, the father, if he's around. The state should butt out, except to make sure it is legal and safe.

[kellyb]

I have no problem with "the morning after pill".

Abortion starts to freak me out around the end of the first trimester, and I do not think elective 3rd trimester abortion should be legal.

 

If there's a human there, thinking human thoughts, feeling human pain, and generally being human, then I think the government should step in to protect that human.

As a quasi-libertarian, I think it's a just application of the government.

"Protect people from people".

[Asimov]

wrong thread...