Isaiah 17:1 Prophecy Being Fulfilled In Syria?

[TheSpiritualPilgrim]

Ok, so I woke up this morning to my Christian friends on Facebook getting all excited about the war in Syria saying that Damascus is going to end up "a ruinous heap" and the Isaiah 17:1 prophecy will be fulfilled. Of course they end with "Get ready! Jesus is coming!" So... comments, debunkers, supporters?

[centauri]

Ok, so I woke up this morning to my Christian friends on Facebook getting all excited about the war in Syria saying that Damascus is going to end up "a ruinous heap" and the Isaiah 17:1 prophecy will be fulfilled. Of course they end with "Get ready! Jesus is coming!" So... comments, debunkers, supporters?

It's pretty silly to associate Jesus with this.

Dire prophecies are also issued in Isa 18 and 19 against Cush and Egypt.

The prophecy in Isa 19 is far more compelling in comparison with current events.

However, there have been events throughout history that can be associated with these prophecies.

The Crusades could also have been called a "fulfillment".

If Christians want to tease this into a claim that Jesus is coming, they first have to show that Jesus fulfilled the messianic prophecies contained in the Old Testament.

He clearly did not, for there is nothing that states a king messiah would come once, be killed, and require a second coming to accomplish what he failed to do the first time.

Jesus also promised to return within the lifetimes of some of his disciples (Matt 16:27-28).

He didn't do that and is designated a false prophet.

If these Christians really take the Old Testament seriously and want to get worked up about these verses, they should get on their knees, repent of their false beliefs, convert to Judaism and await the actual messiah that is promised.

They operate off of a false premise, that Jesus met the scriptural requirements for a king messiah.

He failed completely to do that and issued false prophecy, which exposes him as a deceiver, not of God.

In any case, it's a lot of hot air designed to get people all worked up and eager to join the Christian cult.

[florduh]

Who is coming back? Was he even here in the first place? How about we establish that before we twist history and current events to match one mythology.

[Margee]

I also have been doing everything in my power not to watch these prophecy 'you-tubes!!!! they scare the crap out of me.....Helllllllllllpppp. I just can't take a step backwards. I'm already afraid  for the world as it is.........

[LifeCycle]

Christians just love destruction because it means prophecy is being fulfilled!  Praise Jesus, a city will be destroyed and a lot of innocent people will be killed so Jesus can return!!!

 

He could come back any time he wanted but nope, he's got to wait for more suffering to unfold. Gotta stick to the plan. 

[LifeCycle]

I also have been doing everything in my power not to watch these prophecy 'you-tubes!!!! they scare the crap out of me.....Helllllllllllpppp. I'm already afraid as it is.........

Don't be afraid. Stupid is not contagious.

[BrotherJosh]

Why can't a prophecy about solving world hunger or curing sickness be fulfilled? Seems prophecies are only about destruction...

[florduh]

Throughout my lifetime, I've seen claims that prophecy was being fulfilled every time somebody so much as farted anywhere in the Middle East. I see that this also happened long prior to my birth. Even as a believer, I was a little jaded on prophecy mania.

[Kris]

Even if this conflict escalates, I don't think that the entire city will be desolated-- most cities during war get torn up, but then afterword comes all the rebuilding money-- and Damascus will eventually recover.  I hate these prophecy-mongers. 

[Lerk]

Old Teatament prophecies about outcomes of battles were made by "prophets" for kings who were about to go to fight those battles, not about events thousands of years in the future. To judge whether it came true, you have to look at history. I haven't processed the statistics, but perhaps some have. It shouldn't be too hard to go back and figure out what the prophecies actually referred to, though.

[Overcame Faith]

This "prophecy" is not limited to Isaiah 17:1.  Rather, the entirety of Isaiah 17 is the "prophecy."  Read the entire chapter carefully and you will see that all of the things that are said in that chapter must occur simultaneously or "In that day".  At the very least that means that ALL of the things set forth in Isaiah 17 must occur within a reasonable time frame for this chapter-prophecy to have been fulfilled.

 

To illustrate, Isaiah 17:2 requires that the following happen:

² The cities of Aroer will be deserted
    and left to flocks, which will lie down,
    with no one to make them afraid.
 

Isaiah 17:2

 

Where exactly are the "cities of Aroer" so they can be deserted within a reasonable time frame of the destruction of Damascus?

 

I'll give you a hint: They no longer exist.  See, for example, what I have linked below in which the excavations of Aroer are discussed.  Excavations as in Aroer no longer exists:

 

http://www.antiquities.org.il/article_Item_eng.asp?sec_id=17&sub_subj_id=471&id=1216#as

 

Something else to think about.  Let's say that I say something like this:  "At a time in the future, the United States of America will no longer exist."  If 2,500 years from today the United States ceases to exist, do I get credit for being a prophet?  I don't think so.  For a prophet to get "credit" for his/her "prophecies," there must be some connection in time between the alleged prophecy and its alleged fulfillment.  By Isaiah 17:1 simply saying that Damascus will lay in a heap of ruins and then 2,500 years passing without it happening, the connection between the alleged prophecy and its occurrence (if we assume it would happen sometime soon) is too tenuous to give the "prophet" credit.  The reason is that there can be absolutely no doubt that one day Damascus (and every other city on earth) will lay in ruins for some reason or the other (new ice age, comet crashing to the Earth, earthquake, war, etc.).

 

The alleged prophecy of Isaiah Chapter 17 is another false prophecy that has not occurred and will not occur as required by the very words of that chapter.

 

Edited to add:  This is not to say that one day Damascus will not "Lay in Ruins."  Rather, if that were to happen to Damascus, it will not be the fulfillment of this "prophecy".

[TheSpiritualPilgrim]

Thanks Overcame Faith. Those are really good points. And yeah I find it so ridiculous that they are excited about an event where people will suffer. It makes no sense at all but then again they still believe that unbelief in God will send you to eternal torment.

[Overcame Faith]

Thanks Overcame Faith. Those are really good points. And yeah I find it so ridiculous that they are excited about an event where people will suffer. It makes no sense at all but then again they still believe that unbelief in God will send you to eternal torment.

I agree that it is appalling for people to be excited about what could be a great human tragedy. The more I think about it, there is a gross connection between Jesus' supposed return and death, destruction, and human misery. It's a sick religion that connects its leading figure with such evil.

 

The Jewish messiah was supposed to herald in world peace. It seems that all this false messiah, Jesus, can usher in, if the end-timers are to be believed, is the exact opposite. Hum? Come to think about it, maybe this Jesus is the antichrist.

[RipVanWinkle]

These Xtians who believe the prophesies don't care what happens to the rest of humanity; They only care

that they will be with Jesus for eternity. They don't even care about their own family members who

weren't saved. They warned them didn't they? bill

[◊ crazyguy123 ◊]

Who is coming back? Was he even here in the first place? How about we establish that before we twist history and current events to match one mythology.

 

Who is coming back. He was here already a long time ago and killed himself. What sent him. Who had a religion created and named after him and I Don't Know watches you sleep.

[LivingLife]

 

In fundieland, the ME is teh jeebus' G-spot. Any time it gets attention he is coming soon...

 

[themonkeyman]

Hey,

 

What I find odd is the fact that people never pointed to Isaiah 17 before.  I read alott about End Time Prophecy with this new pope and although its been debunked - I can confirm that I never seen anyone Quote Isaiah 17 or 19 for that matter in their viewpoint of the end times.

 

So this leaves us in an interesting position - Simply because its funny like the previous poster said that as soon as someone so much as farts in the middle east its suddenly the end times.

 

What I find most interesting is that these end times are on a very small scale e.g. Why don't all other world powers fight against each-other?  Its a weak argument and if you actually read it lets take a look.

 

 

“See, Damascus will no longer be a city

    but will become a heap of ruins.

 

Can someone please define what a heap of ruins is?  Like common throughout all the times Damascus has been conquered can we honestly say that it was not a heap of ruins before?

 

 

3 The fortified city will disappear from Ephraim,

    and royal power from Damascus;

 

Does damascus have royal power?  I thought he was the president and I also thought that it was a dictatorship?

 

 

7 In that day people will look to their Maker

    and turn their eyes to the Holy One of Israel.

 

Er is this a Prophecy of people expecting Jesus or God because if you are a Jew this is his first coming and if you are a Christian this would be the second coming.   But what I think this means is they will turn their eyes to God!

 

 

12 Woe to the many nations that rage—

    they rage like the raging sea!

Woe to the peoples who roar—

    they roar like the roaring of great waters!

 

Sweet this could be to anyone or anything and also the word Woe means sorrow or sadness - So we are saying that America and Russia are sad?  Also if we think that most of the entire bible was based around the Middle East and East Europe then we can say this probably isnt talking about Russia and America.

 

Anyone else care to disect this bull shit?

[centauri]

 

 

7 In that day people will look to their Maker

    and turn their eyes to the Holy One of Israel.

 

Er is this a Prophecy of people expecting Jesus or God because if you are a Jew this is his first coming and if you are a Christian this would be the second coming.   But what I think this means is they will turn their eyes to God!

 

 

...Anyone else care to disect this bull shit?

It has nothing to do with Jesus nor is Jesus the "Maker".

 

Isa 45:11-12

Thus saith the Lord, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.

I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.

 

The Hebrew deity is a singular being, with no others except him.

 

Isa 43:11

I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.

 

Isa 45:5

I am the Lord, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:

 

Isa 45:22

Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

 

Also of note is that Paul ripped off Isa 45:23 and tried to make it about Jesus.

 

Isa 45:23

I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me(Yahweh) every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

 

Revised version of Isa 45:23 after the shameless alteration:

 

Phil 2:10

That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

 

Never trust a Christian.