bluewizard Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 How are unknown languasges spoken by the person "possesd" during exorcisms? They never knew that language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigToe Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Probably the same way you can explain people speaking foreign languages they haven't studied when they get really drunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Probably the same way you can explain people speaking foreign languages they haven't studied when they get really drunk. If the languages are unknown, then what makes you think it's a language at all? Could be just the same meaningless babble that people in tongues are doing. Now, if they're speaking a known foreign language that they don't normally speak and they have no knowledge of, I can't explain that. But, I have a feeling that's not the case. I'm pretty skeptical about reports like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai Tailor Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 I would be very interested indeed to see documentation of glossolalia instances which demonstrated consistent, correct syntax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Even speaking a language that is known is explainable. There's a speed-training program to learn new languages, where the trainee goes into an alpha-wave state of mind, and get induced with a new language. Pretty soon he can speak it. The ability to take in and analyze patterns, images or sounds, are extremely effective in the subconsious. You're subcon can receive a language by hearing it for a few days, and yet your consious dosen't know it yet. It think that explains even the occasions when people have spoke a real language. Usually those that have done it, did it after living at a new place for a week before they "spoke in tongues" and they said real sentences. The brain picked up the patterns, like "Grabbla drabble" maybe was said a lot during prayers by the natives, and then suddenly the visitor used it in his glossolalia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuaiDan Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 I can speak Chinese when I do e. Seriously. I know the language has been imbedded in my subconcious, or at least I hope so after living in Shanghai for over two years. My Chinese is piss poor when I'm sober. Marginally better when I'm drunk. When I'm rollin, I can have whole conversations in Chinese. But as far as the whole exorcism thing goes, I'm sure it's just more Hollywood-spawned mythology. Are there really any documented cases that can't be explained by what's already been mentioned in this thread? I seriously doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 do you actually think something takes over the firing of synpases in the brain and introduces new brain patterns only to be erraticated when "exorcised?" umm.....turn of your tv. everything you can ask has been debunked if you dare wake up. want to buy some snake oil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trashy Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 How are unknown languasges spoken by the person "possesd" during exorcisms? They never knew that language. How? Simple - THEY AREN'T! Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Ethel Rakem Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 The same way I babbled Japanese when delirious. You pick stuff up, consciously or no. All these little tidbits are stored somewhere in your brain and sometimes you remember it, or access it, especially if you're wigging out (like during an exorcism). And suddenly out come these words and phrases that you didn't think you knew. Just the random synapsis thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidsquid Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 Faking languages isn't really all that hard. You'd be amazed at how much people actually retain of other means of communication that their exposed to at one point or another. Just because you don't "know" the language, doesn't mean you can't fake it. It is right to be skeptical of reports of exorcisms - too many cognitive biases involved, maybe even some confabulation here and there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 All humans are born with the capacity to learn any language. That's why it's easier for young children to learn their native language or a foreign one. When you get older, you forget. It's possible that the basic speech patterns are stored somewhere deep within our subconscious mind, and being in altered states can access them. Or, the more probable answer, it's all a load of balogne and they're faking it. They just do a really good job of faking it because they have been doing it all their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 How are unknown languasges spoken by the person "possesd" during exorcisms? They never knew that language. I must be super bored today because I am thinking too much and getting really picky. I think the way you worded your question presupposes that 1.) demons actually exist, and 2.) they can possess people, and 3.) that people can speak unknown languages either with or without the assistance of said yet-to-be-proven-existent demons. I personally don't think demons exist, so I don't think people can be possessed. I think people suffer from mental illness. I also think people lie. I also think people can have subconscious exposure to things (like a real or imaginary language) which they may repeat during a psychotic episode. The mind is a complex thing and we don't totally understand everything about it yet. But, IMO, that is no excuse to blame it on spooks and demons in the meantime.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatifidontwantausername? Posted January 3, 2006 Share Posted January 3, 2006 I do not know. But before the rest of you say pas passible I recall reading in a psychology textbook that people who suffer from multiple personality disorder sometimes create personalities that speak a primary language that they had never had contact with. Just something to think about. -Jake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narcissist Posted January 3, 2006 Share Posted January 3, 2006 From time to time they show these "Hypnotist-Entertainer" folks on TV. I recall one time this hypnotist told one of his hypnotised volunteers that he was an alien, and was to speak in his alien language. Then he got the guy next to him (also hypnotised) to translate to English for us. If I recall correctly the "translator" also translated English back into the alien language for our alien friend. It was quite funny conversation as I recall. Point is that the human brain can make any kind of authentic looking shit up given the right stimulus - drugs, hypnosis, trance, trauma, etc. Believe and achieve, and all that kind of stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted January 3, 2006 Share Posted January 3, 2006 The same way I babbled Japanese when delirious. You pick stuff up, consciously or no. All these little tidbits are stored somewhere in your brain and sometimes you remember it, or access it, especially if you're wigging out (like during an exorcism). And suddenly out come these words and phrases that you didn't think you knew. Just the random synapsis thing. Correct. If the brain is capable of learning not only one language, but multiple languages, in the natural state, it means there is so much more to our brain that we don't know or understand. Our conscious part of the brain is just a few percent, and the rest of the 98% are subconscious or supportive hardware for the conscious. Comparing to a computer, the conscious is the screen, mouse and keyboard, but the subconscious is the CPU, GPU, MMU, PIO, VDU, RAM, ROM, ... And it's amazing that our computers can get a virus and start acting up, without me controlling it. Hmmm... Would that mean the computer is possessed? Faking languages isn't really all that hard. You'd be amazed at how much people actually retain of other means of communication that their exposed to at one point or another. Just because you don't "know" the language, doesn't mean you can't fake it. Like several famous actors that can imitate existing languages, but without saying any real words. I remember a story I saw from a musical competition in Europe many years ago. The guy who won, played piano and sang, but in the middle of the song he got so nervous that he forgot the lyrics. He kept on singing jibberish for a little bit, but the amazing part was ... no one noticed... not until this documentary came out and he told the story and the got the clip out and played it. And there it was a couple of phrases that sounded like English, but where nonsensical. It is right to be skeptical of reports of exorcisms - too many cognitive biases involved, maybe even some confabulation here and there. To quote GIR: "Okay! ... I doooon't know what you just said..." Just kidding, nicely evolved language there to say "people are bullshitting us." From time to time they show these "Hypnotist-Entertainer" folks on TV. I recall one time this hypnotist told one of his hypnotised volunteers that he was an alien, and was to speak in his alien language. Then he got the guy next to him (also hypnotised) to translate to English for us. If I recall correctly the "translator" also translated English back into the alien language for our alien friend. It was quite funny conversation as I recall. Cool. But hey... maybe they weren't faking it? Maybe we all are connected to an alien race, and they only tapped into it??? It's just as likely as demons, wouldn't you say? Point is that the human brain can make any kind of authentic looking shit up given the right stimulus - drugs, hypnosis, trance, trauma, etc. Believe and achieve, and all that kind of stuff To me all this is not a mystery, since I still can speak in tongues (and that after blasphemed the Holy Spook and no Christian spirit dwells in me anymore), and I can also improvise on music instruments, and singing... Improvising is very much the same source as glossolalia, it's only the tools or the instrument that differs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilith Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Yea ok Hans...but here is the really scary part: I actually understand what those street signs in your avatar are telling me as a driver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Yea ok Hans...but here is the really scary part: I actually understand what those street signs in your avatar are telling me as a driver. Cool! Good for you For me, it only causes my eyes to go cross-eyed and then I run down the sign... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderbolt Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 How do you know it's "unknown" and not just gibberish? I can talk gibberish without any strain - regardless of whether someone lays hand on me or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
☆ TexasFreethinker ☆ Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Before it can be explained I would want it to be scientifically observed. There should be no objection to one of these exorcisms being held under scientific conditions where there is certainty that the person doesn't know a foreign language and has no means of being fed the words during the ritual. Once a case like that is recorded (and I have my doubts that this would ever occur), then we can begin looking into the answers. Until then, I'm a non-believer in these events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_funkenstein Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 When I was a christian, I heard stories about so-and-so told me once that at a pentecostal service somewhere, somebody got up and started speaking in tongues, only to have someone from some obscure country who happened to be in the congregation stand up and say "Hallelujah! He's praising God in the language of my people!" Those reports were never first-hand, and I think if you scratch the surface you'll find they're always retellings of retellings; essentially they're christian urban legends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Actually I have seen exorcism on video, and in our church we did some too, but I never heard anyone shouting in other languages during it, but I have seen people scream things (in understandable language, usually very foul language). I heard once about that these things, or situations works in a similar way as the victim of a hypnotic trick. People tend to remove the blocks that stop them from behaving normally, and they start behaving according to what they think is expected from them. When I was a christian, I heard stories about so-and-so told me once that at a pentecostal service somewhere, somebody got up and started speaking in tongues, only to have someone from some obscure country who happened to be in the congregation stand up and say "Hallelujah! He's praising God in the language of my people!" Those reports were never first-hand, and I think if you scratch the surface you'll find they're always retellings of retellings; essentially they're christian urban legends. Very true. Even though I think the brain have the ability to do it. In a completely natural way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanda Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 When I was in seminary, we had a couple people referred to us because they were 'possessed' and needed an exorcism. It seems the real problem was indeed multiple personalities. I understand exorcism is the WORST thing you can do in such cases as these! I'd like to see relieable documentation of such cases of people speaking in foriegn languages, not known to them. However, in the book Many Minds, Many Masters, written by Dr. Brian Weiss, a well known psychiatrist... claims to have had a client that spontaneously regressed into past life experiences. I'm curious if it is possible to be in an altered state of consciousness and regress to a past life and speak the language you knew then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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