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Is The Grass Greener On The Other Side?


Foxy Methoxy
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I'm not talking about a logical or practical or cultural standpoint or from the dogma in which you define your individule spiritual philosophy, but from a personal, emotional standpoint, would you like to believe in God? Or if you do believe in God, do you ever feel if would be easier if you didn't believe?

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I'm not talking about a logical or practical or cultural standpoint or from the dogma in which you define your individule spiritual philosophy, but from a personal, emotional standpoint, would you like to believe in God? Or if you do believe in God, do you ever feel if would be easier if you didn't believe?

 

As for Biblegod, no way. I've learned too much.

 

I don't see Biblegod as rational. I require my supreme beings to be supremely rational.

 

Now I do believe in a supreme being.......but not one in any real way based on the "book of man". This makes "god" for me pretty much an unknown, which I prefer greatly to the notion of "knowing" god based on that cruel vindictive being depicted in the bible.

 

It would only be easier for me to not believe in any supreme being at all in the context of social relations. Most people are barely capable of utilizing the mush between their ears. When I tell them that I don't believe in religion, or in the bible, BUT I do believe in a supreme being that I'm perfectly comfortable not "knowing" or having a "personal realationship" with......their perpetual confusion is just so frustrating! Many of then can't even seperate the concept of religion from the being it's supposedly attached to!

 

Religious people may not respect atheists, but at least they understand the concept of atheism. For religion people, it seem you are either one of them, an atheist, or an undecided. Well I'm not one of them, but I'm not an atheist either.......and as for undecided, I've done too much research and self-searching to figure out what I believe to feel satisfied or okay with an undecided label some pious prick slaps on me. "Undecided" my left buttock!

 

Sure it would be socially easier to just say "screw it....I'm an atheist", but it would feel dishonest to me. And if it felt dishonest to me, I doubt the person I was saying it to would be particularly convinced by it either. And then I would be doing a disservice to everyone who has chosen their own religion-free path, because this person would go away with the idea I was really a believer, but was choosing to lie about it to go along with the atheist thing to be "in". Kind of like those folks "coming out of the closet" because being gay is so "in" right now......no one really is gay...they just do it for the attention.

 

:banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

The way a lot of people think...... frustrating. Better to just be true to myself no matter that most people won't understand. It's better for me to be frustrated by THEM than frustrated with myself.

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I'm not talking about a logical or practical or cultural standpoint or from the dogma in which you define your individule spiritual philosophy, but from a personal, emotional standpoint, would you like to believe in God? Or if you do believe in God, do you ever feel if would be easier if you didn't believe?

 

It's not a question of me 'liking' to believe in god(s) for me - it's just proof. If god could prove he existed, I'd believe in him/her/it/they. :shrug:

 

It's not, like Mulder's poster, a case of 'I want to believe'. And I seriously doubt (from an emotional standpoint) that a belief in a deity would make me happier. I'm pretty happy as is. :D

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There was a time in my disbelief where I wished I could just believe it. Believe in Heaven adn that I was going there, adn that when I was low God would pick me up. It wasn't true though, and believeing it was or trying to caused me so much greif. When I accepted what my mind saw, truly accepted it, I no longer needed the fantasy. Now, no, I do not want to believe, not at all. I do not want to reach out for a god that is not there, nor to I want to wait no a heaven that is not there. When I am low I reach out to my friends and my family, or sometimes just myself, that's real.

 

Now before some xian jumps on this NO I was not hurt by the church, or by the people in it. I did not leave because I was used and abused. While I had faith I was happy in the church, but as I studied and learned and the bible in some places really, really really made no sense, and in others was horrific. As all the explanations fell flat, then I became uncomfortable in the Christian skin.

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I'll be honest. While it would be nice to believe someone's at the wheel, I cannot even conceive of there being any kind of supreme being anymore. Were evidence brought forth that could convinced me otherwise, certainly, I would accept it. But at this point, it would need to be the same type Thomas demanded, direct physical indisputable proof.

 

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. To me, saying there is a supreme being or that the universe itself is somehow conscious would require A LOT of evidence. Thus far, I've seen none.

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I'll be honest. While it would be nice to believe someone's at the wheel, I cannot even conceive of there being any kind of supreme being anymore. Were evidence brought forth that could convinced me otherwise, certainly, I would accept it. But at this point, it would need to be the same type Thomas demanded, direct physical indisputable proof.

 

My position is the same as yours

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I'm not talking about a logical or practical or cultural standpoint or from the dogma in which you define your individule spiritual philosophy, but from a personal, emotional standpoint, would you like to believe in God? Or if you do believe in God, do you ever feel if would be easier if you didn't believe?

 

No.

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From my stand point, if I want to believe anything other than absolute reality, then I would betray the Bible God and the foundations of Science.

 

So, to me this is a non-issue. There is no "other side" :grin:

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I outgrew my need for imaginary friends, ie. gods.

 

Exactly. I think there is at least one creator, and that is all a "god" can possibly be to me. There clearly are no intervening gods micromanaging everything in the world and sticking their noses into our business, and no human "account" of any god possesses nearly enough credibility to sway me. I am just fine with believing there is a creator that just let everything go and doesn't have the power to monkey with the universe anyway, but I too have outgrown my need for imaginary friends. My life is much less complicated being relatively god-free.

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I am just fine with believing there is a creator that just let everything go and doesn't have the power to monkey with the universe anyway, but I too have outgrown my need for imaginary friends.

 

No offense, but what's the difference between this and seeing the universe as uncaused? The only attribute your version of "god" seems to have is "creator". Why not just remove the creator and simplify the process?

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As far as an afterlife, I kind of believe in a colletive conscienceness/Universe and a Panthiest concept where we are all part of god without any specific diety. So, that technically makes me an Athiest as in I'm not a thiest. However, I am still open to the idea of their being a god/supreme being/diety whatever it may be so I consider myself Agnostic.

I'm comfortable being on the fence looking at both sides.

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I believe in justice and the appreciable reality of conscience. I believe that there will be a reckoning.

 

I do not believe that good and evil are human constructs, nor do I believe that anyone gets away with anything.

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Right, according to the bible, god created good and evil. Kinda don't make sense to create something that will doom numerous people to eternal torture though.

 

You are also forgeting million of babies who have died throughout the centuaries. Right they now they are burning in hell

 

Theologically speaking, if God exists he can do whatever he wants.

I believe God can exist

 

But you have to prove to me that the christian god is the god of the universe

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Theologically speaking, if God exists he can do whatever he wants.

 

Don't like it?

 

Tough shit.

God can do whatever he likes? Then if he liked to, he could make a rock so heavy that even God couldn't lift it...

 

 

 

Ooops... God can't do whatever he likes.

 

Guess that fucks your point, doesn't it...?

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I believe in justice and the appreciable reality of conscience. I believe that there will be a reckoning.

 

I do not believe that good and evil are human constructs, nor do I believe that anyone gets away with anything.

Not even the people that didn't do anything will not get away with not doing anything.

 

People that didn't believe, will be punished for it.

 

People that never heard about Jerkus, will be punished for it.

 

Babies that died in the crib before they could speak will be punished for it.

 

People that used their brains that this supposed God gave them, and use reason instead of blind faith, will be punished for it.

 

People that can't feel or speak or hear will be punished for it.

 

Yeah. That is justice allright! Bloody egomania and rage is what it is.

 

Theologically speaking, if God exists he can do whatever he wants.

 

Don't like it?

 

Tough shit.

Exactly right, if God (or more accurately your God) exists.

 

But you see, your God does not exist... it's the wrong one... my God, the Big Flurry Cute Bunny, that does exist, hates your guts, so you'll be punished for eternity for all your ugly comments all the time... well, don't like it, tough shit Goldie!

 

*edit*

 

And by the way, if God can do whatever he wants, then he can allow EVERYONE into heaven, and just don't give a shit if we believe or not. And he would make the whole Hell issue moot and void, against your wishes Goldie. Isn't that nice. God could undo Hell, and you would have to see our ugly faces in Heaven for eternity... :HaHa:

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“You are also forgeting million of babies who have died throughout the centuaries. Right they now they are burning in hell”

 

“Babies that died in the crib before they could speak will be punished for it”

 

 

I don’t know where you are getting this but you are grossly misinformed.

 

------------

 

“People that used their brains that this supposed God gave them, and use reason instead of blind faith, will be punished for it.”

 

 

This, of course, is another declaration of the glorious clarity of evolutionary religion.

 

Here’s how people who believe in it use their brains:

 

They believe that the components of the DNA molecule somehow formed by natural means. They also believe that all the ultra-complex enzymes which facilitate DNA replication also randomly assembled themselves.

 

One of these enzymes proof-reads the duplicated molecule and corrects errors with astonishing effectiveness and accuracy. After this check and repair function is complete, the error rate is one in one billion.

 

This is a nightmare for evolutionary theory. If random evolutionary events were responsible for the production of self-replicating DNA, these processes made a very counter-evolutionary move in tucking the fix enzymes into the process. Their explicit role is to prevent mutations. No mutations, no evolution.

 

In other words, evolution designed mechanisms to prevent evolution. Error-destroying ninja enzymes.

 

But then this is just one isolated problem. How did the molecule itself originate? We’re talking three billion base pairs in humans. How did the enzymes originate? These are phenomenally complex proteins. How do they do what they do to the nucleotides? How do enzymes recognize errors? Are they smart?

 

Don’t kid yourself about faith. Yours is planet-sized and blind as a turnip, with which you share common ancestry, according to your religion.

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Don’t kid yourself about faith. Yours is planet-sized and blind as a turnip, with which you share common ancestry, according to your religion.

 

...viper, you keep spouting the same bullshit all the time, not only that, but bullshit that doesn't have anything to do with Evolutionary Theory.

 

Let's look at the foundations, shall we?

 

DNA formation is biochemistry.

 

Evolution is Biology.

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I just think that when you look at the history of the earth, from the big bang, through the formation of planets, the advent of life, etc., the concept of a personified diety doesn't make sense. The overriding power is the laws of physics and chemistry, not some emotional being seeking glory.

 

Do I want to believe? Heck no. The years of trying to believe made me miserable, and I'm much more comfortable with random statistical probabilities than some cosmic battle between good and evil being played out through me.

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