zuker12 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Right off the bat, I'm going to separate actual, happened, provable conspiracies from the vivid but ridiculous world of conspiracy theories. Actual conspiracies do happen, always have happened and I think will continue to happen. Conspiracies that have behind them actual earthly powers, with real interests, instead of the ages old "defaming christianity" or "genociding the human population" (as stupid as that sounds for practical reasons). So, did you subscribe to any conspiracy theories in your believing days, or were you exposed to the? What did you think of them? What do you think of them now? On the offchance one proved to be true, how would you react? I seem to be ranting on about more esoterical subjects as of late (first sin, then witchcraft, now conspiracy theories!) but I have to admit they really did do a lot of damage to me. I wish to write a post examining some critical points about conspiracy theories (such as the whole friend-of-a-friend circle in which these theories seem to go and many of the unprovable ideal projections of theology into the real world.) There really is no debating a conspiracy theorist; the only thing you can do is dismiss him, unless he comes up with an insurmountable amount of evidence to his point. Not the "Christ died, magic is sin and what I say is magic is magic and since we are so amoral today magic is everywhere" jargon.
xtify Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 It was easier for me to buy into conspiracy theories in the past because I believed in a supernatural realm where battles occurred between angels and demons. Even if the people involved in any particular incident didn't know in entirety what the end goal was, the demons did. The devil and his minions were planning to destroy humanity, just like the good book says. I listened to people like Alex Jones, David Icke, Spaceman, Jordan Maxwell sometimes obsessively. I tried to purify my life of all offensive things: mass media, non-organic food, household chemicals, pharmaceuticals, cosmetics, flame retardants, plastics, etc.. After years of failed predictions from these guys about planned terror attacks for the olympics, superbowl, or any other big event, I started to question myself. It was years before I deconverted. I suddenly realised that these guys are marketing fear. Fear is the product that they are pushing and the bottom line is making money. The way I was raised, in constant fear of the inpending takeover by the antichrist, it set me up later to believe in a global conspiracy. Luckily, I spent all of the 90's not caring about these things. These fears were dormant during that time. It was just after 911, that all those fears were reactivated. I remember feeling my heart pounding and I thought, "oh my god, it really is true." 1
Adam5 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Hi Zuker12, I subscribed to conspiracy theories after my believing days. In a way, it kind of helped my deconvert, to have something else to believe in. I agree with the above post. Many of those peddling conspiracy theories in books and on the web are after money, and are marketing fear. There are many similarities between the psychology of religion and conspiracy, esp. confirmation bias - cherry picking facts, and only looking at things which agree to your preconceived point of view.
zuker12 Posted March 20, 2014 Author Posted March 20, 2014 Some resources on this topic rationalwiki.org --> read articles on NWO, Illuminati, Satanic Panic and read especially about Mike Warnke and John Todd skepdic.com --> the NWO and christian right articles http://www.witchvox.com/_x.html?c=whs --> for a wiccan examination of supposed allegations against them I think there are 2 main points that work with and for christian conspiracy theorists. They don't much differ from the normal, christian-generated guilt conversion process. 1) Assign an inherent degeneration to everything that is in this world, a satanic taint if you will ("Satan is the god of this world") 2) Corroborate this theological view of the world with paranoia and nut theories to make it appear more authentic (not with any actual evidence or fair judgement of what's on display) This is much of the same logic that "works" in other cases, meaning to give up one's self totally to Christ and deny this world, but this time with an added element of grand conspiracies. I don't pretend to know the origins of all the conspiracy ThEORIES but I think I can fairly confidently say most of it is just the same old conversion attempts but this time weaved in with a bunch of "secret" knowledge to make it APPEAR more authentic. This does not speak anything for it's authenticity though, and more often than not the conspiracy is only in the eye of the beholder - that is, if one has decided to assign event X to the Illuminati, then he will do just that, since in a conspiracy theorist's mind, everything that proves a conspiracy is hidden, defamed or destroyed. It is natural to this thinking but insane to a rational person. With this thinking, he won't even find support for his own theory. I'm paraphrasing a good quote here from rationalwiki: "It seems that a conspiracy theorist's mind is not so much made from proving his theory, but rather he attempts to find flaws in everyone elses' views on matters." Falsifiability is an impossibility when dealing with this logic. What saddens me is the amount of emotional guilt and hopelessness that these paranoid conspiracies convey (while those who repeat or make the allegations no doubt rack in some cash with the videos and seminars they make, and of course with whatever ministries they happen to hold, Alex Jones comes to mind). It really only works in a paranoid mind, fearing of everything in this world, and in this way, a person may be made to totally follow a certain line of thinking, which leads to abuse. I'm not saying distrust towards the establishment is not a good thing; but the amount that the paranoid conspiracy theories conflict with the real world, in the past, in the now, I think we can say with certainty that they hold little validity. A healthy, inquisitive mind is good, a paranoid nut will end up making a wreck of himself, or lets himself be abused by others.
GraphicsGuy Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 I remember hearing a few special speakers in various churches I attended who were big conspiracy theory nuts. Everything was put into context as fitting into Revelation and that the entire point of the New World Order and such was to basically get rid of Christianity...let the scare-tactics begin. As a kid, I would listen to this stuff in absolute fascination and yet only comprehend a bare fraction of it. The conspiracy theorists were absolutely behind the big "Satanist Scare" of the late 80s/early 90s that swept through Evangelical churches. Since deconverting, I have discovered that secular Conspiracy Theorists basically preach the same "Gospel" as Christian Conspiracy Theorists except for the addition that Christianity is also a tool used by the mind/world controllers to pacify the masses. I quite like listening to some of them as they often have other messages that ring quite true in my mind. For one example, Michael Tsarion always speaks of the importance of being your true self and not becoming hypnotized by mass media.
zuker12 Posted March 21, 2014 Author Posted March 21, 2014 Separating conspiracies from conspiracy theories is some work in itself. I'd start by not reading speculation from any known conspiracist sources, be they secular theorists or hyperactive pastors. The thing that usually leaves me stumped is the fact that the claims are absurd. One can say "the Illuminati did it" but nowhere is there evidence for any Illuminati organization, at least in the size or shape that some people propose it is. I get that political circles can be inbred, but is this any evidence for any needlessly complex organization that supposedly works without any chance of being exposed? Of course, conspiracy circles are inbred too in a way and that is why their claims work for them. Those who believe will believe more, those who don't will get labeled as "co-conspirators" or "sheeps", again advancing their agenda. Twisting reality to fit an interpretation is a deceptive art, since I think one will only go deeper and deeper in his convictions of massive conspiracies, when one sees things in this way continually. Human mind works wonders sometimes.
Guest MadameX Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 They both offer easy answers, answers to EVERYTHING. Immediate gratification for the anxious and fearful. 1
ExCBooster Posted March 21, 2014 Posted March 21, 2014 Well, I guess that conspiracy theories might appeal to some Christians, because they're already committed to assuming that things happen for a reason (of some kind). So, it might be hard for them to accept that "sh*t happens" instead of it being the outcome of some kind of plan, some overarching goal. Accepting that stuff just happens, sort of randomly - even some stuff - might sabotage one of the psychological foundations of their beliefs. As for myself, I find that Hanlon's Razor is a good rule: "never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity." Mitchell and Webb did a great couple sketches on crackpot conspiracy theories, including one on the Moon Landing.
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