Is This Life All There Is To You?

[Dhampir]

Think about this. The thing that makes you related to your mother, for instance is the fact that you share genetic material, due... well due to the fact that she gave birth to you and imparted half of her traits to you. This is all physical; the emotional bonds of family and such are brought about by bio-chemical reactions. Ergo, when you die, afterlife or no, you will have no family, as you have no body or have not the body that made you related to your family in your previous existence.

[spamandham]

your truly happy thinking that?

 

Are you suggesting that reality changes itself to conform to our comfort levels?

[willybilly30]

how do you know thats reality?

 

 

 

 

 

your truly happy thinking that?

 

Are you suggesting that reality changes itself to conform to our comfort levels?

[spamandham]

how do you know thats reality?

 

I have seen dead people and rotting corpses (animals). What makes you think the obvious isn't reality?

[Guest mso58]

I sometimes wonder how atheists or exchristians get by in life. What I mean is if you have loved ones like a wife, or husband, mom, dad, or children, doesn't it haunt you that when you or they die you will never see them again?

 

I try to think back to the time I was not a believer in God & Jesus Christ to answer this question and it is difficult. This life was really all their was and thoughts of the afterlife were few and fleeting.

 

The thought for me is painful. I also think that how can this life be all that there is?

 

With all the testimonies of those who have experienced death, a so called "near death experience, and the subsequent return of life and hence themselves to their bodies to testify to what they experienced when their brain waves ended and their hearts stopped, sometimes for very long periods of time, there is no reason to think that this life is all there is.

 

I am a Christian and I admit that I truly struggle with some Christian teachings.

 

I believe in Jesus Christ and the Bible though I am no longer a regular church goer, well, I'm not even an irregular church goer anymore. I too have a hard time with some "christian" teachings which may indeed have been born out of misinterpretation and actually be more of a tradition than correct understanding of what the Bible is saying.

 

(ie) It is very difficult for me to understand the concept of eternal hell suffering for a person truly not being sure of what is right or wrong in this life.

I also have never really had a convincing answer to why God gives some people life and they are born on their way to hell.

 

I think the traditional teaching of a never ending punishment of pain and suffering is unscriptural. At the present time, I see the answer of what happens at death and/or the subsequent afterlife as being one of two possibilities:

 

1. Annihilation - that is, those who are destined for such will be completely annihilated, i.e., body and soul will be destroyed and they will, as many on this message board already believe, cease to exist in any fashion. I believe this has the most Biblical support.

 

2. Restoration - that is, every soul will be restored to a place of righteous standing before God. There are a fair number of Christians who have taught this, i.e., "the restitution of all things" doctrine which essentially states that every soul will eventually be saved and enjoy eternal bliss with God.

 

Presently, I believe in number 1 above but I truly wish for number 2 to be true.

 

But even in these difficult struggles I still want there to be a God because to live our lives and then nothing seems useless.

Please share your thoughts

 

Thanks

 

I just joined this board which was referenced by someone on another Christian message board who was disturbed that such a message board originates in his hometown of Ohio! I have a very good friend who professed Jesus Christ and belief in the Bible for decades but has now renounced such beliefs. We are still very good friends, perhaps even better friends now than we were when both of us were believers at the same time. Personally, I like what I believe to be challenged as it makes me think deeper about my beliefs and why I believe such. I don't fully understand or comprehend people who at one time believed in Jesus but no longer do believe in Him, but I refuse to get into a mode of condemnation of such persons. I so trust God to work all these issues out that my desire in life is to live at peace with people of all faiths or lack of faith.

[spamandham]

Presently, I believe in number 1 above but I truly wish for number 2 to be true.

 

If that was what you truly wished, you would believe it, because your beliefs are based on wishfull thinking in the first place. You just don't want to admit to yourself that you prefer #1.

[willybilly30]

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

 

 

 

 

how do you know thats reality?

 

I have seen dead people and rotting corpses (animals). What makes you think the obvious isn't reality?

[Ouroboros]

...

I just joined this board which was referenced by someone on another Christian message board who was disturbed that such a message board originates in his hometown of Ohio! I have a very good friend who professed Jesus Christ and belief in the Bible for decades but has now renounced such beliefs. We are still very good friends, perhaps even better friends now than we were when both of us were believers at the same time. Personally, I like what I believe to be challenged as it makes me think deeper about my beliefs and why I believe such. I don't fully understand or comprehend people who at one time believed in Jesus but no longer do believe in Him, but I refuse to get into a mode of condemnation of such persons. I so trust God to work all these issues out that my desire in life is to live at peace with people of all faiths or lack of faith.

Mso58, it seems like your a decent Christian, and welcome to the board.

 

I find it scary that this other Christian you mention was disturbed for a board like this to exist. I wonder if he/she rather have all us unbelievers shot or put in prison, only because we don't believe the same as he/she? The step is not far away. I, on the other hand, am not disturbed with all the Christian websites, since I truly believe in freedom of religion, so why should the religious person be disturbed for the opposite? Are they scared we might be right, and they wrong, and we eventually could win over all their members into apostacy?

[Amethyst]

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

 

That's an interesting philosophical question, actually, and it's highly debatable.

 

I would say that something exists, but if you lose all your senses, even touch and smell, then you are probably comatose or something. But even comatose people have reported hearing things and dreaming.

 

I suspect that for such a person who had lost all their senses, their dreams and thoughts would seem more real to them than reality.

[Ouroboros]

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

I think there are five senses: sound, sight, smell, tast and touch.

 

And I agree, not seeing something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. But most things we can't see we can still prove by experiments and tests. We can't see oxygen particles, but we can show they exist by experiments.

 

But unfortunately Glob or the Holy Sprocket doesn't allow you to test them. So you can't see the Holy Spirit, and you're not allowed (according to the Holy Book) to test or prove it either.

 

This God put himself above and beyond our scientific mind or research, either he exists and did that on purpose or he doesn't exist and it's all a sham.

[willybilly30]

i just notice alot of people base reality on what they can see, hear, feel and taste.

thats ongly based on what the four senses sense.

i think theirs a possibilty that their are things our senses cant pick up.

theirs a whistle ongly a dog can hear if it could speak itd say i hear a whistle while a human would say i didnt. whose right? the dog or the human?

why do people think reality is ongly based on what they can sense.

and people base stuff on what they see, hear, taste and feel well iv never seen, heard,tasted or felt an atom but scientists say it exist? if i based reality on my senses then atoms do not exist

 

 

 

 

 

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

 

That's an interesting philosophical question, actually, and it's highly debatable.

 

I would say that something exists, but if you lose all your senses, even touch and smell, then you are probably comatose or something. But even comatose people have reported hearing things and dreaming.

 

I suspect that for such a person who had lost all their senses, their dreams and thoughts would seem more real to them than reality.

[I Broke Free]

people base stuff on what they see, hear, taste and feel well iv never seen, heard,tasted or felt an atom but scientists say it exist? if i based reality on my senses then atoms do not exist

 

I would have to disagree with you on this. Scientists (and science) do not ask me to “believe” in things my five senses are unable to detect; instead science creates tools that extend my five senses to the point where I can understand and experience things and events beyond the normal range of my senses. I have read how chemical reactions between atoms take place (such as sharing electrons) and from that knowledge we can “predict” how different elements will react with each other. Those predictions are correct and I can “see” the results. I have “seen” photos of atoms taken with electron microscopes. The list can go on and on. Scientists do not ask anyone to believe in their results just because they say so.

 

why do people think reality is ongly based on what they can sense

 

If I personally cannot sense something or if through the tools of science it can not be sensed, then we have no bases for saying something is real. This is not saying it does not exist, only that we have no bases for saying so.

 

IBF

[willybilly30]

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

I think there are five senses: sound, sight, smell, tast and touch.

 

And I agree, not seeing something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. But most things we can't see we can still prove by experiments and tests. We can't see oxygen particles, but we can show they exist by experiments.

 

But unfortunately Glob or the Holy Sprocket doesn't allow you to test them. So you can't see the Holy Spirit, and you're not allowed (according to the Holy Book) to test or prove it either.

 

This God put himself above and beyond our scientific mind or research, either he exists and did that on purpose or he doesn't exist and it's all a sham.

 

 

would would be a good test to prove a god exists? would god need to go to a science lab and give a blood test? what about people who say they have experianced god with the five senses? are they all nuts? is ever religion that ever existed from a mentally disturbed person? i cant help thinking theirs a better reason for all that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

I think there are five senses: sound, sight, smell, tast and touch.

 

And I agree, not seeing something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. But most things we can't see we can still prove by experiments and tests. We can't see oxygen particles, but we can show they exist by experiments.

 

But unfortunately Glob or the Holy Sprocket doesn't allow you to test them. So you can't see the Holy Spirit, and you're not allowed (according to the Holy Book) to test or prove it either.

 

This God put himself above and beyond our scientific mind or research, either he exists and did that on purpose or he doesn't exist and it's all a sham.

 

 

is it not possible that their are things scientists cant detect? or dont know about yet.

 

 

 

 

 

If I personally cannot sense something or if through the tools of science it can not be sensed, then we have no bases for saying something is real. This is not saying it does not exist, only that we have no bases for saying so.

 

IBF

[Ouroboros]

is it not possible that their are things scientists cant detect? or dont know about yet.

Yes. Absolutely.

 

 

When it comes to prove God or not, and the question that "even if we can't see, hear or taste it, it could exist anyway", you will raise a problem with your own beliefs. How can you test or prove that the Invisible Pink Unicorn, Flying Spaghetti Monster, Cute Bunny or Santa Clause does or does not exist? I can use all the same arguments to claim their existence, regardless of what you can see or not.

 

Or take the idea that the universe was created by a family of multi-dimensional-energy-beings that can traverse between the parallel universes and can copy our memories and minds into a multi-dimensional-body when we die. There's nothing stopping me or anyone from believing this and all arguments can be tweaked to my benefit and prove my point.

 

It's a personal choice to believe in the things that can't be tested or proven. Not a scientific or general fact or truth. Faith in an invisible friend is a personal and emotional thing, while it can not be demanded from everyone to buy into the same delusion. You could say there's a 50/50 chance God exists, but there's just as much chance that the multi-dimensional-beings exists too.

[spamandham]

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

 

We have an internal sense of self as well. There's no reason to suspect this survives death, when it is not even continuous while we are alive. There are times during sleep when you have no awareness at all - you don't exist from your perspective during those times. Such a total absence of experience can be induced with drugs as well.

 

To posit that we somehow survive death, you need to explain how it is possible for that which survives death to fail to play the same role when you are not dead.

[willybilly30]

i wish their was some proof what i think isnt just guesses and me trying to defend my guesses by making up excuses. i just want their to be a god and a afterlife so bad. i thought i had something here but like ever other thing i bring up i dont have enything

 

 

 

 

 

 

is it not possible that their are things scientists cant detect? or dont know about yet.

Yes. Absolutely.

 

 

When it comes to prove God or not, and the question that "even if we can't see, hear or taste it, it could exist anyway", you will raise a problem with your own beliefs. How can you test or prove that the Invisible Pink Unicorn, Flying Spaghetti Monster, Cute Bunny or Santa Clause does or does not exist? I can use all the same arguments to claim their existence, regardless of what you can see or not.

 

Or take the idea that the universe was created by a family of multi-dimensional-energy-beings that can traverse between the parallel universes and can copy our memories and minds into a multi-dimensional-body when we die. There's nothing stopping me or anyone from believing this and all arguments can be tweaked to my benefit and prove my point.

 

It's a personal choice to believe in the things that can't be tested or proven. Not a scientific or general fact or truth. Faith in an invisible friend is a personal and emotional thing, while it can not be demanded from everyone to buy into the same delusion. You could say there's a 50/50 chance God exists, but there's just as much chance that the multi-dimensional-beings exists too.

 

 

im glad that belief helps you sleep at night but thinking that gives me nightmares.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so if you cant see something like a spirit it dont exist? i guess reality is based on the four senses right?

so if you lost all your senses then nothing exists?

 

We have an internal sense of self as well. There's no reason to suspect this survives death, when it is not even continuous while we are alive. There are times during sleep when you have no awareness at all - you don't exist from your perspective during those times. Such a total absence of experience can be induced with drugs as well.

 

To posit that we somehow survive death, you need to explain how it is possible for that which survives death to fail to play the same role when you are not dead.

[Guest Luci]

Hi,

Why do you have to believe in a god to believe in an afterlife where u will perhaps see ur loved ones again?

Im an atheist and I have no set beliefs about what happens after we die. Death may be the end or perhaps there is some kind of continuance. We will never know until we die.

Even if you believe in god he is so twisted he may send some loved ones to hell because they didnt go to church enough or something else stupid. He is not a loving god. how could a loving god send good people to hell for not worshipping him. I wouldnt trust something that thinks like that.

Would you trust the word of a serial killer?

Luci

[willybilly30]

i dont guess i have to believe in god. i dont believe in the christian god for the same reason you said.

just so theirs an afterlife were i see my loved ones ill be happy. god or no god

 

 

 

 

Hi,

Why do you have to believe in a god to believe in an afterlife where u will perhaps see ur loved ones again?

Im an atheist and I have no set beliefs about what happens after we die. Death may be the end or perhaps there is some kind of continuance. We will never know until we die.

Even if you believe in god he is so twisted he may send some loved ones to hell because they didnt go to church enough or something else stupid. He is not a loving god. how could a loving god send good people to hell for not worshipping him. I wouldnt trust something that thinks like that.

Would you trust the word of a serial killer?

Luci