LukeExChristian Posted April 23, 2014 Posted April 23, 2014 christianity is an elaborate hoax that draws in victims with promises by people who were brainwashed by brainwashed people who brainwashed. as we go on, somewhere is some clever mythwriter(s) or someone who had questions about the ecostytem of which answers weren't readily available. this is my theory, anyway. so... could someone explain why it was until they discovered jesus that a human could be unsatisfied with life, no matter how much stuff they had and how wealthy they were (in some cases they were contemplating suicide). i have heard a story like this multiple times as a christian. as an atheist, i am curious as to why a human would feel fulfilled with life with none other than religion. is it feeling acquainted with a higher power? just being in a group? are the stories hoaxes? has anyone else heard this before even? i'd like input from you guys on this.
Guest afireinside Posted April 23, 2014 Posted April 23, 2014 I think it's partly guilt transition where people are so desperate to escape their guilt and hopelessness that they latch on to the promises of Jesus, of forgiveness and a new start. They feel temporarily at peace and liberated from their oppressive and foreboding thoughts as Jesus assures them they are forgiven and made new. Unfortunately that is short lived as they then gain another more sinister type of guilt from religion as they see past the false hope it offers. The other thing is Christianity is a spark in their dark lives, a new motivation, a new outlook, it sort of takes their thinking off themselves, it's a distraction that seems inspiring and infused with hope, they see themselves in a new light with a new objective for living. This too is short lived as they often get even more weighed down with the demands and struggles of Christianity. I'm speaking from my own experience, I found Christianity full of hope and a new perspective when I was a bit lost. After a year or so the guilt and depression were just the same or worse than before but I also had confusion piled on top of it.
Roz Posted April 23, 2014 Posted April 23, 2014 Christianity offers up "a whole new world" Disney style. We know that material possessions, social standings, and physical health are fleeting. We're not always going to be 21, we may not have a nice car, a warm house, and enough food to eat for the rest of our lives. Nothing's guaranteed. Except jesus/yaweh/allah. You may have a nice job, good family, nice things, but you'll still be dead in the end. I remember attending sabbath school and the class was asked this question: "What do you look forward to in heaven?" The answers were pretty telling: I want to zoom around planet to planet I want to interact with predatory animals I want to see my loved ones and celebrate "I want..." That was the prevailing thought. 1
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted April 23, 2014 Super Moderator Posted April 23, 2014 The jesus myth is simply a re-telling of the ancient sun god/savior myths. People have been people since the dawn of time. Some people have been happy; others have been sad. No god(s) are required for people to experience life on life's terms. 1
sdelsolray Posted April 23, 2014 Posted April 23, 2014 christianity is an elaborate hoax that draws in victims with promises by people who were brainwashed by brainwashed people who brainwashed. as we go on, somewhere is some clever mythwriter(s) or someone who had questions about the ecostytem of which answers weren't readily available. this is my theory, anyway. so... could someone explain why it was until they discovered jesus that a human could be unsatisfied with life, no matter how much stuff they had and how wealthy they were (in some cases they were contemplating suicide). i have heard a story like this multiple times as a christian. as an atheist, i am curious as to why a human would feel fulfilled with life with none other than religion. is it feeling acquainted with a higher power? just being in a group? are the stories hoaxes? has anyone else heard this before even? i'd like input from you guys on this. Most Chrsitians were in fact indoctrinated by trusted adults with the particular religious dogma as a child. They "discovered" Jesus before their brains were fully developed and before their full potential for rational thinking developed. What follows from that is what you see many Christians say or do. Those that eventually reject the religious indoctrination say and do things differently. Consider this when you attempt to answer your questions.
amateur Posted April 23, 2014 Posted April 23, 2014 xianity makes a promise of a perfect afterlife that cannot be proven or disproven in this life; only taken on "faith." xianity says that nothing that happens in this world is important, and it might even be very hard and we might be persecuted and hated but it doesn't matter, because if we believe in jesus then we will get a perfect afterlife immediately after death. xians are supposed to have some inner peace that no one else has because they know they will get this huge reward after they die. Hmmmm. If my boss said, "I'm not going to pay you while you work for me in this life, so your life might be hard and you might live in poverty, BUT after you die I will pay you one lump sum of $100,000,000 immediately upon your death and you will have an eternity of endless bliss and shopping," I think I would say, "Fuck off," and go and get a real job where I get paid regularly in this life. ______ I'm sure different xians have different explanations of what inner peace through religion means. I'm sure there are some people who honestly feel inner peace with xianity on a regular basis. I bet a lot have a honeymoon period where they accept jesus, and feel swelled up with love because of that, then with time it fades and maybe church attendance and xian music can give them that feeling at times. I know some people just SAY they feel wonderful inner peace with jesus because no way will they admit they aren't feeling what they think everyone else in church is feeling and they think they're doing it wrong or aren't real xians or know they are hiding some secret sin in their life. In my own life, I definitely had a honeymoon period with religion, and when that wore off I did have moments of feeling connected with something bigger and a huge feeling of gratitude which I connected to god while I was still religious. Since being an atheist, I still can get a feeling of being connected with everything and I still get overwhelmed sometimes with gratitude and amazement that I'm here. It's not directed at god any more, just a great feeling. 1
Roz Posted April 23, 2014 Posted April 23, 2014 I was one of those people, Amateur, who felt peace with my friend and savior jesus. Until I read, re-read, and studied the apologetics surrounding Lev. 25 (the slavery bit). Felt sick to my stomach and lived like a shut in (job > home) for a long time.
Voice Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 Christianity offers up "a whole new world" Disney style. We know that material possessions, social standings, and physical health are fleeting. We're not always going to be 21, we may not have a nice car, a warm house, and enough food to eat for the rest of our lives. Nothing's guaranteed. Except jesus/yaweh/allah. You may have a nice job, good family, nice things, but you'll still be dead in the end. I remember attending sabbath school and the class was asked this question: "What do you look forward to in heaven?" The answers were pretty telling: I want to zoom around planet to planet I want to interact with predatory animals I want to see my loved ones and celebrate "I want..."That was the prevailing thought. The fat preacher at my church once made an analogy of heaven to shopping. He cited some scriptures about being saved and then said (as though saved in heaven) "I want that," pointing to some imaginary object like a spoiled child. To answer your question, Luke, it has a lot to do with sense of community and belonging, also to the fact that people just don't like to think for themselves. Religion is the ultimate solution to answering questions that you don't have to think about yourself. There's also the emotional aspect in sects that have charged prayer circles and weekly gatherings. There's a drug-free high you get from that which is food for the brainwashed. 1
amateur Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 Roz and Voice, I wish I could give you 100 Reputation Points for your above posts!!!! "I want" and people not thinking for themselves.
RipVanWinkle Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 "I was one of those people, Amateur, who felt peace with my friend and savior jesus. Until I read, re-read, and studied the apologetics surrounding Lev. 25 (the slavery bit). Felt sick to my stomach and lived like a shut in (job > home) for a long time." Roz Roz: How have you done since then? bill
par4dcourse Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 I know no xians that are anywhere near happy or contented. They have the same problems I do so maybe finding jesus isn't all that.
FreeThinkerNZ Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 so... could someone explain why it was until they discovered jesus that a human could be unsatisfied with life, no matter how much stuff they had and how wealthy they were (in some cases they were contemplating suicide). i have heard a story like this multiple times as a christian. as an atheist, i am curious as to why a human would feel fulfilled with life with none other than religion. is it feeling acquainted with a higher power? just being in a group? are the stories hoaxes? has anyone else heard this before even? i'd like input from you guys on this. I also heard stories like that multiple times over the years before when I was a xian. They are xian urban myths, like the "we needed $785.15 for the ministry so we prayed together at church and the next day we got a cheque in the mail for exactly that amount".
Roz Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 "I was one of those people, Amateur, who felt peace with my friend and savior jesus. Until I read, re-read, and studied the apologetics surrounding Lev. 25 (the slavery bit). Felt sick to my stomach and lived like a shut in (job > home) for a long time." Roz Roz: How have you done since then? bill I can't look at Christianity the same, obviously. That was the gateway for me to disavow my faith. Guess you can say I'm rebuilding. I have a network of non-christian friends, I can look myself in the mirror without picturing myself as a southern slave holder or with an SS uniform. It's hard for me to separate christianity from the christian, to look at the christian without their belief. It's either a cherry picking everything is good type like Ironhorse or End3 that doesn't want to believe their god would do or command such barbarism, or a full on SS fundie officer that really would say "yes" to the question "would you do it?" without any pressure on them.
midniterider Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 christianity is an elaborate hoax that draws in victims with promises by people who were brainwashed by brainwashed people who brainwashed. as we go on, somewhere is some clever mythwriter(s) or someone who had questions about the ecostytem of which answers weren't readily available. this is my theory, anyway. so... could someone explain why it was until they discovered jesus that a human could be unsatisfied with life, no matter how much stuff they had and how wealthy they were (in some cases they were contemplating suicide). i have heard a story like this multiple times as a christian. as an atheist, i am curious as to why a human would feel fulfilled with life with none other than religion. is it feeling acquainted with a higher power? just being in a group? are the stories hoaxes? has anyone else heard this before even? i'd like input from you guys on this. The story is a lie. People still have that 'empty' feeling from time to time. Even Christians. Christianity just gives these losers something to fixate on and OCD about whenever they feel the 'emptiness.' When they get done polishing the motorhome or boat and feel that twinge of unfulfilled-ness they will say, "Oh but I have Jebus and that's all I need." But you don't see them selling the motorhome or boat. Christians are as materialistic (and self-deceptive) as anyone else.
midniterider Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 I think it's partly guilt transition where people are so desperate to escape their guilt and hopelessness that they latch on to the promises of Jesus, of forgiveness and a new start. They feel temporarily at peace and liberated from their oppressive and foreboding thoughts as Jesus assures them they are forgiven and made new. Unfortunately that is short lived as they then gain another more sinister type of guilt from religion as they see past the false hope it offers. The other thing is Christianity is a spark in their dark lives, a new motivation, a new outlook, it sort of takes their thinking off themselves, it's a distraction that seems inspiring and infused with hope, they see themselves in a new light with a new objective for living. This too is short lived as they often get even more weighed down with the demands and struggles of Christianity. I'm speaking from my own experience, I found Christianity full of hope and a new perspective when I was a bit lost. After a year or so the guilt and depression were just the same or worse than before but I also had confusion piled on top of it. I used to get an actual buzz when I prayed and read the bible. Then after a while no more buzz. Instead, I was rewarded with the tedium of kissing the ass of God, avoiding certain sinful thoughts, apologizing for allowing those bad thoughts to intrude. And then dealing with cutting myself free of that shit. Religion is like smoking cigarettes.
DoubtingNate Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 Most people are unhappy about something in their lives. This translates easily into 'everybody has a Jesus shaped hole that only Jesus can fill.' People who are happy, ie, successful and personally fulfilled are probably a tougher sell because you have to make them believe they are missing something. Seems to me that's why we see more church growth in the developing world than in, say, Iceland or New Zealand.
Ellinas Posted April 24, 2014 Posted April 24, 2014 Christianity offers: A ready made social network - i.e. support in this life A promise of a "get out of jail" (or, at least, get out of the grave) card The first is problematic because it is not a true personal network - it has nothing to do with peoples' use of their judgement to choose their friends, but rather is based on a common label regardless of character. The second is problematic because it is just one of several such mutually exclusive alternatives (depending on which monotheism you choose), and is based on a promise of a lifetime of slavery to an idea followed by an eternity of slavery dressed up as blissful obedience in shining white robes. Nevertheless, humans crave security, and that is what Christianity promises. As to how Christians can be satisfied with their religion and their "relationship" with the divine - never underestimate the power of the human mind to convince itself.
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