Roz Posted May 14, 2014 Posted May 14, 2014 Let me say that we have a sword lying in a grassy field. We don't know how it got there, who put it there, who fashioned it, etc. For the sake of argument I'll grant that something created it. Yay, it had a creation. Christians, this is what you're having a hard time doing. You contend that this sword was made by someone named Yaweh, who magically beamed it down on the field. He named this sword jesus, and it was a magical sword from the day it was forged. Yet all you have is a book that contradicts itself. It's a book that different early christians voted on, a book that was compiled from earlier compilations like codex sinaticus and codex vaticanus, and those compilations had different material in them from what you now know as the modern bible. Ravenstar and other professionals can expound on that, but I'm a layman in such matters. My degree's not in history nor philosophy. Yet you, by virtue of claiming to be a christian, profess that it is a being named yaweh who magically forged this jesus sword and magically beamed it on the field. And that sword is sentient, it's really an extension of yaweh. And your argument for this is that some earlier believers wrote that this sword was in fact named jesus? Ok, let's grant it. The sword was named jesus. Which is more plausible? That the jesus sword was just a normal sword, carried by a band of mere humans who for whatever reason lost possession of it in the field? Or that the jesus sword is 100% what you claim it to be? You know we have about 1 and a half billion people who claim that that sword's name was really Mohammed, that Allah imbued that sword with the final message for his people. That Allah is in fact the Yaweh you acknowledge, and yet you don't acknowledge Mohammed to be the true prophet. How about the 13~ million Mormons who claim that Yaweh (same guy you worship) really imbued that sword with the final message? And that the sword's name was Joseph Smith? Or Ellen White? And it goes on and on. Yes, It's fascinating to see all the philosophies of the world. Yet you're speaking to a group of people who all once claimed the same basic thing you claimed, which was that the sword was jesus, magically beamed down by yaweh. If you truly cannot see the gap you must cross... Well, nothing more can be said can it. 1
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted May 14, 2014 Super Moderator Posted May 14, 2014 This one movie alone made more of a difference in my deconversion than any other. I first saw it shortly before my crisis of faith began and thought, "I know I have the same kind of powerful and awesome faith that she did." Shortly after my deconversion I watched it again and thought, "Oh, I was just as deluded as she was."
mymistake Posted May 14, 2014 Posted May 14, 2014 I really enjoyed The Messenger when I was a Christian and have not had the chance to watch it since. My response back then relief when she went crazy. To me that explained why her actions were not always Godly. Because if the real God were talking to her she wouldn't have screwed up. So much irony.
ironhorse Posted May 19, 2014 Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough.
FreeThinkerNZ Posted May 19, 2014 Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough. So none of us listened hard enough. Despite a lifetime of trying. I think it's much more likely that when you think god speaks to you, it's really you. 2
Roz Posted May 19, 2014 Author Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough. Cross out Joan and put in every other psychopath's name in, and that statement will be just as valid. 2
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted May 19, 2014 Super Moderator Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough. The voices in her head are "her"; the voices in her head are "god". The voices in her head are both "her" and "god" simultaneously. Therefore, Joan of Arc IS god. 1
midniterider Posted May 19, 2014 Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough. The voices are her and God. So she and God are one and the same. Sounds very Eastern to me.
midniterider Posted May 19, 2014 Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough. The voices in her head are "her"; the voices in her head are "god". The voices in her head are both "her" and "god" simultaneously. Therefore, Joan of Arc IS god. You got it. Therefore no need to praise god...or worship god. You and god are one and the same. Throw away your bibles, Xians and enjoy your own divinity.
midniterider Posted May 19, 2014 Posted May 19, 2014 Aulon: But how do you know that these voices aren't just really you? Joan of Arc: They are me. That's how God speaks to me. Even you could hear them if you listened hard enough. Listened hard enough. Or read the bible 'correctly.' Hard enough and correctly mean allowing myself to accept that a fantasy is reality. But isn't reality self-evident? Do I have to listen hard enough to hear my wife talking to me? No. But the supposedly almighty god creator of everything speaks in such a tiny voice that I have to listen hard to hear him? lol. I'd rather not have to listen so hard to hear something that is so lacking in existence that my imagination is required to pretend it is there so I can hear it. I did that for 10 years. It wasn't worth my time. If it's so hard to hear then it isn't worth listening to.
ironhorse Posted May 23, 2014 Posted May 23, 2014 This song came to mind. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeZKg2PDRcU
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted May 23, 2014 Super Moderator Posted May 23, 2014 Hmmm... How very disingenuous of you, Ironhorse.
Roz Posted June 2, 2014 Author Posted June 2, 2014 Modern day 21st century example of Joan of Arc. Christians, what makes your prayers and your personal 'revelations' from the holy spirit different from hers? Look at her. She earnestly believes just as much as you.
ironhorse Posted June 16, 2014 Posted June 16, 2014 Hmmm... How very disingenuous of you, Ironhorse. LOL It's a good song.
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