Noah's Ark

[Roz]

Simple questions.

 

Christians:

1. do you believe that this story actually happened?  Or is it a metaphor? 

• If a metaphor, why do you believe this is a metaphor but jesus' conflicting stories in the NT are real?
• If it really happened, do you believe that god was just in doing this?

Ex-Cs:

 

1. did you believe it really happened or was it all metaphorical for you?

[TheRedneckProfessor]

Many ancient cultures from around the world have flood myths, some of which share similarities to the Hebrew one.  This suggests, but does not prove, that there may have been some cataclysmic event early in the evolutionary phase of modern humans that got passed down to each generation as humans migrated around the earth.  Why, exactly, anyone would invent the story as a metaphor is beyond me.

 

With that said, as a christian, I believed it literally happened.

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/flood-myths.html

[Guest afireinside]

2 of every animal doesn't work. Fight animals and flight animals in an enclosed place doesn't work, you will have holes in ark and fatally injured animals within a few hours. And all the native species of countries went to the Middle East? Alligators, crocodiles and pythons all included in that mix? Faaarrk owwffff

[chrisdownunder]

I believed it as much as one can believe in something without any proof.

[sdelsolray]

#1.) Where did the Flood water come from, and where did it go?

 

#2.) If there was a vapor canopy, how was the water suspended, and what caused it to fall all at once when it did?

 

#3.) If there was a vapor canopy a part of the atmosphere, how would it not raise the atmospheric pressure accordingly, raising oxygen and nitrogen levels to toxic levels?

 

#4.) If the water canopy began as ice in orbit, how would the gravitational potential energy not raise the temperature past boiling?

 

#5.) How would a vapor canopy refrain from blocking enough sunlight to reduce the the earth's temperature greatly?

 

#6.) How would a vapor canopy remain intact above the ozone layer as UV radiation would invariably break apart water molecules?

 

#7.) If there was a hydroplate (Flood waters coming from a layer of water underground, released by a catastrophic rupture of the earth's crust, shot above the atmosphere, and fell as rain.) how was the water contained?

 

#8.) If there was a hydroplate, how was the water not superheated?

 

#9.) If there was a hydroplate, where is the evidence? Fissures? Deposits?

 

#10.) If the global flood water came from an ice comet, how was it not superheated as it entered the atmosphere?

 

#11.) How do you explain the relative ages of mountains? For example, why weren't the Sierra Nevadas eroded as much as the Appalachians during the Flood?

 

#12.) Why is there no evidence of a flood in ice core series?

 

#13.) How are the polar ice caps even possible? Such a mass of water as the Flood would have provided sufficient buoyancy to float the polar caps off their beds and break them up, how are they still intact?

 

#14.) Why did the Flood not leave traces on the sea floors? A year long flood should be recognizable in sea bottom cores by (1) an uncharacteristic amount of terrestrial detritus, (2) different grain size distributions in the sediment, (3) a shift in oxygen isotope ratios (rain has a different isotopic composition from seawater), (4) a massive extinction, and (n) other characters. Why do none of these show up?

 

#15.) Why is there no evidence of a flood in tree ring dating?

 

#16.) Why are geological eras consistent worldwide? How do you explain worldwide agreement between "apparent" geological eras and several different (independent) radiometric and nonradiometric dating methods?

 

#17.) How was the fossil record sorted in an order convenient for evolution? Why didn't at least one dinosaur make it to the high ground with the elephants?

 

#18.) Why are organisms (such as brachiopods) which are very similar hydrodynamically (all nearly the same size, shape, and weight) still perfectly sorted?

 

#19.) How are coral reefs hundreds of feet thick and miles long were preserved intact with other fossils below them?

 

#20.) How did sensitive marine life such as coral survive?

 

#21.) Why do small organisms dominate the lower strata, whereas fluid mechanics says they would sink slower and thus end up in upper strata?

 

#22.) Why are there no human artifacts found except in the very uppermost strata? If, at the time of the Flood, the earth was overpopulated by people with technology for shipbuilding, why were none of their tools or buildings mixed with trilobite or dinosaur fossils?

 

#23.) Why is ecological information is consistent within but not between layers? Fossil pollen is one of the more important indicators of different levels of strata. Each plant has different and distinct pollen, and, by telling which plants produced the fossil pollen, it is easy to see what the climate was like in different strata. Was the pollen hydraulically sorted by the flood water so that the climatic evidence is different for each layer?

 

#24.) Deep in the geologic column there are formations which could have originated only on the surface, such as: rain drops, river channels, wind-blown dunes, beaches, glacial deposits, burrows, in-place trees, soil, desiccation cracks, footprints, meteorites, meteor craters, coral reefs, and cave systems. How do surface features appear far from the surface? How could these have appeared in the midst of a catastrophic flood? 

 

#25.) How does a global flood explain angular unconformities? 

 

#26.) How were mountains and valleys formed?

 

#27.) When did granite batholiths form?

 

#28.) How can a single flood be responsible for such extensively detailed layering?

 

#29.) How do you explain the formation of varves?

 

#30.) Where did all of the heat go? The geologic record includes roughly 8 x 10^24 grams of lava flows and igneous intrusions. Assuming (conservatively) a specific heat of 0.15, this magma would release 5.4 x 10^27 joules while cooling 1100 degrees C. In addition, the heat of crystallization as the magma solidifies would release a great deal more heat. There are roughly 5 x 10^23 grams of limestone in the earth's sediments, and the formation of calcite releases about 11,290 joules/gram. If only 10% of the limestone were formed during the Flood, the 5.6 x 10^26 joules of heat released would be enough to boil the flood waters. Erosion and crustal movements have erased an unknown number of impact craters on earth, but Creationists Whitcomb and DeYoung suggest that cratering to the extent seen on the Moon and Mercury occurred on earth during the year of Noah's Flood. The heat from just one of the largest lunar impacts released an estimated 3 x 10^26 joules; the same sized object falling to earth would release even more energy. 5.6 x 10^26 joules is enough to heat the oceans to boiling. 3.7 x 10^27 joules will vaporize them completely. Since steam and air have a lower heat capacity than water, the steam released will quickly raise the temperature of the atmosphere over 1000 C. At these temperatures, much of the atmosphere would boil off the Earth. So where did all of the heat go?

 

#31.) How were limestone deposits formed?

 

#32.) How could a flood have deposited chalk?

 

#33.) How could the Flood deposit layers of solid salt?

 

#34.) How were sedimentary deposits recrystallized and plastically deformed in the short time since the Flood?

 

#35.) How were hematite layers laid down?

 

#36.) How do you explain fossil mineralization?

 

#37.) How did all the modern plant species survive?

 

#38.) How did all the fish survive?

 

#39.) How did diseases survive?

 

#40.) How did short-lived species survive? Adult mayflies on the ark would have died in a few days, and the larvae of many mayflies require shallow fresh running water. Many other insects would face similar problems.

 

#41.) How could more than a handful of species survive in a devastated habitat? The Flood would have destroyed the food and shelter which most species need to survive.

 

#42.) How did predators survive?

 

#43.) How could more than a handful of species survive random influences that affect populations?

 

#44.) What kinds were aboard the ark?

 

#45.) Were dinosaurs and other extinct animals on the ark?

 

#46.) Were the animals aboard the ark mature?

 

#47.) How many clean animals were on the ark?

 

#48.) An ark of the size specified in the Bible would not be large enough to carry a cargo of animals and food sufficient to repopulate the earth, especially if animals that are now extinct were required to be aboard. So, could they all fit?

 

#49.) Many animals, especially insects, require special diets. Koalas, for example, require eucalyptus leaves, and silkworms eat nothing but mulberry leaves. For thousands of plant species (perhaps even most plants), there is at least one animal that eats only that one kind of plant. How did Noah gather all those plants aboard, and where did he put them?

 

#50.) Other animals are strict carnivores, and some of those specialize on certain kinds of foods, such as small mammals, insects, fish, or aquatic invertebrates. How did Noah determine and provide for all those special diets?

 

#51.) Many animals require their food to be fresh. Many snakes, for example, will eat only live foods (or at least warm and moving). Parasitoid wasps only attack living prey. Most spiders locate their prey by the vibrations it produces. Most herbivorous insects require fresh food. Aphids, in fact, are physically incapable of sucking from wilted leaves. How did Noah keep all these food supplies fresh?

 

#52.) How did Noah keep pests from consuming most of the food?

 

#53.) The ark would need to be well ventilated to disperse the heat, humidity, and waste products (including methane, carbon dioxide, and ammonia) from the many thousands of animals which were crowded aboard. How was fresh air circulated throughout the structure?

 

#54.) The ungulates alone would have produced tons of manure a day. The waste on the lowest deck at least (and possibly the middle deck) could not simply be pushed overboard, since the deck was below the water line; the waste would have to be carried up a deck or two. Vermicomposting could reduce the rate of waste accumulation, but it requires maintenance of its own. How did such a small crew dispose of so much waste?

 

#55.) The animals aboard the ark would have been in very poor shape unless they got regular exercise. (Imagine if you had to stay in an area the size of a closet for a year.) How were several thousand diverse kinds of animals exercised regularly?

 

#56.) How did a crew of eight manage a menagerie larger and more diverse than that found in zoos requiring many times that many employees?

 

#57.) Wood is not the best material for shipbuilding. It is not enough that a ship be built to hold together; it must also be sturdy enough that the changing stresses don't open gaps in its hull. Wood is simply not strong enough to prevent separation between the joints, especially in the heavy seas that the Ark would have encountered. The longest wooden ships in modern seas are about 300 feet, and these require reinforcing with iron straps and leak so badly they must be constantly pumped. The ark was 450 feet long [ Gen. 6:15]. How could an ark that size be made seaworthy?

 

#58.) If the animals traveled from other parts of the world, many of them would have faced extreme difficulties. Sloths and penguins, can't travel overland very well at all, koalas and many insects, require a special diet, how did they bring it along? Some cave-dwelling arthropods can't survive in less than 100% relative humidity. Some, like dodos, must have lived on islands. If they didn't, they would have been easy prey for other animals. So how did the animals get to the ark from elsewhere?

 

#59.) Some creationists suggest that the animals need not have traveled far to reach the Ark; a moderate climate could have made it possible for all of them to live nearby all along. However, this proposal makes matters even worse. The last point above would have applied not only to island species, but to almost all species. Competition between species would have driven most of them to extinction. So, how could animals have all lived near Noah?

 

#60.) How was the Ark loaded? Getting all the animals aboard the Ark presents logistical problems which, while not impossible, are highly impractical. Noah had only seven days to load the Ark (Gen. 7:4-10). If only 15764 animals were aboard, one animal must have been loaded every 38 seconds, without letup. Since there were likely more animals to load, the time pressures would have been even worse. How was this achieved?

 

#61.) How did animals get to their present ranges? How did koalas get from Ararat to Australia, polar bears to the Arctic, etc., when the kinds of environment they require to live doesn't exist between the two points. How did so many unique species get to remote islands?

 

#62.) How were ecological inter-dependencies preserved as animals migrated from Ararat?

 

#63.) Why is there no mention of the Flood in the records of Egyptian or Mesopotamian civilizations which existed at the time?

 

#64.) How did the human population rebound so fast?

 

These questions have been pulled from:

 

http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?p=6421776#post6421776

 

Original Source is here:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-noahs-ark.html

[chrisdownunder]

#1.) Where did the Flood water come from, and where did it go?

#2.) If there was a vapor canopy, how was the water suspended, and what caused it to fall all at once when it did?

#3.) If there was a vapor canopy a part of the atmosphere, how would it not raise the atmospheric pressure accordingly, raising oxygen and nitrogen levels to toxic levels?

#4.) If the water canopy began as ice in orbit, how would the gravitational potential energy not raise the temperature past boiling?

#5.) How would a vapor canopy refrain from blocking enough sunlight to reduce the the earth's temperature greatly?

#6.) How would a vapor canopy remain intact above the ozone layer as UV radiation would invariably break apart water molecules?

#7.) If there was a hydroplate (Flood waters coming from a layer of water underground, released by a catastrophic rupture of the earth's crust, shot above the atmosphere, and fell as rain.) how was the water contained?

#8.) If there was a hydroplate, how was the water not superheated?

#9.) If there was a hydroplate, where is the evidence? Fissures? Deposits?

#10.) If the global flood water came from an ice comet, how was it not superheated as it entered the atmosphere?

#11.) How do you explain the relative ages of mountains? For example, why weren't the Sierra Nevadas eroded as much as the Appalachians during the Flood?

#12.) Why is there no evidence of a flood in ice core series?

#13.) How are the polar ice caps even possible? Such a mass of water as the Flood would have provided sufficient buoyancy to float the polar caps off their beds and break them up, how are they still intact?

#14.) Why did the Flood not leave traces on the sea floors? A year long flood should be recognizable in sea bottom cores by (1) an uncharacteristic amount of terrestrial detritus, (2) different grain size distributions in the sediment, (3) a shift in oxygen isotope ratios (rain has a different isotopic composition from seawater), (4) a massive extinction, and (n) other characters. Why do none of these show up?

#15.) Why is there no evidence of a flood in tree ring dating?

#16.) Why are geological eras consistent worldwide? How do you explain worldwide agreement between "apparent" geological eras and several different (independent) radiometric and nonradiometric dating methods?

#17.) How was the fossil record sorted in an order convenient for evolution? Why didn't at least one dinosaur make it to the high ground with the elephants?

#18.) Why are organisms (such as brachiopods) which are very similar hydrodynamically (all nearly the same size, shape, and weight) still perfectly sorted?

#19.) How are coral reefs hundreds of feet thick and miles long were preserved intact with other fossils below them?

#20.) How did sensitive marine life such as coral survive?

#21.) Why do small organisms dominate the lower strata, whereas fluid mechanics says they would sink slower and thus end up in upper strata?

#22.) Why are there no human artifacts found except in the very uppermost strata? If, at the time of the Flood, the earth was overpopulated by people with technology for shipbuilding, why were none of their tools or buildings mixed with trilobite or dinosaur fossils?

#23.) Why is ecological information is consistent within but not between layers? Fossil pollen is one of the more important indicators of different levels of strata. Each plant has different and distinct pollen, and, by telling which plants produced the fossil pollen, it is easy to see what the climate was like in different strata. Was the pollen hydraulically sorted by the flood water so that the climatic evidence is different for each layer?

#24.) Deep in the geologic column there are formations which could have originated only on the surface, such as: rain drops, river channels, wind-blown dunes, beaches, glacial deposits, burrows, in-place trees, soil, desiccation cracks, footprints, meteorites, meteor craters, coral reefs, and cave systems. How do surface features appear far from the surface? How could these have appeared in the midst of a catastrophic flood?

#25.) How does a global flood explain angular unconformities?

#26.) How were mountains and valleys formed?

#27.) When did granite batholiths form?

#28.) How can a single flood be responsible for such extensively detailed layering?

#29.) How do you explain the formation of varves?

#30.) Where did all of the heat go? The geologic record includes roughly 8 x 10^24 grams of lava flows and igneous intrusions. Assuming (conservatively) a specific heat of 0.15, this magma would release 5.4 x 10^27 joules while cooling 1100 degrees C. In addition, the heat of crystallization as the magma solidifies would release a great deal more heat. There are roughly 5 x 10^23 grams of limestone in the earth's sediments, and the formation of calcite releases about 11,290 joules/gram. If only 10% of the limestone were formed during the Flood, the 5.6 x 10^26 joules of heat released would be enough to boil the flood waters. Erosion and crustal movements have erased an unknown number of impact craters on earth, but Creationists Whitcomb and DeYoung suggest that cratering to the extent seen on the Moon and Mercury occurred on earth during the year of Noah's Flood. The heat from just one of the largest lunar impacts released an estimated 3 x 10^26 joules; the same sized object falling to earth would release even more energy. 5.6 x 10^26 joules is enough to heat the oceans to boiling. 3.7 x 10^27 joules will vaporize them completely. Since steam and air have a lower heat capacity than water, the steam released will quickly raise the temperature of the atmosphere over 1000 C. At these temperatures, much of the atmosphere would boil off the Earth. So where did all of the heat go?

#31.) How were limestone deposits formed?

#32.) How could a flood have deposited chalk?

#33.) How could the Flood deposit layers of solid salt?

#34.) How were sedimentary deposits recrystallized and plastically deformed in the short time since the Flood?

#35.) How were hematite layers laid down?

#36.) How do you explain fossil mineralization?

#37.) How did all the modern plant species survive?

#38.) How did all the fish survive?

#39.) How did diseases survive?

#40.) How did short-lived species survive? Adult mayflies on the ark would have died in a few days, and the larvae of many mayflies require shallow fresh running water. Many other insects would face similar problems.

#41.) How could more than a handful of species survive in a devastated habitat? The Flood would have destroyed the food and shelter which most species need to survive.

#42.) How did predators survive?

#43.) How could more than a handful of species survive random influences that affect populations?

#44.) What kinds were aboard the ark?

#45.) Were dinosaurs and other extinct animals on the ark?

#46.) Were the animals aboard the ark mature?

#47.) How many clean animals were on the ark?

#48.) An ark of the size specified in the Bible would not be large enough to carry a cargo of animals and food sufficient to repopulate the earth, especially if animals that are now extinct were required to be aboard. So, could they all fit?

#49.) Many animals, especially insects, require special diets. Koalas, for example, require eucalyptus leaves, and silkworms eat nothing but mulberry leaves. For thousands of plant species (perhaps even most plants), there is at least one animal that eats only that one kind of plant. How did Noah gather all those plants aboard, and where did he put them?

#50.) Other animals are strict carnivores, and some of those specialize on certain kinds of foods, such as small mammals, insects, fish, or aquatic invertebrates. How did Noah determine and provide for all those special diets?

#51.) Many animals require their food to be fresh. Many snakes, for example, will eat only live foods (or at least warm and moving). Parasitoid wasps only attack living prey. Most spiders locate their prey by the vibrations it produces. Most herbivorous insects require fresh food. Aphids, in fact, are physically incapable of sucking from wilted leaves. How did Noah keep all these food supplies fresh?

#52.) How did Noah keep pests from consuming most of the food?

#53.) The ark would need to be well ventilated to disperse the heat, humidity, and waste products (including methane, carbon dioxide, and ammonia) from the many thousands of animals which were crowded aboard. How was fresh air circulated throughout the structure?

#54.) The ungulates alone would have produced tons of manure a day. The waste on the lowest deck at least (and possibly the middle deck) could not simply be pushed overboard, since the deck was below the water line; the waste would have to be carried up a deck or two. Vermicomposting could reduce the rate of waste accumulation, but it requires maintenance of its own. How did such a small crew dispose of so much waste?

#55.) The animals aboard the ark would have been in very poor shape unless they got regular exercise. (Imagine if you had to stay in an area the size of a closet for a year.) How were several thousand diverse kinds of animals exercised regularly?

#56.) How did a crew of eight manage a menagerie larger and more diverse than that found in zoos requiring many times that many employees?

#57.) Wood is not the best material for shipbuilding. It is not enough that a ship be built to hold together; it must also be sturdy enough that the changing stresses don't open gaps in its hull. Wood is simply not strong enough to prevent separation between the joints, especially in the heavy seas that the Ark would have encountered. The longest wooden ships in modern seas are about 300 feet, and these require reinforcing with iron straps and leak so badly they must be constantly pumped. The ark was 450 feet long [ Gen. 6:15]. How could an ark that size be made seaworthy?

#58.) If the animals traveled from other parts of the world, many of them would have faced extreme difficulties. Sloths and penguins, can't travel overland very well at all, koalas and many insects, require a special diet, how did they bring it along? Some cave-dwelling arthropods can't survive in less than 100% relative humidity. Some, like dodos, must have lived on islands. If they didn't, they would have been easy prey for other animals. So how did the animals get to the ark from elsewhere?

#59.) Some creationists suggest that the animals need not have traveled far to reach the Ark; a moderate climate could have made it possible for all of them to live nearby all along. However, this proposal makes matters even worse. The last point above would have applied not only to island species, but to almost all species. Competition between species would have driven most of them to extinction. So, how could animals have all lived near Noah?

#60.) How was the Ark loaded? Getting all the animals aboard the Ark presents logistical problems which, while not impossible, are highly impractical. Noah had only seven days to load the Ark (Gen. 7:4-10). If only 15764 animals were aboard, one animal must have been loaded every 38 seconds, without letup. Since there were likely more animals to load, the time pressures would have been even worse. How was this achieved?

#61.) How did animals get to their present ranges? How did koalas get from Ararat to Australia, polar bears to the Arctic, etc., when the kinds of environment they require to live doesn't exist between the two points. How did so many unique species get to remote islands?

#62.) How were ecological inter-dependencies preserved as animals migrated from Ararat?

#63.) Why is there no mention of the Flood in the records of Egyptian or Mesopotamian civilizations which existed at the time?

#64.) How did the human population rebound so fast?

These questions have been pulled from:

http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?p=6421776#post6421776

Original Source is here:

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-noahs-ark.html

You really want an answer from christians on this, there is only one answer you'll get.

 

God did it, end of discussion.

[bornagainathiest]

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/savageseas/multimedia/wavemachine.html

 

Max Values for the PBS animation.

 

Wind Speed : 50 knots

 

Wave Fetch :  1,420 miles

 

Duration : 69 hours

 

Max Yield : Wave height of 97 feet

 

Max Values for Noah's Ark

 

Wind Speed : 50 knots

 

Wave Fetch :  25,000 miles (The Earth's entire circumference.  See Genesis 7 : 17 - 20.)

 

Duration :  3,600 hours (150 days.  See Genesis 8 : 3 & 4.)

 

Max Yield :  Wave height...???

 

This assumes a water depth of 16,854 feet (max height of Mt. Ararat) above today's sea level.  

When all the world's mountains were covered, the water depth would have been 29,029 feet (max height of Mt. Everest) plus 23 feet, or 29,052 feet.  (See Genesis 7 : 20.) Which equates to 5.5 miles of water above today's sea level!

 

Noah's ark is calculated to be 450 feet long, 75 feet wide and 45 feet high.

(See Genesis 6 : 15.)  Which is approximately the length of the red line ------------- below.

 

 

 

 

      -------------------------------------------------

 

      <--------- Length of Noah's Ark --------->

 

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So, the world-wide storms (See Genesis 7 : 12.) and the wind God sent over the Earth (See Genesis 8 : 1) would have combined with an unlimited wave fetch, for a duration of months to yield a maximum wave size of...???

 

Hundreds of feet high?

 

Equivalent to a Megatsunami?  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megatsunami

 

Enough to sink a highly unseaworthy hulk like the Ark?

 

 

.

.

.

 

'nuff said?

 

Thanks,

 

BAA

 

 

[centauri]

I always found it interesting that one of the first things Noah did after disembarking the Ark was to sacrifice some of the animals that he went to all the trouble of saving.

God then smelled the pleasing aroma and promised not to kill everything again.

Nuts? You bet.

[midniterider]

#63.) Why is there no mention of the Flood in the records of Egyptian or Mesopotamian civilizations which existed at the time?

 

 

The records floated away. :-)

[sdelsolray]

 

#63.) Why is there no mention of the Flood in the records of Egyptian or Mesopotamian civilizations which existed at the time?

 

 

The records floated away. :-)

 

Stone tablets float quite well.

[DoubtingNate]

I always found it interesting that one of the first things Noah did after disembarking the Ark was to sacrifice some of the animals that he went to all the trouble of saving.

God then smelled the pleasing aroma and promised not to kill everything again.

Nuts? You bet.

He also gets wasted and then curses 1/3 of his descendants. Not a great start!

[Roz]

We all get why it's not feasible unless 'god-magic' is involved.  But if the christians invoke 'god magic' then to me it becomes a question of morality. 

 

To me when I was still a christian I used 'god used his powers' as an automatic get-out-of-science-jail card for all the shit in the bible that just can't be real.

 

Yet once I started looking at the hebrew god as immoral, that's when all the cards came down.

 

Christian lurkers, I hope you think things over before you waste your life away at this primitive bullshit.

[ironhorse]

There are hundreds of myths from around the world that suggest there was a great flood.

Whether local or global depends on the story you go with.

 

I think all these ancient stories have origin in the flood recorded in Genesis.

 

I believe it happened. 

[Roz]

Tell me, IH, is that a moral thing to do?

 

Have you seen people drowning?  Do you know why water boarding is a form of torture?

 

Do you know the story of Sennacherib and Hezekiah?

 

How god just poof-killed those he considered evil (still immoral, but at least it was targeted) and Sennacherib turned tail?

 

2 chron 32

²¹ And the Lord sent an angel, who annihilated all the fighting men and the commanders and officers in the camp of the Assyrian king.

 

Why drown living things?  The babies?  The children?  The elderly?  The animals?

 

Do you think this is moral?

[ironhorse]

Tell me, IH, is that a moral thing to do?

 

Have you seen people drowning?  Do you know why water boarding is a form of torture?

 

Do you know the story of Sennacherib and Hezekiah?

 

How god just poof-killed those he considered evil (still immoral, but at least it was targeted) and Sennacherib turned tail?

 

2 chron 32

²¹ And the Lord sent an angel, who annihilated all the fighting men and the commanders and officers in the camp of the Assyrian king.

 

Why drown living things?  The babies?  The children?  The elderly?  The animals?

 

Do you think this is moral?

 

 

And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

 

~Genesis 6:5 (King James Version)

[Xerces]

There are hundreds of myths from around the world that suggest there was a great flood.

Whether local or global depends on the story you go with.

 

I think all these ancient stories have origin in the flood recorded in Genesis.

 

I believe it happened. 

Only this story is actually older than the one found in Genesis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilgamesh

[mymistake]

 And all the native species of countries went to the Middle East?

 

 

Not all of them.  The Dinosaurs didn't get the memo.  Or maybe the Dinosaurs were too proud to obey God's call.     

[ironhorse]

 

There are hundreds of myths from around the world that suggest there was a great flood.

Whether local or global depends on the story you go with.

 

I think all these ancient stories have origin in the flood recorded in Genesis.

 

I believe it happened. 

Only this story is actually older than the one found in Genesis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilgamesh

 

 

 

No problem to me if it is older than the Biblical account.

[mymistake]

 

 

There are hundreds of myths from around the world that suggest there was a great flood.

Whether local or global depends on the story you go with.

 

I think all these ancient stories have origin in the flood recorded in Genesis.

 

I believe it happened. 

Only this story is actually older than the one found in Genesis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilgamesh

 

 

 

No problem to me if it is older than the Biblical account.

 

 

 

Because you will keep on believing no matter how much evidence is against it.

 

 

RMS Titanic was about twice the size of the "ark" and could only hold enough food for 3,500 people for three weeks.  But the magic ark can hold all of the animals for every kind of creature on the planet and also hold enough food to feed them all for a year.

[Roz]

 

Tell me, IH, is that a moral thing to do?

 

Have you seen people drowning?  Do you know why water boarding is a form of torture?

 

Do you know the story of Sennacherib and Hezekiah?

 

How god just poof-killed those he considered evil (still immoral, but at least it was targeted) and Sennacherib turned tail?

 

2 chron 32

²¹ And the Lord sent an angel, who annihilated all the fighting men and the commanders and officers in the camp of the Assyrian king.

 

Why drown living things?  The babies?  The children?  The elderly?  The animals?

 

Do you think this is moral?

 

 

And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

 

~Genesis 6:5 (King James Version)

 

 

And this justifies a cruel death for children, for the elderly, for the infirm, for the defenseless (against any omnipotent deity, what's man got?), not to mention the animals.

 

You're beginning to sound like End3 IH.  You didn't even blink when I pointed out that in another verse he did a selected and swift killing, but no, this is drowning.  Those who managed to get floating devices suffered a more prolonged fate.

 

Nice god you've got there.  I spit on him.

[ironhorse]

 

 

Tell me, IH, is that a moral thing to do?

 

Have you seen people drowning?  Do you know why water boarding is a form of torture?

 

Do you know the story of Sennacherib and Hezekiah?

 

How god just poof-killed those he considered evil (still immoral, but at least it was targeted) and Sennacherib turned tail?

 

2 chron 32

²¹ And the Lord sent an angel, who annihilated all the fighting men and the commanders and officers in the camp of the Assyrian king.

 

Why drown living things?  The babies?  The children?  The elderly?  The animals?

 

Do you think this is moral?

 

 

And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

 

~Genesis 6:5 (King James Version)

 

 

And this justifies a cruel death for children, for the elderly, for the infirm, for the defenseless (against any omnipotent deity, what's man got?), not to mention the animals.

 

You're beginning to sound like End3 IH.  You didn't even blink when I pointed out that in another verse he did a selected and swift killing, but no, this is drowning.  Those who managed to get floating devices suffered a more prolonged fate.

 

Nice god you've got there.  I spit on him.

 

 

 

Do you have a thought on the evil of men? 

[Roz]

Do you have a thought on the evil of men? 

 

 

 

I do.  As far as I know, no man has ever succeeded in world wide genocide.  Your god is a lot worse than him.

 

Would you drown this child?  Your god did.

 

[ironhorse]

 

Do you have a thought on the evil of men? 

 

 

 

I do.  As far as I know, no man has ever succeeded in world wide genocide.  Your god is a lot worse than him.

 

Would you drown this child?  Your god did.

 

 

 

 

Your reply did not answer the question.

 

What are your thoughts on evil committed by men?

[Roz]

I did answer.  My thoughts are exactly what I wrote down.  Man's evil has never come close to world wide genocide.  Your god's did. 

 

Would you drown that child?  In what context, what evil, has that child done to warrant a drowning death? 

[Roz]

This is the god you serve, the one who would kill that boy.