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Modern Vs Ancient Christians


Castiel233
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I was reading recently about some of the early church fathers. Some of them gave away all their wealth and lived and preached in poverty. The truly lived and breathed their faith and welcomed martyrdom .

 

Compared to their modern followers in Christ, such as WLC, who writes books and maintains a website promoting the faith, ancient Christians appear much more hard core and sincere in their faith.

 

Would a Christian several centuries ago, recognize a modern Christian, such as WLC, as a genuine follower of Christ?

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It's difficult to know what they would have thought of WLC. They surely would have been completely shocked by modern culture, though. The average person in the developed world today would have been considered extremely wealthy by ancient standards.

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It's difficult to know what they would have thought of WLC. They surely would have been completely shocked by modern culture, though. The average person in the developed world today would have been considered extremely wealthy by ancient standards.

I wish I was considered wealthy :)

 

I do wonder how modern Christian thinkers and debaters square the circle of what the Bible asks of them (abandon their families, shun wealth, don’t go to the doctor when sick, etc), and how they live their lives.

 

I don’t want to pick on WLC, its not his fault The Bible (true or not) is so horrific, but

Early Christians seemed to take the faith much, much more seriously and sacrificed a lot for it, in their personal lives. Modern Christians, er, well not so much, preferring it seems, the nice shoes and suits approach

 

How do modern apologists get away with preaching a faith, parts of which they themselves do not live up to?    

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It's quite unlikely any ancient Christians would have recognized protestantism as a form of Christianity at all.

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty.  A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community.  There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters.  To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

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This is part of the problem of modern believers, early christians worshiped much more in line with who the God of the Bible is, modern ones worship in line with who they would like God to be.

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty.  A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community.  There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters.  To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

I suppose it depends on their motives, giving away their wealth shows their willingness to obey unpleasant injunctions in stark, very stark contrast to their modern counter parts 

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty.  A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community.  There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters.  To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

 

I agree. I'm all for helping people who are in need, and in fact just last weekend I gave a fairly sizable amount to a family going through a hard time, and that's not the first time I've done so. However, it wouldn't make sense to give so much away that I put my own family in poverty, thus making us dependent on others for sustenance.

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Sometimes I feel that modern christians treat their god more like a slave who have to fulfil their will or atm machine that have to give them wealth

 

human become the master of god

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The people who gave away their possessions for their faith were certainly sincere. Sincerity of belief is no barameter of truth though. Many people believe wrong things sincerely. That said, I think that style of devotion was just a continuation of the previous idea of the sacrificial system. It seems like the ancient Christians believed that animal sacrifice was no longer required but they still felt the need to sacrifice something to show their devotion. Even though their possessions weren't burnt on an alter to god, the effect of giving them up was the same.

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty. A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community. There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters. To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

I agree. I'm all for helping people who are in need, and in fact just last weekend I gave a fairly sizable amount to a family going through a hard time, and that's not the first time I've done so. However, it wouldn't make sense to give so much away that I put my own family in poverty, thus making us dependent on others for sustenance.

Agreed! That's just a borrowing from Peter to pay Paul type of thing. Giving all you have to a needy person to the point of giving yourself the same need may make you feel good about yourself, but the need has not been elimentated, just transferred.

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty. A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community. There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters. To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

I agree. I'm all for helping people who are in need, and in fact just last weekend I gave a fairly sizable amount to a family going through a hard time, and that's not the first time I've done so. However, it wouldn't make sense to give so much away that I put my own family in poverty, thus making us dependent on others for sustenance.

Agreed! That's just a borrowing from Peter to pay Paul type of thing. Giving all you have to a needy person to the point of giving yourself the same need may make you feel good about yourself, but the need has not been elimentated, just transferred.

 

Thats a good point, transferring the wealth, makes little sense even in theology, unless its a willingness to impoverish yourself for God

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty. A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community. There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters. To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

I agree. I'm all for helping people who are in need, and in fact just last weekend I gave a fairly sizable amount to a family going through a hard time, and that's not the first time I've done so. However, it wouldn't make sense to give so much away that I put my own family in poverty, thus making us dependent on others for sustenance.

Agreed! That's just a borrowing from Peter to pay Paul type of thing. Giving all you have to a needy person to the point of giving yourself the same need may make you feel good about yourself, but the need has not been elimentated, just transferred.

 

Thats a good point, transferring the wealth, makes little sense even in theology, unless its a willingness to impoverish yourself for God

 

In the Talmud, there's an upper limit to how much of your wealth you may give over a span of time.

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty. A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community. There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters. To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

I agree. I'm all for helping people who are in need, and in fact just last weekend I gave a fairly sizable amount to a family going through a hard time, and that's not the first time I've done so. However, it wouldn't make sense to give so much away that I put my own family in poverty, thus making us dependent on others for sustenance.

Agreed! That's just a borrowing from Peter to pay Paul type of thing. Giving all you have to a needy person to the point of giving yourself the same need may make you feel good about yourself, but the need has not been elimentated, just transferred.

 

Thats a good point, transferring the wealth, makes little sense even in theology, unless its a willingness to impoverish yourself for God

 

In the Talmud, there's an upper limit to how much of your wealth you may give over a span of time.

 

One wonders why giving away you're money makes God happy, all seems a bit odd

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There has been such a revolution in our understanding of the natural world that barring some world wide catastrophe were to happen that wiped out most of the knowledge and scientific discoveries of the the last 5 centuries we can never go back to or completely understand those times.

 

Christianity probably was a great help to people in making sense of the world and their short painful lives. Unless you were in a monastery you probably did not even have access to the Bible or the knowledge to read it.  You just believed what the Church said. It made much more sense a thousand years ago to go into a monastic life, especially for a woman.

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I don't admire people who give away their wealth and live in poverty. A responsible person manages their wealth for the benefit of their community. There is nothing honorable or virtuous about turning your wealth over to your betters. To the degree that ancient Christians jettisoned their wealth to their more-responsible pagan neighbors, ancient Christians were behaving in a delinquent manner.

I agree. I'm all for helping people who are in need, and in fact just last weekend I gave a fairly sizable amount to a family going through a hard time, and that's not the first time I've done so. However, it wouldn't make sense to give so much away that I put my own family in poverty, thus making us dependent on others for sustenance.

Agreed! That's just a borrowing from Peter to pay Paul type of thing. Giving all you have to a needy person to the point of giving yourself the same need may make you feel good about yourself, but the need has not been elimentated, just transferred.

 

Thats a good point, transferring the wealth, makes little sense even in theology, unless its a willingness to impoverish yourself for God

 

In the Talmud, there's an upper limit to how much of your wealth you may give over a span of time.

 

One wonders why giving away you're money makes God happy, all seems a bit odd

 

Because that money can help other people? If you don't realize that, I wonder what's wrong with you.

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One wonders why giving away you're money makes God happy, all seems a bit odd

 

Because that money can help other people? If you don't realize that, I wonder what's wrong with you.

 

Miekko, your first sentence makes a good point.  Your second sentence gets into personal digs that are unnecessary.  This is the tendency I referred to several days ago.  

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One wonders why giving away you're money makes God happy, all seems a bit odd

 

Because that money can help other people? If you don't realize that, I wonder what's wrong with you.

 

Given your comment is completely unrelated to my statement of Gods happiness, I wonder whats wrong with you

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