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Was Jesus Fully Man?


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Christians love to point out that jesus knows what it is to be like us, because he was tested on all points and he never gave into temptation once. But if jesus knows what it is to be fully human, then wouldn't he need to be sinful also.

 

Since how else can he know what it's like to be human if he never gave into temptation once. How can I trust him to judge me fairly on judgement day if he never knew the sting of my particular sins.

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Through the magical powers of popular Christian hocus pocus theology, Jesus is also supposed to be fully God.

Behold, the shirt that's 100% cotton and 100% rayon.

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Raptor Jesus is 100% God, 100% man and 100% dinosaur.

 

 

.

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in older days, a virgin at 33,,,,,,,, he probably was never a real man

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Jesus was a man who embodied Christhood, the lost teachings of Jesus is clear that true sin is the sin of separation.

Also Jesus said he and god will not judge us after we die, we do the judging upon ourselves.

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Theologians have argued this question and defined each other as heretics based on the answer. They frame it like this "did Jesus have one nature or two natures?" One group were called "monophysites"--it's all ridiculous really, just an argument made necessary by the convoluted theology of the Jesus story.

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     I think he was smooth like a Ken doll so, no, not fully man.  Or maybe that's what made him part god?

 

          mwc

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Jesus was a man who embodied Christhood, the lost teachings of Jesus is clear that true sin is the sin of separation.

Also Jesus said he and god will not judge us after we die, we do the judging upon ourselves.

Cianna, thanks for sharing your perspective. And the "god" you refer to is not the god of orthodox Christianity, right? Rather, you refer to what Wicca believes is true spirit-energy. Is that correct? Thanks again for offering a view that helps broaden the discussion.

 

Human

 

Hi human, the god I speak of is in fact the true god that Jesus spoke of, and not Yahweh, the god of Christianity.

Wiccans know that the one divine source is non judgemental and limitless in love, mercy and forgiveness, but there is a something called karma, so we must consider the consequences for our actions, words and even thoughts. Karma is not punishment but the way we are taught to try to see where we went wrong in our lives.

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Thoughts:

 

I blogged about a book I read on the topic of Jesus and his birth. Simply put, the book (whose title eludes me still!) put forth the theory that Jesus was an XX male, created solely by Mary's eggs. An interesting theory, but one I could never fully get behind for anything other than a good laugh. However, if it were true, then Jesus wouldn't have been a normal man. He may have very well have been inter sexed and that may account for why he was not too keen on lust and sex.

 

All of this assumes that there was a Jesus to begin with, a proposition that I find lacking.

 

As far his nature goes, I personally do not believe that he was God nor was he man or spirit. He is a character. Fictional characters can be anything you want them to be. Harry Potter was both a boy and a wizard. Spock was both a Vulcan and a human. Peter Parker was both a spider and a man. Dualistic nature is an old trope, a classic one that has been used since the beginning. It is a great way to stage conflict as the two (or more) natures battle within the character.

 

Jesus' supposed triune nature was an expansion on the older Greek tales that alleged that some gods were both god and man. The spirit was a later addition thrown in to further marry him to the theology that is found in John and the Epistles. In reading the gospels, I found that Jesus' character was poorly written. The authors did not write the story in such a way that presented him as having a dualistic nature, even though he is presented as being such. There is no internal strife, no battle between his god-side and his human side. He is a flat character that is always "good" and says a lot of pithy sayings. Yawn. Then he dies for three days. Yawn.

 

Harry grappled with his inner nature, his wizard powers throughout the series. He had to choose good over evil. He had obstacles, he had emotion! Jesus was a self-righteous tight ass who sponged off of people and did parlor tricks. Occasionally he cried and when he died, he put on a show to prove a point. Yet he didn't even have the dignity of a villain: to stay dead!

 

Spock was a more plainly painted emotion vs. logic trope. Yet there was great strife within him as he remained true to his Vulcan nature, yet showed that he was human too. Jesus just walked around claiming that he was God's son and used that as license to do whatever he wanted. There was no struggle, no tension, presented in the Jesus narrative that shows him growing or understanding anything deeper about his own nature or the natures of those around him.

 

So maybe the authors of the bible couldn't create a solid dualistic trope character. Fine. Why not go all out and make him super-human? Why not throw some theatrics into the equation ala Spider-man or Hercules? If they couldn't tell us, then at least show us what makes Jesus both God and man. Yet the authors don't even give the readers, the believers, anything more than some vague assertions to hang their hats on. There isn't a mutagenic spider that makes the hero or an ethereal ass-whipping provided by the hero to strengthen his positions.

 

There is nothing behind Jesus. The story does nothing to foster belief. It is flimsy and that is why it endures. People can make Jesus into whatever they want him to be. He can be fully man when you need to teach lessons about temptation, sexual purity and sin, he can be fully God when you need to talk about fulfilling God's wrath and his forgiveness, and he can be fully spirit when you need a shoulder to cry on.

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Check my blog entry "Musings: Gender Bending Jesus" for more detail on the whole intersex Jesus thing, Human. Don't want to derail this thread.

 

As for the crying on the cross showing Jesus to be human at the end, it was too little, too late. Perhaps if he hadn't came back to life a few days later, it would have had more oomph.

 

For me, it was never enough to say that he was both man and God. He says that he is one with the father, but that is a claim. How many holy men say that they are one with God, that God speaks through them, etc? Quite a few. There was a thread awhile back where a Hindu member of ex-c spoke of a modern Indian holy man who made similar claims to the ones Jesus made. He performed miracles. There was also photographic evidence of his existence. So what makes one more credible than the other?

 

The story should explain more about Jesus. His character should be more developed. There are texts that have come to light recently that talk about Jesus' childhood and the years before his ministry. Why aren't they being read and discussed? The answer is that they make Jesus more human. They show that he wasn't benevolent and good, that he was emotional and stubborn. If you make Jesus too human, then he must sin, for that is all that man does. After all, we are evil continually...

 

However, if Jesus were human and did sin, then perhaps I would take his death on the cross a bit more seriously. As it stands, the character is put to death for sedition against the Romans. He was making bogus claims and causing trouble, so they offed him. If he had had any sort of real, useful powers, they wouldn't have killed him. If he could feed 5,000 people with a loaf of bread and few fish, the Romans would have hired him to feed the empire. If he could heal sickness and lameness, they'd have closed the hospitals and taken him on the battlefields with them.

 

He was just another dime a dozen doomsday prophet / holy man who disturbed the status quo and got nailed to a cross. His story is one told to the pious and the credulous by those in control. He isn't magical (magic is from Satan!) and he isn't heroic, so what the hell do we have left? A passion narrative cobbled together some years after the fact and fed to the masses for 2,000 years, presented as absolute truth.

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Jesus was fully human and one of the nicest men I've ever known; he cut my grass better than anyone else ever has.  god rest his soul.

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If Christians are correct that jesus was sinless, then he couldn't have been made from mary's eggs. This is why the catholics say mary was also sinless (A sinless mother would also have sinless eggs)

 

There's only one way out of this dilemma. God would have to implanted the foetus jesus into mary's womb when the holy spirit over shadowed her.

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