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Goodbye Jesus

Why Did You Get Married?


Deidre

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Funny video about arranged marriage:

 

 

I got a traditional Hindu arranged marriage, and I suppose this is a fairly accurate representation of it. :)

 

I'll start out by saying that for the past half year it's worked out great for us (well for me it has, but I'm not quite sure how my wife puts up with me...).  For those who don't know, I only converted to Christianity when I was 19.  Having grown up as Americanized as I did, when I was a teenager I probably never would have agreed to marry someone who is effectively from a different culture than me.  As much as I hate Christianity, I have to say that my time as a Christian is what pushed me away from Western culture altogether, and it was the impetus for my embracing my parents' wish that I go along with the whole institution of arranged marriage.  When I left Jesus I was possessed by a desire to rid myself of anything which might even suggest that I retain any Christian influence.  Embracing the Hindu lifestyle anew was my way of saying "no" to Jesus and his religion with a certain finality, and with this came marriage.

 

...also, my parents basically showed me photos of women until I found the hot one.  True story.

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Margee, I feel the same about marriage in the future. I'm all for a committed, loving relationship, with someone who DOESN'T live with me. I seriously don't know how I could ever cohabitate again, after living alone. I get lonely enough that I'd like someone to be with *sometimes* but after a 22 year marriage, I see how much it means to me personally to have my own space, and my privacy, where I don't constantly feel I have to apologize or offer excuses for what, when, why, I eat what I do, read, watch, listen to what I do, do what I do, wear what I do, etc etc.

 

In answer to the OP: I got married because I couldn't stand to be without a man...I wanted sex...he was "the perfect Christian husband", and to be perfectly honest, although I never would have admitted this even to myself...I wanted someone to take care of me. That's about it. We didn't actually have much in common other than Jeebus. I got married at 19. Now, after my divorce, I am going through my 20's. Really. I am having to learn what most young adults do - how to take care of myself and earn a living, and find balance when you have the freedom to do what you want, discovering where my limits and boundaries are, etc. etc. And it feels REALLY damn good to know I'm capable of standing on my own two feet.

 

Anyway...as I said, I'm all for committed relationships, but an iron-clad legal lifetime promise is taking it too far. People change. Yes, there are MANY marriages that are worth saving and working at. But if two people change so much that they are perfect strangers, and there are some immovable obstacles (like my inability to believe again, and his disappointment in me because he believed I was weak and sinful and rebellious against god, and that he "loves god more than" me)...well..you only have one life, ya know.

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Young, stupid, was infatuated, didn't understand what marriage was really all about.. and it was a cultural expectation, I guess. Did it twice, same reasons (except the young part  lol)

 

Won't ever do it again.

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I got married mostly because I believed it was the only legitimate way for me to have sex without pissing God off. I also really loved my wife, but the desire for sex put a lot of pressure on us to get married.

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Margee, I feel the same about marriage in the future. I'm all for a committed, loving relationship, with someone who DOESN'T live with me. I seriously don't know how I could ever cohabitate again, after living alone. I get lonely enough that I'd like someone to be with *sometimes* but after a 22 year marriage, I see how much it means to me personally to have my own space, and my privacy, where I don't constantly feel I have to apologize or offer excuses for what, when, why, I eat what I do, read, watch, listen to what I do, do what I do, wear what I do, etc etc.

 

In answer to the OP: I got married because I couldn't stand to be without a man...I wanted sex...he was "the perfect Christian husband", and to be perfectly honest, although I never would have admitted this even to myself...I wanted someone to take care of me. That's about it. We didn't actually have much in common other than Jeebus. I got married at 19. Now, after my divorce, I am going through my 20's. Really. I am having to learn what most young adults do - how to take care of myself and earn a living, and find balance when you have the freedom to do what you want, discovering where my limits and boundaries are, etc. etc. And it feels REALLY damn good to know I'm capable of standing on my own two feet.

 

Anyway...as I said, I'm all for committed relationships, but an iron-clad legal lifetime promise is taking it too far. People change. Yes, there are MANY marriages that are worth saving and working at. But if two people change so much that they are perfect strangers, and there are some immovable obstacles (like my inability to believe again, and his disappointment in me because he believed I was weak and sinful and rebellious against god, and that he "loves god more than" me)...well..you only have one life, ya know.

 

thank you for this insightful post! yes, i agree...a great way you put it...'iron clad promise.' it just doesn't seem realistic, to me. it's nice to have a partnership, companionship, etc. but, to turn it into something more than it should be, a legal binding contract? it isn't for me. unfortunately, especially for women, still in this society, it's frowned upon for a woman to remain single. don't you want kids? don't you want to wake up next to someone every single day for the rest of your life? don't you want to have someone there for you when you get home from work?

 

NO! i don't. lol

 

then, the reply is often...''you haven't found the right person yet.'' to which i reply. fuck you. (just kidding, but i think it) i really think i'm in love with my now bf. if there were anyone i could be with day in and day out, it'd be him. but, he knows my thoughts on marriage, and he feels somewhat the same. he gets the same questions. 'dee, it's not easier being a man in that regard, you know,' he often says. his parents wonder if he'll ever 'settle down.' even that phrase is annoying...'settle down.' as if i'm living like a wild animal, running amuck. :rolleyes:

 

i enjoyed reading your reply, thanks for your honesty here.

 

Young, stupid, was infatuated, didn't understand what marriage was really all about.. and it was a cultural expectation, I guess. Did it twice, same reasons (except the young part  lol)

 

Won't ever do it again.

 infatuation is sometimes construed as love. that's a great point. thanks for your reply. and glad you are done! is that wrong to say? lol

 

I got married mostly because I believed it was the only legitimate way for me to have sex without pissing God off. I also really loved my wife, but the desire for sex put a lot of pressure on us to get married.

i've noticed that is a huge part of it for Christian couples. I think of the Duggar family, that tv show, relating to that as a reason.

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A lot of good points, especially RE: the fluidity of human relationship. I guess I sort of hold onto the idea because of gays and Lesbians I know who have struggled so much to gain this right. But, yeah, what you all are saying makes a ton of sense RE: different living quarters. To be honest, shallow as this sounds, I never thought about that. I mean, it simply never crossed my mind.

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I got married because I was crazy about Judy and marriage was the obvious choice. 21 years and two people deconverting later, we're still crazy about each other. I can't even imagine life without her.

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I was a Christian.  So was (is) my wife.  Therefore, marriage was the only option.

 

Would I have married anyway?  Not her (unless she also was non-Christian) as she would not consider courting anyone outside the faith.  But as a general principle?

 

Probably.

 

I was never interested in serial courting or casual relationships - my wife was my first girlfriend although I was not far off 20 before I took on board fundamentalist concepts and I never sought any other relationship with another Christian girl.  I really don't think I would have had a number of relationships as a non-Christian either.  Marriage represents permanence, and permanence is what I would have sought either way.  I rather suspect, were I to find myself without a wife now, I would remain single.

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I was a Christian.  So was (is) my wife.  Therefore, marriage was the only option.

 

Would I have married anyway?  Not her (unless she also was non-Christian) as she would not consider courting anyone outside the faith.  But as a general principle?

 

Probably.

 

I was never interested in serial courting or casual relationships - my wife was my first girlfriend although I was not far off 20 before I took on board fundamentalist concepts and I never sought any other relationship with another Christian girl.  I really don't think I would have had a number of relationships as a non-Christian either.  Marriage represents permanence, and permanence is what I would have sought either way.  I rather suspect, were I to find myself without a wife now, I would remain single.

Thanks for sharing this! Your response is so very interesting to me! You would have "sought out permanence either way."

Do you think permanence is important in relationships? I mean, for society as a whole?

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As a never-married Twenty-Something male just getting out of Christianity, I'm a fan of marriage. You can say that it's just a piece of paper, it doesn't mean anything, and if two people love each other, they'll stay together forever anyway, but there's something about officially recognizing a commitment to stay together for life that I just love.

 

When you marry someone, you become family. If your spouse gets sick, injured, depressed, etc, you stick with them even though it might be more fun at that point to go elsewhere. The thing is your spouse will do the same for you. I just think that level of commitment is invaluable. This is especially true once you throw children into the mix.

 

I know you'll throw the 50% statistic back at this, but it's not like eating a banana and having a 50% chance of dying. I like it more to climbing a mountain. The banana analogy makes it seem random. The mountain one, if you and your partner are prepared, have the right skills, and are committed, you can climb a mountain so many people have failed to climb.

 

Of course this is based on my view having never married. 40-something married AnonymousCoward might have something entirely different to say on this topic in 20 years.

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As a never-married Twenty-Something male just getting out of Christianity, I'm a fan of marriage. You can say that it's just a piece of paper, it doesn't mean anything, and if two people love each other, they'll stay together forever anyway, but there's something about officially recognizing a commitment to stay together for life that I just love.

When you marry someone, you become family. If your spouse gets sick, injured, depressed, etc, you stick with them even though it might be more fun at that point to go elsewhere. The thing is your spouse will do the same for you. I just think that level of commitment is invaluable. This is especially true once you throw children into the mix.

I know you'll throw the 50% statistic back at this, but it's not like eating a banana and having a 50% chance of dying. I like it more to climbing a mountain. The banana analogy makes it seem random. The mountain one, if you and your partner are prepared, have the right skills, and are committed, you can climb a mountain so many people have failed to climb.

Of course this is based on my view having never married. 40-something married AnonymousCoward might have something entirely different to say on this topic in 20 years.

The banana analogy (that I made in another thread), is no more random than choosing a complete stranger to get to know and hope you know enough to spend the rest of your life with, making all kinds of promises to this person, that over 50% of society can't keep.

 

:shrug:

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You're not choosing randomly. If I climb a mountain, I can figure out what kind of person I'd like and not like to have with me that gives us the best chance of accomplishing the goal. Same with getting married. After a year+ of dating, you should have a good idea if this person is willing to make the same commitments you are. You need to discuss these things, discuss these possibilities, discuss the commitment levels before getting married.

 

Of course, picking the right 50%* was much easier when it was she loves Jesus, therefore she will stay with me forever.

 

*As was alluded to earlier in this thread, the 50% is not 50% of people getting married, but 50% of marriages that fail. Serial marryers can inflate that statistic. 

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You're not choosing randomly. If I climb a mountain, I can figure out what kind of person I'd like and not like to have with me that gives us the best chance of accomplishing the goal. Same with getting married. After a year+ of dating, you should have a good idea if this person is willing to make the same commitments you are. You need to discuss these things, discuss these possibilities, discuss the commitment levels before getting married.

 

Of course, picking the right 50%* was much easier when it was she loves Jesus, therefore she will stay with me forever.

 

*As was alluded to earlier in this thread, the 50% is not 50% of people getting married, but 50% of marriages that fail. Serial marryers can inflate that statistic.

 

But you're implying that the majority of divorces are due to people rushing in and not getting to know someone long enough. 50%?

Lol no.

 

And more Christian marriages have proven to fail over atheist marriages, all things considered.

 

You're right about "serial marryers" though possibly skewing the stats a bit.

 

Climbing an actual mountain is sounding better and better. ;)

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But you're implying that the majority of divorces are due to people rushing in and not getting to know someone long enough. 50%?

Lol no. 

 

Less about the time spent together before marriage (which I think has no correlation with marital success rates [citation needed]) and more about the preparation part of it. I think a lot of people go into marriage not knowing what to expect. When you're dating, you're infatuated with the person you're dating, you don't see how you could ever have eyes for another and then a couple years into marriage, your spouse suddenly isn't turning you on as much as some other people you meet. Are you willing to stay committed, or do you think something's wrong with your marriage because something natural has occurred?

 

I don't know how many marriages I've heard of where the couple has not discussed important issues prior to getting married. He wants kids, she doesn't. They went into marriage without discussing it.

 

One good thing the church did give me was a healthy fear of marriage and the importance of preparation beforehand - asking the right questions, getting to know the person both at a surface level and at a deep level.

 

That said, arranged marriages do better statistically than the general population [citation needed]. I think it just comes down to how much both partners are willing to commit to climbing that mountain.

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I got married because I loved sex...and in order to please buybull God the only way to have "sin free sex" was to get married.

 

I also had to find a true believer as well.....

 

Anyhow, I don't think I believe in the institution of marriage. I'd do things way differently if I knew then what I know now.

 

I've made the commitment and have 2 great kids from the marriage, but I think marriage is kinda bullshit.

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To AC: Lol, maybe. ;)

 

I don't know.

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I got married because I loved sex...and in order to please buybull God the only way to have "sin free sex" was to get married.

 

I also had to find a true believer as well.....

 

Anyhow, I don't think I believe in the institution of marriage. I'd do things way differently if I knew then what I know now.

 

I've made the commitment and have 2 great kids from the marriage, but I think marriage is kinda bullshit.

Thanks for your thoughts and honesty about it all. Yes, religion was definitely a motivating factor for many it seems.

Christianity yet again, lying and making it sound like marriage was created by it.

 

So many lies Christianity tells and it's sad how many of us have done this or that, at its instruction.

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Want to add that my husband and I had our 25 year anniversary this year and every surgery he's ever had, every time he was sick or for whatever reason I have always been there for him.

 

However I don't think one has to be "married" to -be there- for others we care about. I think marriage can make someone take the other for granted, after all they are HOOKED now & now they just don't have to try as hard....

 

I hope and think decent people don't do this. However I think it's human nature to sometimes take the ones who we know are lassoed to us, for granted.

 

I understand the Native American way of relationships as I found out from Howard Zinn's -A People's History of the United States- a very different

view of relationships than the Puritanical European way. But that's just me. I don't think anyone really -belongs- to anyone else and marriage can kinda

do that. But some people like the idea of someone being -theirs-....Ah...anyhoo, just kinda thinking out loud. Wendyshrug.gif

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Want to add that my husband and I had our 25 year anniversary this year and every surgery he's ever had, every time he was sick or for whatever reason I have always been there for him.

 

However I don't think one has to be "married" to -be there- for others we care about. I think marriage can make someone take the other for granted, after all they are HOOKED now & now they just don't have to try as hard....

 

I hope and think decent people don't do this. However I think it's human nature to sometimes take the ones who we know are lassoed to us, for granted.

 

I understand the Native American way of relationships as I found out from Howard Zinn's -A People's History of the United States- a very different

view of relationships than the Puritanical European way. But that's just me. I don't think anyone really -belongs- to anyone else and marriage can kinda

do that. But some people like the idea of someone being -theirs-....Ah...anyhoo, just kinda thinking out loud. :shrug:

Absolutely this! We are on the same wave length.

 

I have a friend who's married and her husband and she are divorcing. Her husband dropped weight, is hitting the gym a few days per week and has looked better than during most of their marriage. Talk about taking for granted? He wouldn't take care of his body for his wife but now at the idea of fucking prospective women, he's all about fitness. What a fucking joke.

 

I told her ...this should tell you that it was the right decision but all she feels is like a failure.

 

Marriage, like religion, makes people feel like failures if it doesn't "work out."

 

For myself, I enjoy the romance with my bf and all that. But to deal with someone 24/7? I guess I can't see it. We spend the night at one another's place at times, but there are times I like to have my own space.

 

Not saying you forfeit all of yourself in a marriage, but it just seems like more to lose than gain. Maybe I'm just selfish. :(

:shrug:

 

See? I feel bad because these conformist ideals make us feel bad if we don't want them.

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I'm a huge fan of lifetime commitment, and being there for each other through thick and thin, and growing old together. That is wonderful when it happens. The problem, though, is that it takes TWO people to make that work. And the commitment from each partner needs to be more than just "I'm legally bound to you and it's too much of a pain in the ass to leave, so here I stay, even though I don't respect you and won't let you be yourself." So if only one is committed to real love and care and respect and effort, then you have a pretty bad marriage. And you either have to go through the hassle of getting a divorce, or just sitting there and wasting the rest of your life chained to someone you can't be happy with. No amount of "choosing the right person" can make up for the fact that sometimes people grow in completely different directions over time, so even if you're perfect for each other at the start, you may both be totally different people than when you first got together. If both people can accept that and roll with the changes and keep falling in love with their partner, terrific! But if you change and your partner says "nope, this is not what I signed up for, I only want you if you stay the same" then what can you do?

 

I think there can be a deep commitment and security in a relationship without being legally bound. Marriage seems more like an external restraint instead of an internal commitment. That's not to say every married couple is ONLY held together by legal restraints. But I think it can keep people from putting effort into real committed love.

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I was a Christian.  So was (is) my wife.  Therefore, marriage was the only option.

 

Would I have married anyway?  Not her (unless she also was non-Christian) as she would not consider courting anyone outside the faith.  But as a general principle?

 

Probably.

 

I was never interested in serial courting or casual relationships - my wife was my first girlfriend although I was not far off 20 before I took on board fundamentalist concepts and I never sought any other relationship with another Christian girl.  I really don't think I would have had a number of relationships as a non-Christian either.  Marriage represents permanence, and permanence is what I would have sought either way.  I rather suspect, were I to find myself without a wife now, I would remain single.

Thanks for sharing this! Your response is so very interesting to me! You would have "sought out permanence either way."

Do you think permanence is important in relationships? I mean, for society as a whole?

 

 

For society as a whole - well, that rather depends.  It's important for society if the social customs demand it, not otherwise.  And, of course, customs can change.  To some extent they are/have.  But I do not believe that the world will go to wrack and ruin if we all start behaving like the Denobulans (Star Trek reference) in each spouse having 3 spouses and being free to explore whatever other sexual adventures present themselves.  It will, however, be a tad awkward during the transition to that approach.

 

I do believe that children are best served by a stable home life - but that does not preclude a degree of flexibility either; and they are better served by the break up of an unhappy marriage than by its' dogged and obstinate misery.

 

So, permanence is what I sought for myself - possibly because I have neither the energy nor the interest to go seeking a series of partners.  That's a prospect that makes a cup of coffee and a bourbon biscuit (I'm not sure if that means anything in the U.S. - a sort of chocolate cream cookie, perhaps...) seem by far the more attractive option.

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I have a friend who's married and her husband and she are divorcing. Her husband dropped weight, is hitting the gym a few days per week and has looked better than during most of their marriage. Talk about taking for granted? He wouldn't take care of his body for his wife but now at the idea of fucking prospective women, he's all about fitness. What a fucking joke.

 

Hey, now.  Have you heard his side of the story here?

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I have a friend who's married and her husband and she are divorcing. Her husband dropped weight, is hitting the gym a few days per week and has looked better than during most of their marriage. Talk about taking for granted? He wouldn't take care of his body for his wife but now at the idea of fucking prospective women, he's all about fitness. What a fucking joke.

 

Hey, now.  Have you heard his side of the story here?

 

Yeah, this bothered me a little too. I lost a lot of weight after my divorce. Partly because I had a really active job for a while, partly because I lost my appetite, and partly because I no longer had to live with my husband who insisted on keeping junk food around the house. I could keep more healthy foods around.

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Want to add that my husband and I had our 25 year anniversary this year and every surgery he's ever had, every time he was sick or for whatever reason I have always been there for him.

 

However I don't think one has to be "married" to -be there- for others we care about. I think marriage can make someone take the other for granted, after all they are HOOKED now & now they just don't have to try as hard....

 

I hope and think decent people don't do this. However I think it's human nature to sometimes take the ones who we know are lassoed to us, for granted.

 

I understand the Native American way of relationships as I found out from Howard Zinn's -A People's History of the United States- a very different

view of relationships than the Puritanical European way. But that's just me. I don't think anyone really -belongs- to anyone else and marriage can kinda

do that. But some people like the idea of someone being -theirs-....Ah...anyhoo, just kinda thinking out loud. Wendyshrug.gif

Absolutely this! We are on the same wave length.

 

I have a friend who's married and her husband and she are divorcing. Her husband dropped weight, is hitting the gym a few days per week and has looked better than during most of their marriage. Talk about taking for granted? He wouldn't take care of his body for his wife but now at the idea of fucking prospective women, he's all about fitness. What a fucking joke.

 

I told her ...this should tell you that it was the right decision but all she feels is like a failure.

 

Marriage, like religion, makes people feel like failures if it doesn't "work out."

 

For myself, I enjoy the romance with my bf and all that. But to deal with someone 24/7? I guess I can't see it. We spend the night at one another's place at times, but there are times I like to have my own space.

 

Not saying you forfeit all of yourself in a marriage, but it just seems like more to lose than gain. Maybe I'm just selfish. sad.png

Wendyshrug.gif

 

See? I feel bad because these conformist ideals make us feel bad if we don't want them.

 

I know what you mean. Society tries to impose on us these "rules" but in reality it's not so easy to figure this all out.  If marriage is so wonderful, why do 50% end in divorce..that includes for believers too. Hell believers get divorced as much as non-believers do...but I digress.

 

I'm the type of person where I REALLY need my space. It probably has to do with being raised in a HUGE family where my physical space was always being invaded..no privacy...boundaries crossed. So I guess I have reacted to my upbringing, LOL. My husband understands this -fortunately. Lol

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I had an argument this morning with my bf about all this, told him about this thread. Thought he'd find it funny, but no...the conversation went into a direction I wasn't at all prepared for. Apparently, he is more pro marriage than I once thought.

 

If this relationship ends, I will make sure to ask the next guy, ''do you believe in marriage?'' If the answer is 'yes,' I'm not going any further.

 

This is just a really bad day. sad.png

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