Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 It is generally accepted by the faithful that God hears AND answers prayers. Setting aside His rather patchy record on answering prayer, how in Heaven does He hear an individual’s specific prayer. Let’s look at it this way. Say there are 1.5 billion Christians in the world. Of that number about half or so pray (around 750 million) regularly, that is to say five or more prayers daily. These prayers are sent to God using telepathy across numerous time zones in a variety of languages. Some of these mental petitions to the Lord want different things. Perhaps a husband prays that his wife will not get promoted at work, as this means they will need to move to a new location. The wife prays to get the promotion, she is looking forward to moving, as is her mum, as the daughter will be moving closer to her. Three of the five children pray in favour of the promotion, the other two don’t want to move, they like their current school, and any way maternal granny is a bit stern and less fun than paternal granny who only lives half a mile away and bakes the meanest cookies known to man, and she always lets them watch Sponge Bob as much as they want. God of course meanwhile is being bombarded with prayers to let it rain in Africa, prayers to stop war, prayers to keep the Democrats out, to keep the Democrats in, to overturn Roe VS wade, to ensure the troops win in Iraq, to bring the troops home…….on and on and on, millions of prayers a week wanting different things. How does a believer really believe their individual plaintive mental begging gets picked up? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeThinkerNZ Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Perhaps a husband prays that his wife will not get promoted at work, as this means they will need to move to a new location. The wife prays to get the promotion, she is looking forward to moving, as is her mum, as the daughter will be moving closer to her. Three of the five children pray in favour of the promotion, the other two don’t want to move, they like their current school, and any way maternal granny is a bit stern and less fun than paternal granny who only lives half a mile away and bakes the meanest cookies known to man, and she always lets them watch Sponge Bob as much as they want. This really made me laugh. Thanks for that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antix Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 When I was a Xian, I prayed a ton of times and could accept the "not in accordance with Gods will", but then again ,the Bible does say if 2 or more pray together in his name it will be granted. 90 percent of prayers go unanswered and the other 10 percent are random chance. I have seen too many: God is leading us to do this or do that etc. What bullshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 The “if it be thy will” is a standard Christian response, flawed as it is. If it is God's will, why pray If God doesn't answer prayer, then why does His book does says that He does. Prayer is a major hole in Christianity, because it does not work, unaided God can find your car keys (if you look) He can get you that job (if you apply and have relevant experience) He can sell you house (if you put it on the market and get a good agent) He can cure your cancer (if you get the treatment and have great care from a qualified professional) Does He do these things without human interaction? No. (Christians claim He is working through His followers……how convenient) The fact is no prayers appeared to be answered beyond statistical chance and without human involvement. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 Perhaps a husband prays that his wife will not get promoted at work, as this means they will need to move to a new location. The wife prays to get the promotion, she is looking forward to moving, as is her mum, as the daughter will be moving closer to her. Three of the five children pray in favour of the promotion, the other two don’t want to move, they like their current school, and any way maternal granny is a bit stern and less fun than paternal granny who only lives half a mile away and bakes the meanest cookies known to man, and she always lets them watch Sponge Bob as much as they want. This really made me laugh. Thanks for that You are welcome : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 Ask for something in Prayer and get it=Praise be to God Don't get it=God knows you don't need it/testing you/its not His will/Have you got enough faith/he's not your personal Genie..... etc, etc,etc Prayer "logic" sickens me! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
★ Citsonga ★ Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 The “if it be thy will” is a standard Christian response, flawed as it is. If it is Gods will, why pray If God doesn’t answer prayer, then why His book does says that He does. Prayer is a major hole in Christianity, because it does not work, unaided God can find your car keys (if you look) He can get you that job (if you apply and have relevant experience) He can sell you house (if you put it on the market and get a good agent) He can cure your cancer (if you get the treatment and have great care from a qualified professional) Does He do these things without human interaction? No. (Christians claim He is working through His followers……how convenient) The fact is no prayers appeared to be answered beyond statistical chance and without human involvement. Well said. Even more problematic is the concept of praying for others' well-being. For example, if a man prays for his terminally ill wife to be healed, what are the implications? By trying to sway God to heal her, that implies that God needs the swaying, which in turn implies that God's default position is to not heal her. If God would answer the prayer, then that implies that he would not have healed her if the man hadn't prayed, which in turn would mean that God made his dealings with one person contingent upon another, which is completely unjust. The whole thing is patently absurd! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted August 3, 2014 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2014 My question always was the same. How can god hear all the millions of prayers per day? We were told in the Pentecostal church that within each one of us was the 'dwelling of the holy spirit' and that was the direct line to god. There were no barriers to talking with god at all. There was no time, space, language barrier that was too difficult for god. He knew the number of hairs on your head. He saw each sparrow fall. I totally believed this at one time. I remember taping a picture of my x husband on the back of my bible when he left. I prayed over this picture several times a day with anguish in my heart and asked god to bring him home for 6 months straight. I got nothing as usual. It was all these things that lead me to believe that god probably did not exist. At least not for me. One of the happiest days of my life was when I discovered EX-c...then I knew I wasn't alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Castiel, we've got a christian in the den trying to convince ex-c's that there might be a link between genetic predispositions to original sin. Now he's trying to prove that prayer is a viable communication with god (which god? his of course). It's pretty entertaining and sad at the same time. Christians are sadorable. http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/63786-schizophrenia-and-genetics/#.U95SYWOTCa8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilovemybrain Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 . One of the happiest days of my life was when I discovered EX-c...then I knew I wasn't alone. Well, Margee, that was a happy day for us as well! :-D 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 Castiel, we've got a christian in the den trying to convince ex-c's that there might be a link between genetic predispositions to original sin. Now he's trying to prove that prayer is a viable communication with god (which god? his of course). It's pretty entertaining and sad at the same time. Christians are sadorable. http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/63786-schizophrenia-and-genetics/#.U95SYWOTCa8 My dear Uncle died as a direct result of his schizophrenia. The idea that such an awful illness is linked to Sin, is sick........I dream of the day that the church and its hate-filled Bible fetish followers go the way of the dodo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 My question always was the same. How can god hear all the millions of prayers per day? We were told in the Pentecostal church that within each one of us was the 'dwelling of the holy spirit' and that was the direct line to god. There were no barriers to talking with god at all. There was no time, space, language barrier that was too difficult for god. He knew the number of hairs on your head. He saw each sparrow fall. I totally believed this at one time. I remember taping a picture of my x husband on the back of my bible when he left. I prayed over this picture several times a day with anguish in my heart and asked god to bring him home for 6 months straight. I got nothing as usual. It was all these things that lead me to believe that god probably did not exist. At least not for me. One of the happiest days of my life was when I discovered EX-c...then I knew I wasn't alone. Margee, you are lovely, and are an asset to the online community. We are happy to have you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted August 3, 2014 Author Share Posted August 3, 2014 The “if it be thy will” is a standard Christian response, flawed as it is. If it is Gods will, why pray If God doesn’t answer prayer, then why His book does says that He does. Prayer is a major hole in Christianity, because it does not work, unaided God can find your car keys (if you look) He can get you that job (if you apply and have relevant experience) He can sell you house (if you put it on the market and get a good agent) He can cure your cancer (if you get the treatment and have great care from a qualified professional) Does He do these things without human interaction? No. (Christians claim He is working through His followers……how convenient) The fact is no prayers appeared to be answered beyond statistical chance and without human involvement. Well said. Even more problematic is the concept of praying for others' well-being. For example, if a man prays for his terminally ill wife to be healed, what are the implications? By trying to sway God to heal her, that implies that God needs the swaying, which in turn implies that God's default position is to not heal her. If God would answer the prayer, then that implies that he would not have healed her if the man hadn't prayed, which in turn would mean that God made his dealings with one person contingent upon another, which is completely unjust. The whole thing is patently absurd! Give a man a fish he will eat for a day Give a man the means to fish, he will eat for the rest of his life Give a man a Bible and tell him to pray for fish and he will stave to death Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted August 3, 2014 Moderator Share Posted August 3, 2014 . One of the happiest days of my life was when I discovered EX-c...then I knew I wasn't alone. Well, Margee, that was a happy day for us as well! :-D And I am sooooo glad to see you darlin'. So glad. you were here for me right from the beginning!! Hug You also Castiel. So glad you are here!! hug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
◊ crazyguy123 ◊ Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Maybe all of those prayers go into a giant answering machine, with billions of low-ranking angels recording each prayer and only giving the interesting ones to God so that he doesn't have to listen to every single one. This way, he can ignore all of the prayers about ending wars, and feeding starving children and only answer those that are of people asking for him to do things he was planning to do anyway. Another plus side to the giant answering machine is that the prayers of believers who are going to eventually deconvert and burn in Hell in the future can be ignored. He's omniscient, after all, so he already knows that it's pointless to answer the prayers of those who he knew beforehand were going to be damned since day one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExCBooster Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Give a man a fish he will eat for a day Give a man the means to fish, he will eat for the rest of his life Give a man a Bible and tell him to pray for fish and he will stave to death ... Make a man a fire, and you keep him warm for the night. Set a man on fire, and you keep him warm for the rest of his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerk Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 James 5: 14-15 -- 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer of faith will save the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. I've heard a couple of Church of Christ preachers say they think this passage is about "spiritual illness" rather than physical sickness. Of course, it clearly isn't, because it ends with IF they have sins those will be forgiven. No, it clearly says that if you have the elders pray for you and you take your medicine (the modern equivalent of anointing with oil), you will get well. The reason the preachers try to say it isn't about physical illness is that it's perfectly clear that the promise is not true. They know that prayer fails most of the time, that people who are seriously ill may not die, but seldom if ever are "restored to their much wanted health" as the prayer usually says. So if the Bible must be 100% true, then this verse must not be saying what it appears to say. They're trying to make reality fit the scriptures, but it doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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