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I would say someone that believes an evil demon like santa can possess a snake and make it talk, is smarter than someone who believes a monkey can do it by himself.

 

Way to live up to your name there Hoss.

 

 

Besides, have you seen the things monkeys can do by themselves? It's often more intelligent than what many humans do by themselves (or in groups).

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The difference is I study the Bible with NUMEROUS resources and an honest heart to know the truth it contains.

 

No, the difference here is that you are still being duped. Please do continue studying "with numerous resources and an honest heart to know the truth" though. How do you think the majority of us here at EXC BECAME exes? :scratch:

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I'm sure this has been brought up before, but I have to bring it up again...this is back to the Satan/serpent thing...I just don't have the opportunity to read 43 pages of responses while I'm at work to see if it's been discussed yet.

 

Let's lay a few ground rules, shall we?

 

Number one, animals are considered by christians to be "soulless" and will not be in heaven nor in hell, correct? (not sure where the biblical support for that one is)

 

Number two, animals since they are soulless (spiritless, whichever suits the apologists fancy at the moment) have no free will as do humans.

 

Number three, since an animal has no soul and no free will, they cannot sin. They do only what they are preprogrammed to do.

 

Now Satan comes along and "possesses" the serpent and uses its body to communicate with Eve. He tempts her to eat the fruit of the TOKOGAE. She tempts Adam to do the same. Satan, through the serpent causes the downfall of humanity. They now require the sacrifice of God's only son to be redeemed.

 

This sufficiently pisses GAWD off and he takes his anger out on who? Satan, the author of the whole plot? Nope. The poor little soulless, snake who is incapable of sinning and was POSSESSED by a higher power and USED to do the evil deed. This innocent creature is then cursed to writhe on its belly and eat dust all its days.

 

Please explain?

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Isaiah 11:8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den. :eek:

 

 

cockatrice 1: a legendary serpent with deadly glance said to be hatched by a reptile from a cock's egg on a dunghill and often conceived of and represented especially in heraldry as having the head, wings, and legs of a cock and the tail of a serpent

 

Hmm...so where are the cockatrice now? With the unicorns? Or maybe we should be using a different definition of a cockatrice?

 

2: an extremely offensive especially pernicious person

 

HEY! What are YOU doing in the DICTIONARY??? Oh...sorry. They're relating the mythological cockatrice to a person. Still doesn't suit your purpose. Out of context.

 

cockatrice 3: obsolete : PROSTITUTE

 

Well, while humorous and resolving the problem of the non-existent creature, it still leaves that pesky context issue.

 

Please enlighten me, oh enlightened one?

:thanks:

 

Yeah. Pretty smart for the snake to be possessed. Even SMARTER was the guy who punished the CREATURE for the discression by taking away it's legs, and all it's progeny's legs, while not doing anything at all to "Santa" (who actually possessed the animal).

 

Yep...I knew it was too obvious to go unnoticed for too long around here. Beat me to it Raven. :grin:

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Guest bdp
The difference is I study the Bible with NUMEROUS resources and an honest heart to know the truth it contains.

 

"...the intent of a man's heart is is evil from his youth." God, Genesis 8:21

 

As I said at the beginning of this thread, you don't have an honest heart according to your own book and deity.

 

bdp

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"If everything that exists must have been created, then who created God?"

 

 

 

Man was created in God's image and man immediately returns the favour and creates God in his image.

 

 

 

"If everything that exists must have been created, then who created God?"

 

 

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My problem with this passage is the talking serpent.

 

 

 

I would say someone that believes an evil demon like santa can possess a snake and make it talk, is smarter than someone who believes a monkey can do it by himself.

 

 

Yeah. Pretty smart for the snake to be possessed. Even SMARTER was the guy who punished the CREATURE for the discression by taking away it's legs, and all it's progeny's legs, while not doing anything at all to "Santa" (who actually possessed the animal).

 

Yep that guy is real smart. Got a real leg up on those monkeys.

 

Man was to have dominion and rule over the animal kingdom and yet it was through an animal that he was led astray.

 

The snake was cursed to crawl on the ground and therefore susceptible to man’s heel crushing its head. This is a foreshadowing of what will happen to santa.

 

When an animal is an instrument in sins against nature he is to be slain along with the man (Lev 20:15,16). Is that because there is real blame and guilt on the part of the animal? No, but because the instrument is often broken/punished along with the actual perpetrator.

 

God has the right to curse an animal in a specific way due to the sin of another; He did that very thing in regard to Adam’s sin. When Adam sinned and threw all of creation into chaos, God cursed the ground so that it produced thorns. Was the ground to blame? Was it actually guilty? No, but it was rightly punished due to the Sin of Adam.

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Man was created in God's image and man immediately returns the favour and creates God in his image.

 

And the god (my way or the highway man created) is evil, hypocritical, judgemental, has temper tantrums, plays with humans like toys, is selfish, etc. etc. Biblegods dark side totally contradicts the message of a loving god. One can trash what is clearly mans selfish description and desire to control via fear and take hold of the message of love only, leaving the rest without worry.

 

In your profile you say "prove that creation didn't happen." Do you realize what an arrogant statement that is considering that there are HUNDREDS of creation stories? They all pretty much start out the same and if you want to use science to prove the bible is the right one, you'd still not have proof. Science goes more along with other versions of creation in which it took millions of years for the earth to come in to being as we now have it today.

 

So....PROVE that creation is a result of your version of "god". :grin:

 

You see Redneck...the message of love and the benefits of it are timeless. People have known this througout the ages, some people wrote it down. The love that they saw is beautiful and they wanted to share their thoughts on love with others, many already had these same thoughts but they didn't write them down, love manifested in them and still does with people today. Some people though, for whatever reason feel a need to read what others have to say on love, they need help seeing that they have it within them to share....that is the GOOD NEWS!

 

One doesn't need Christ, Buddha, Moses, Mohammed, or the Bible, Koran, and other religious books etc. to tell them what love is...they can know by themselves without aid but it's there in many forms if one chooses to use sources for learning. Some tried to express and show things in story form and some mixed in a little history, then came along some other kinds of people who tried to take this simple and universal message and turn it into the UGLY, one way only path that we see in religions today.

 

I have found in my short time at this site that people here are very loving , very intelligent, far smarter than I could hope to be, and I deeply respect that. I will answer your statements above, but I gotta go away for a few days (camping). I will leave a question" how does love conquer death"

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I will leave a question" how does love conquer death"

 

Did someone post something about this that I missed?

 

Love only "conquers" death in the perception and memory of loved ones still alive after a person has died. Obviously only a figurative meaning of the word "conquer", as the dead remain dead as we understand the condition in this lifetime. Beyond this lifetime......your socially conditioned guess is no better than mine.

 

What the hell this question had to do with anything whatsoever that was being discussed is completely beyond me.

 

So I ask again, did I miss a post somewhere?

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I will leave a question" how does love conquer death"

 

Well in my experience. Love usually conquers death with by getting it in a figure four leg lock, then climbing to the top rope & crowning it.

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Here is the thing, people choose NOT to accept God on earth, when they die they go to a place without God which is Hell. God is only given them what they want.

 

Ah, yeah.

 

And the rapist, holding the knife to his victim's neck says, "Love me, give yourself to me, submit to me, and I will spare your life. Reject my affections and your throat will be slit."

 

When the rapist was brought before the judge, he said, "I gave her a choice to love me and live. She refused, even though she knew the consequences. She chose to die."

 

 

Nice choice huh?

 

Your god is a monster. It's a good thing he's not real.

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Your god is a monster. It's a good thing he's not real.

 

Our webmaster rocks.

 

I love you brother!

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I will leave a question" how does love conquer death"

 

Respectfully Redneck, why does love need to conquer death? True love has the power to conquer fear, hatred, intolerance, and violence...if more people could see and embrace it, the more real and horrible things in life could be conquered...real issues vs. dead ones. It doesn't matter what happens after death, what matters is how we use love to conquer real and pressing issues while alive, in that way, love is eternal (heaven), just like hate is eternal (hell) while we live. How we live today affects the lives of people on earth after we are but a distant memory.

 

Have fun on your trip.

Awesome Serene!

 

The ironic thing is is that Jesus was speaking about people's lives...not their afterlives. :shrug:

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Man was to have dominion and rule over the animal kingdom and yet it was through an animal that he was led astray.

 

Oh I see it was this was the plan of God all along.

 

God has the right to curse an animal in a specific way due to the sin of another;

 

Then I guess this God is hypocrate when he says,

 

Ezekiel 18:20-28

The soul who sins is the one who will die. The son will not share the guilt of the father, nor will the father share the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous man will be credited to him, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against him.

 

BTW you have no evidence in the Genesis verse which says that the snake was possesed, nor is there any evidence in the OT. The Devil is just one of the ideas which the NT took from Greek societies, such a concept is non-existince in the OT.

 

Before you start argueing about the evidence of the Devil in OT do check here

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My problem with this passage is the talking serpent.

 

 

 

I would say someone that believes an evil demon like santa can possess a snake and make it talk, is smarter than someone who believes a monkey can do it by himself.

 

I read this as a reference to evolution vs. creationism. If so, what the hell do monkey's have to do with anything? You should read up on evolution before you try your hand at metaphor's.

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<Evangelical mood>

 

Oh, I hope you will once be saved by atheism, xians overhere! Live like you like. LLYL. Pimp your life. :wicked:

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