Wertbag Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 If you imagine a world where the Christian god was real, all powerful and all knowing. Where that god loves everyone and wants to have a personal relationship with everyone, what would that world look like? I imagine one religion with no doubt that they are right. No atheists as you couldn't deny a real god who actually shows up. An up to date holy book that everyone understood. A being you could communicate with and have open discussions with. No need for churches as god is with you in your home. I would expect no diseases, no war and no crime. Basically I expect paradise on earth. Instead we have a planet which matches exactly what I imagine a place with no god would be. The very way the world is screams there is no god. 2
seven77 Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 If any God were ever proven to be beyond a shadow of a doubt, 100% legit and for real, it would likely not be the Christian God. If it were by chance the Christian God, he/it would likely be killed by the masses of humanity. The whole being God gambit didn't work out too well for Jesus, did it? If the god in question were of the non-Christian sort, it would likely be labeled as a demon and denounced by Christianity and Catholicism worldwide as the Antichrist. We would be "living in end times" and Kirk Cameron would have a career starring in cheesy Christian propaganda films again....(oh wait, that is what his career amounts to anyway ) The God-is-real-and-among-us scenario defies basic logic and cannot and will not ever happen as far as I am concerned. Here's why: A God that is all powerful and all knowing would not desire a relationship with humanity. Such a desire would be contrary to its all knowingness. Surely if it knew everything, it would be aware of the ultimate weakness of mankind: love. Love makes even most intelligent, wealthy and powerful act like idiots. Relationships with an all powerful and all knowing being would likely amount to little more than a humans-as-pets-held-at-arm's-length scenario for such a God. Hardly a caring God who is going to bring peace. Even Jesus says that he didn't come to bring peace, but a sword. [Matt. 10:34, ESV] War and crime are two conditions that have been with humanity for a long time. In my opinion, they go hand in hand with the concept of property and the advent of agriculture. This transition is covered in Genesis, with the tale of the garden as a parable of the consequences of humanity's adoption of agriculture as a way of life and the tales of patriarchs each illustrating the subsequent effects of the decisions to own land, acquire wealth, build institutions to manage their wealth and land, etc. Throughout the Bible, you see this theme, culminating in the old NT where Jesus wants to abolish the unfair Roman system, then his right-hand man Paul spends a good deal of time convincing people that the empire is a necessary evil, and then Revelations basically talks about what life will be like once the empire falls and Jesus comes back, etc. I don't think that the western mindset can truly wrap its mind around building societies that focus on the common good. Any mindset/culture that is focused around the acquisition of power and wealth as a meritocracy cannot understand easily rid its self of those things. People earn things; we get what we deserve. A loving God wouldn't allow such things if he/it cared about everyone and loved us all. That's why Heaven is so appealing. In Heaven, the rich and the poor sit side by side and blah blah insert Sunday School tale here. If we lived in a paradise controlled by God, we would have nothing to look forward to. Super Heaven, maybe. Then what? Why go to church and pay some guy to tell you about God's love and how to overcome your sin when God is right there? If there were no adversity in this life because God removed it all, we'd have nothing to overcome, nothing to achieve, no reason to do anything beside sit around and bliss out with God. In short, much of religion is based around the idealism of living as God intended...which as it turns out, is how a certain group of men intend for you to live. There is no God, only men who are gifted at twisting words and spinning yarns to obtain power and wealth. That's why the world appears to be in the toilet at times. That's also why we can say that the Christian God is a detached despotic figment of the imagination of ancient man.
Fweethawt Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 If you imagine a world where the Christian god was real, all powerful and all knowing. Where that god loves everyone and wants to have a personal relationship with everyone, what would that world look like? It would look just like the Earth does now since, after all, billions of people "imagine" this very scenario, daily.
Lucy Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 If you imagine a world where the Christian god was real, all powerful and all knowing. Where that god loves everyone and wants to have a personal relationship with everyone, what would that world look like? If it were actually real, and god made himself be known to all so there was no doubts. I imagine a world of people being much more strict in their adherence to god's commandments. I never understood why so many believers will easily break some of the 10 commandments without so much as a pause or a worry about it. I think there would be less crime but less individuality too. Just a bunch of people afraid to step out of line. But then in the Bible, the people who had directly seen miracles and had direct interaction with god would still disobey him so who knows. I'm not sure about which version of Bible god this would be. The idea generally accepted by the Christians? Or the version that Bible tends to portray? If OT god were real he only really liked his chosen tribe. Anyone not in his chosen group would be subservient to them. If you're not subservient to the chosen group them he'll help them kill you to claim your land.
themonkeyman Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 You also forget that Heaven without crime anger would not be true life. Think about it people want to GOTO heaven to continue living, but their opinion is based on this world e.g them being themselves. In heaven how can we be unique when we all experience the same uforia all the same way. E.g if heaven takes away our emotions we also loose our personality
Guest Furball Posted January 7, 2015 Posted January 7, 2015 You also forget that Heaven without crime anger would not be true life. Think about it people want to GOTO heaven to continue living, but their opinion is based on this world e.g them being themselves. In heaven how can we be unique when we all experience the same uforia all the same way. E.g if heaven takes away our emotions we also loose our personality You make a great point, one which i have pondered. I think heaven sounds like a bunch of robots performing the same tasks and worship services for an eternity. An eternal church service????----Boring
themonkeyman Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Its essentially perminant church but if u think one bad thing ur cast to hell
RipVanWinkle Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Yeah, I think we would have a different world if god were real and truly did forgive, love, protect and provide. It would not be the same as heaven, though. Heaven would be where people follow god and want to follow god. In other words, there could be no free will to disobey god; In other words, there could be no freedom to control god at all. Only if god controlled people's thoughts and behavior to the degree he needed could heaven be "perfect". In other words, there would be no free will to contradict or disobey god's will. I think that would still leave people with plenty of leeway for a variety of thoughts and behavior. This would leave no room for "justice". By justice, I mean punishment. "Free will", to the extent we now have it, can only work with a fair authority which has control over people's actions. If that control is exercised by god before the action by a human, there still would not be a need for a justice system. But if the action occurs first, there would have to be a justice system. But it would work much better than our current system. Even these two ways of god having control over people would not be real "freedom". Freedom requires the ability to make mistakes and sometimes getting caught and then punished for it. So do we want real freedom or not? Rip
mwc Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 So how often is the collection plate passed in heaven? mwc
Guest Furball Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Its essentially perminant church but if u think one bad thing ur cast to hell Yeah i a have wondered about that. What happens when your in heaven and you have a single bad thought. Will jesus save you even after you are supposedly saved?
Guest Furball Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 So how often is the collection plate passed in heaven? mwc Nah, they throw the paper money at jesus feet, and stuff the coins into fishes mouths. -yipee
Lucy Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Its essentially perminant church but if u think one bad thing ur cast to hell Yeah i a have wondered about that. What happens when your in heaven and you have a single bad thought. Will jesus save you even after you are supposedly saved? I think bad thoughts cannot occur once you are in heaven. The fact that bad thoughts occur is because sin exists in the world. Once sin is removed, no bad thoughts will spontaneously generate in the mind.
Guest Furball Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 You get a new body the bible says but not a new mind.
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