hereticzero Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 http://www.examiner.com/article/newly-discovered-ancient-christian-magical-spell-reveals-egyptian-influence I posted this story as an example of how much other customs influence the Christian religion. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ Fuego ♦ Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 Medieval believers were very much believers in magic charms and symbols. They'd bury a branch of Devil's Shoelace near the front door to trip up the devil. They'd bury a jar with nails representing the suffering of Christ, iron was also thought to be the devil's enemy (again probably due to the crucifixion), three nails would be driven into the doorframe or lintel sometimes in a triangle shape (trinity) and with three blows of the hammer each. Gargoyles were placed on cathedrals to scare off demons. Tons of info on this subject. Believers today are still often convinced they have to do anti-witchcraft if they sense it about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 From the link: "Dr. Roberta Mazza believes the Greek charm, originally unearthed in Egypt, was part of an amulet..." It's speculation, not a fact being presented. Either way, I don't have any problem with customs/aspects of other cultures being incorporated into the Christian faith as practiced by different people. It's the main message that is important. Not a trinket or a dance. One good illustration is how the Irish took the Gospel and went off on their own with it instead of looking to the Pope on how to best practice their faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 It's speculation, not a fact being presented. Tell us again how much you accept the Bible as da Truth. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Good link HereticZero, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 From the link: "Dr. Roberta Mazza believes the Greek charm, originally unearthed in Egypt, was part of an amulet..." It's speculation, not a fact being presented. Either way, I don't have any problem with customs/aspects of other cultures being incorporated into the Christian faith as practiced by different people. It's the main message that is important. Not a trinket or a dance. One good illustration is how the Irish took the Gospel and went off on their own with it instead of looking to the Pope on how to best practice their faith. Um, Ironhorse? Have you considered that "the main message" that you speak of is also borrowed from earlier religions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Borrowed??? Please inform me of another story of a God who came to earth as a human and lived among us. Tell me how this god taught us simple truths about how to live and relate to others. Who did not burden us with a long list of rituals and rules. Please continue the story how a god died and took upon himself every suffering and evil that has ever been committed. Tell me the other story how this god came back from the dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeThinkerNZ Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 *Facepalms* IH's faux sanctimony is kinda amusing. Borrowed??? Please inform me of another story of a God who came to earth as a human and lived among us. Please provide independent evidence that the biblical character jesus was "god". Tell me how this god taught us simple truths about how to live and relate to others. Any objective reader of the NT can see that the message/doctrines written about are anything but "simple". Who did not burden us with a long list of rituals and rules. The xian conveniently ignores the verse in the gospels where the character jesus says the OT "law" is still in force. Also, if the OT is to be believed, the people of that time sure were burdened with a long list of rituals and rules. Please continue the story how a god died and took upon himself every suffering and evil that has ever been committed. Please provide independent evidence that the biblical character jesus was "god" and explain how he "took upon himself every suffering and evil that has ever been committed". Tell me the other story how this god came back from the dead. Please provide independent evidence that the biblical character jesus was "god" and that he came back from the dead. Kthxbai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Borrowed??? Please inform me of another story of a God who came to earth as a human and lived among us. Tell me how this god taught us simple truths about how to live and relate to others. Who did not burden us with a long list of rituals and rules. Please continue the story how a god died and took upon himself every suffering and evil that has ever been committed. Tell me the other story how this god came back from the dead. We have been over this many times. Every time you ignore it or slink away simply to pretend you didn't see it. Another God who came to Earth and lived among us? Only every guru who ever set up shop in India. http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/lead/indias-godman-syndrome/article6633497.ece And no, they are not copycatting Jesus. The Jesus story is the copycat. Try Drona for an old one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drona How about Horus? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus By the way Jesus completing the law does not get your God out of trouble. You still have to account for why God created those long lists of rituals and rules in the first place. The Old Testament law was barbaric. It could not have been created by a loving God. And during the Old Testament time this God of your subjected thousands of people to a barbaric law. That was unnecessary. The only explanation that makes sense is that God is imaginary. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenstar Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Oh crikey… not this again. MANY parts of the Bible are complete rip-offs of other religions and cultures. From Genesis to the Flood, Moses' birth to the 10 Commandments, dying/resurrected god, etc..etc..etc.. it goes on and on and on. Most of the concepts in the NT are pagan (i.e.: Greek) Not Hebrew at all. Ever heard of Dionysus? Mithra? Osiris? El.. you know El.. the supreme God in the early part of the OT, was the Canaanite creator… not Yahweh - he doesn't show up until later… probably when the Hebrews split from their Canaaniite roots. There are lots of threads here with PAGES of the stuff we have posted on this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Tell me the other story how this god came back from the dead. Obiwan Konobi from Star Wars Harry Potter Optimus Prime Gandalf from Lord of the Rings Jack Frost Conan the Barbarian Almost every main character on Star Trek It's an over used plot device. Hello? The Bible is literature. It's a myth. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comic_book_death "the apparent death and subsequent return of a long-running character is often called a comic-book death. While death is a serious subject, a comic-book death is generally not taken seriously and is rarely permanent or meaningful" The death of Jesus for a few days before he decided to come back to life could not have been meaningful. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 From the link: "Dr. Roberta Mazza believes the Greek charm, originally unearthed in Egypt, was part of an amulet..." It's speculation, not a fact being presented. Either way, I don't have any problem with customs/aspects of other cultures being incorporated into the Christian faith as practiced by different people. It's the main message that is important. Not a trinket or a dance. One good illustration is how the Irish took the Gospel and went off on their own with it instead of looking to the Pope on how to best practice their faith. Ironhorse, I note that you missed a thread where an invitation has been extended to you. Here is the link... http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/67094-an-invitation-to-any-christians-to-learn-about-cosmology/#.VPlZi_msUuk Please join us to further your understanding of cosmology. Thanks. BAA. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 BAA, Thank you for your invitation. I do respect your knowledge of the subject. I doubt that I could contribute in any meaningful way to such detailed discussions. I will, however, be reading the thread. I am thankful for what science has discovered concerning the cosmos. My two main questions on the cosmos concern the origin of the universe and the origin of life. Two questions I do not believe science has answered but my faith has for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I am thankful for what science has discovered concerning the cosmos. My two main questions on the cosmos concern the origin of the universe and the origin of life. Two questions I do not believe science has answered but my faith has for me. Does your faith tell you why God waited forever and ever and ever before God started creating? Think about it. God is eternal. So there were a number of years without limit that God sat around with nobody to talk to and nothing to do yet God still didn't create anything. All those years that Christians are going to spend in heaven singing hyms . . . well there was an eternity that was just as long where God didn't make anything. God got along just fine by himself. He didn't need anyone. He simply waited forever and ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeThinkerNZ Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 BAA, Thank you for your invitation. I do respect your knowledge of the subject. I doubt that I could contribute in any meaningful way to such detailed discussions. I will, however, be reading the thread. I am thankful for what science has discovered concerning the cosmos. My two main questions on the cosmos concern the origin of the universe and the origin of life. Two questions I do not believe science has answered but my faith has for me. Faith can't answer anything. It's simply wishful thinking and imagination. If you want actual answers about life, the universe, and everything, science provides the only reliable method for asking questions and finding the answers that can currently be found. But we have told you this already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 mymistake, My reply to your questions: -Genesis 1 says that God created the heavens and the earth. It does not say when. -God is a Trinity: Father, Son, Spirit. "Let Us..." create man in our image." God has never been alone. -Heaven is just singing hymns all through eternity? Not the view I get from reading the scriptures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 mymistake, My reply to your questions: -Genesis 1 says that God created the heavens and the earth. It does not say when. -God is a Trinity: Father, Son, Spirit. "Let Us..." create man in our image." God has never been alone. -Heaven is just singing hymns all through eternity? Not the view I get from reading the scriptures. We get that you don't think outside of the Bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 God has never been alone, Ironhorse? If the Father, The Son, and the Holy Ghost are all one, then he was still alone. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 mymistake, When it comes to my faith in God, I do not think outside the Bible. duderonomy, How can God be alone? There are three persons within God. I know it's a contradiction. I can't explain it other than using the analogy of water, ice, and steam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 mymistake, When it comes to my faith in God, I do not think outside the Bible. So we are in agreement. The trouble is that a book cannot think for you. So you have chosen to not think and nothing will do the thinking for you. Sucks to be you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 mymistake, When it comes to my faith in God, I do not think outside the Bible. duderonomy, How can God be alone? There are three persons within God. I know it's a contradiction. I can't explain it other than using the analogy of water, ice, and steam. Water, ice and steam are all the same thing, Ironhorse. H20 all by itself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 That still doesn't solve the problem. If God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit are giving each other hand jobs for all eternity it doesn't explain why one day they decided to create angels. Then one day for some unknown reason God decided to make Earth. It's so random. God existed for infinity before creating anything at all. I don't think Ironhorse can understand the concept. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Exactly! Can you clarify? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Exactly! Do you realize you have commited heresy? Modalism is heresy. Good thing Christians don't burn heretics to death anymore. Your analogy would have caused you great suffering back when Christians ruled the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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