jrmarlin Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 Now, granted, I have only been coming here a few days; however, I have been wondering why Xians come here. As I was walking my mutt, I realized that perhaps they really come here -- not to witness -- but because they have hidden fears that their religion is not so hot. Think about it, you seldom see them actually carry on any intellectual debates; therefore, it can't be to give their faith or their mind exercise. They seldom have much to say that is contributory in any way shape or form to enlighten us non-christians or inspire us to convert or deconvert.... They only come on here and read -- occasionally adding a quip or two that makes absolutely no sense. We are harsh on them... brutal... yet they still come back. Like that icon with the little smiley hitting the brick wall.... So why do they come here? Really...... I truly believe they come here because they, too, doubt the validity of their own belief system -- and perhaps in some way, we get them thinking. You can't deny a lot of what we say makes perfect logical sense....and the inconsistencies on their behalf are staggering.... So perhaps we are deconverting people and we don't even know it! Just a thought. Let me know how you think about it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 I think some may be drawn to this site because they themselves have doubts, but from what I've seen, some do sincerely come here because they care about our souls or hate to see Christianity blasphemed. I don't think some of them can tell that they don't think for themselves, you know? It's something only we can see because we've been there. Then there's TAP, Amanda, and Open_minded, who come here really for no reason at all that I can tell. They come here just to shoot the breeze or learn about a kind of Christianity that they never experienced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friendly neighborhood atheist Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 There is some truth in what you say, I'm sure of it. Each of us who were once believers were at some point in transition, whether we shared that fact with anyone else or not. So yes, some of the christians who lurk here are just people like you and me, who may be here because they have the courage to actually read the dissent and our stated and reasoned objections surrounding the religion they belong to. SOME of them. But there are many believers out there whose entire identity is wrapped up in being a christian (or muslim, or jew, or devout follower of name-your-religion). People like that are polorized, they can't relate to anything but their own views. They may say the same of a hardened atheist, like myself. But there are loads of people in my life who I dearly love and respect, including my own parents, who are faithful christians. (However you define that). It's when hate comes in, from either side, where the trouble can start. I have to be careful saying that, because I'm human with emotions, and I've often said how much I hate fundamentalist christians. Doesn't mean I'm looking ot end anyone's life, or that I'd swerve my car onto the sidewalk to kill a priest or nun. (Pat Robertson, on the other hand...road pizza.) It's hyperbole for I can't stand those people, or tolerate their presence when they pontificate, or their influence on human culture. My being an atheist does NOT however mean that everyone I interact with has to be just like me. (Boy would that be boring). I am not directed to change everyone's minds for them. Christians, however think there is, and it's a voice telling them to convert and save us poor heathens. The ones that really believe in god/s and then proceed to decide that god's will, and then treat their fellow man accordingly are the problem. If a god's best effort to save my supposed eternal soul is sending wave after wave of annoying, prostlytizing humans at me, or various incarnations of the bible (all of which contain gross contradictions and illogic), I have to say it's a piss poor job. He either doesn't really care, is totally incompetent, lazy, or not there. In any case, not exactly the personality type I'd want to spend 5 minutes with, let alone eternity. The whole "Do as I say OR ELSE" approach doesn't fly with me. And I haven't seen many christians inspiring love outside their flock. Love is love, and god belief is not a requirement. When our visiting (or resident?) christians realize all this, they're one step closer to freethought, whether they want to move in that direction or not. Peace, Greg FNA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted February 27, 2006 Author Share Posted February 27, 2006 To Pandora & Friendly Neighborhood Atheist.... Thank you for your insightful and thoughtful answers. That's great! I completely agree with you both. I don't hate Xians, if anything I pity them because their shortage of original thought is staggering to me. I was talking with my mother this evening regarding the da vinci code and she said my cousins (who are staunch southern baptists) were upset when she read it because their minister had said it was a bad book. They had not even bothered to investigate this on their own, mind you, they just bought what their minister said and then damned everyone who had read it. I found this truly amazing. How can someone be so closed off from the world that happens so vividly around them? It makes no sense. Neither does the whole premise of Xianity. I am just amazed at the ignorance and denial these folks have for the life that happens around them. It's almost like they have tumbled down the rabbit hole and never found their way out of it. And they believe that we are in the "darkness." Just truly amazing indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanInPA Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 Now, granted, I have only been coming here a few days; however, I have been wondering why Xians come here. ...............(Snipped) I was just thinking about this yesterday. I considered hounding christians (or at least the preachy ones) right from the get-go, WHY EXACTLY ARE YOU HERE?? If it's to "win us back to KRYASST", I could quote Hebrews 6: 4It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. *sigh* but this has been done many times by our members, and doesn't seem to stop the fundies. So to answer your question, I have no idea why they come here I know I wouldn't have when I was a believer. ....How can someone be so closed off from the world that happens so vividly around them? It makes no sense. Neither does the whole premise of Xianity. I am just amazed at the ignorance and denial these folks have for the life that happens around them. It's almost like they have tumbled down the rabbit hole and never found their way out of it. And they believe that we are in the "darkness Exactly my feelings, jrmarlin! Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knowmad Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 We may find that some come here to try to understand the psychology for our deconversion for reasons that only they know. Some may come here to gain a better understanding of us in order to be more in tune with our mode of thinking so they can reach us on an equal wavelength. Some may do the same just to see how the satan has manipulated us into deception. Some, as it has been said, do this to see how we acheived deconversion because they have doubts themselves but have either no idea how to deal with it or are fearful of the whole thing. For me, when a xian posts scripture it just shows how much they have lost (or do not trust) their own identity and are unable to rationally think for themselves. I remember a few weeks ago I was having a discussion with some Jovies about god's extreme punishment he dished out to adam and eve and I compared that to a human father's response to his child's mistake. I asked them would a human father inflict such a terrible punishment on a child just because the child made a mistake, given that the child had no deep experience of life? All they could do was say,"well the bible says" and I would stop them before they even recited the scripture and repeatedly confronted them with, "No stop, what do YOU think ?" They couldn't do it and all they could say was, " that's irrelivant, the bible says" blah bah blah. Xians regard the bible as the instruction book of life yet they fail to check to see if the instuctions are valid. All they see is that their instructive concepts are wrong and they must change them to match the instructions contained within the bible. Everytime they come across an instruction that doesn't make sense they convince themselves that the error is in their original instructive thought and not the bible's. So goes the slippery slide into losing one's ability to rationally think and transform from a thinking individual into a robotic entity serving and maintaining the vast machine of religion. The same sort of thing happens in large corporations and government institutions or any other large group scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ro-bear Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 I truly believe they come here because they, too, doubt the validity of their own belief system -- and perhaps in some way, we get them thinking. Don't be too sure; I think a lot of Christians believe this of atheists who visit their sites. In my case, I can assure you it is not so. I have been an unwavering atheist for over thirty years. I go to Christian sites because I'm curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Heh, I'm not as generous as some posters here, as to my opinion about why most Xians come here. There are a few resident Xians here who showed up and stayed; it seems to me that every single one of them brought with them a sense of humility and mutual respect, and did not come here to preach but to understand, and perhaps to make friends. (Y'all know who you are, and y'all have my respect. ) But I think the preachy, buybull-thumping, fundie-mentalist, post-and-run types who come here are only doing so to somehow satisfy some deep, narcissistic need to make themselves feel superior. Witness the general lack of actually reading testimonials (or the selective information uptake when reading them), the general lack of actually listening to and understanding what folks here have to say about their own experiences, and the overall disconnection from their audience. I don't think most fundie-mentalists are really that interested in knowing anything other than what's the best way to convert people. It's sheer arrogance, nothing more. No, I'm not cynical - me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Open_Minded Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Now, granted, I have only been coming here a few days; however, I have been wondering why Xians come here. As I was walking my mutt, I realized that perhaps they really come here -- not to witness -- but because they have hidden fears that their religion is not so hot. Think about it, you seldom see them actually carry on any intellectual debates; therefore, it can't be to give their faith or their mind exercise. They seldom have much to say that is contributory in any way shape or form to enlighten us non-christians or inspire us to convert or deconvert.... They only come on here and read -- occasionally adding a quip or two that makes absolutely no sense. We are harsh on them... brutal... yet they still come back. Like that icon with the little smiley hitting the brick wall.... So why do they come here? Really...... I truly believe they come here because they, too, doubt the validity of their own belief system -- and perhaps in some way, we get them thinking. You can't deny a lot of what we say makes perfect logical sense....and the inconsistencies on their behalf are staggering.... So perhaps we are deconverting people and we don't even know it! Just a thought. Let me know how you think about it! Hello jrmarlin ... been watching this thread for a few days. Finally decided to jump in. My reason for being here? Check out the following thread.... http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?s=&s...ndpost&p=119200 I've learned a lot in my time here. Didn't think I'd stay long, just long enough to get some advice and leave. But ... well in addition to the reason above ... I also lead a Christian meditative/interspiritual group. I've been interested in interspiritual dialog for a very long time. I've been interested in education and peace-building as far as these issues go. And ... well, the long and short of it is ... that after awhile I found myself coming back for the second reason as well as the first. As far as interspiritual discussion - this place rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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