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knightcore

Hard Discussion with Parents About Coming Out

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Hey again everyone, I know it's been a year and most of y'all probably don't remember me. A lot has happened! Some of it good some of it bad, but I finally came out to my parents and the general public last month. I've received a lot of unexpected support, but unfortunately that was not from my parents. They want to talk on Friday (Good Friday... coincidentally) and I'm kind of winding myself up too much about it. I've listened to all of the recordings that their pastor has done on homosexuality and I still remember most of my readings, but I honestly can use any ammo to defend myself against my dad. Have any of you read anything that might help me put up a better case for myself? The biggest thing was that most of my coming out was about me being transgender and there's not really anything biblically that denounces that (that I know of) but I'm sure my dad will think of something.

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I cannot speak much on it, not being gay or transgender myself, but I'm sure that even if they avoid the burning in hell part of it, they'll say that if God "made" you one way, you shouldn't be turning away from that. That you should "remain who he created you as." But I'm sure you're already prepared for that.

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Actually, there is a verse that they could whip out:

 

Deuteronomy 22:5

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.

 

Ironically, though, that was likely written by a man wearing a robe, which resembles a dress, which would be considered a woman's garment in our society.

 

At any rate, although I am a straight cisgender man, I have a transgender (FTM) child and am aware of some of the agony that they can go through. In fact, before coming out to us, he had been to a point of nearly committing suicide and then went through an anorexia phase. Thankfully things are much better for him now that he knows he's free to be himself at home (it took a while for my still religious wife to warm up to the idea, but she's not really a Bible-thumper and she did eventually come around).

 

As far as giving you ammo to help defend against your dad, that may be difficult if you try to do it within the framework of Christianity. Most religious people can't wrap their heads around the idea that some people happen to be born with the wrong body for who they are, and there's nothing in the Bible to use to argue for support of transgenders.

 

If your parents take the common "God doesn't make mistakes" avenue, then I guess one response could be to ask what they think of hermaphrodites (which would appear to be "mistakes" in the rigid view of most religious people). That's not a Biblical route, but it's a documented physical reality that isn't so easy for them to write off, and it demonstrates that there are legitimate holes in the rigid simplicity of gender roles in the Bible.

 

Whatever happens, I wish you the best! Take care....

 

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14 hours ago, Citsonga said:

Ironically, though, that was likely written by a man wearing a robe, which resembles a dress, which would be considered a woman's garment in our society.

Thanx for the morning chuckle, Citsonga!

 

I'm sorry your son had to go through such difficulty. My fams are so against anyone who does not look and act like them that I want to cringe. Mrs. MOHO even asked me if I was gay because I chide my family memvers when they spew their hate against those whom they do not know personally. BTW: What is a CISgender person?

 

Knightcore: Be comfortable with who you are and know that there are multitudes who support you. A bit of advise, and feel free to take it or tell me to go pound sand. You can proclaim your non-theist beliefs, and I encourage this, but you may have to abide by house rules while you live there - even if that means Sunday School. <_<

 

    - MOHO (Mind Of His Own)

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8 minutes ago, nutrichuckles93 said:

Cisgender is someone whose gender identity is the same as the one they were assigned at birth.

 

I KNEW that! :P

 

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Speaking of "cisgender," the first time I heard that word it was a bit confusing because it sounds like "sis-gender." ;) 

 

Perhaps a better term should be coined.

 

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4 minutes ago, Citsonga said:

Speaking of "cisgender," the first time I heard that word it was a bit confusing because it sounds like "sis-gender." ;) 

 

Perhaps a better term should be coined.

 

I found this on Time.com just now. The article was written by Katy Steinmetz and was posted on December 22, 2014.

http://time.com/3636430/cisgender-definition/

 

The prefix cis- is Latin meaning "on this side of," whereas trans- means "on the other side of." While trans-atlantic means "on the opposite side of the Atlantic Ocean," an American could describe New York or Virginia or the Rocky Mountains as cis-atlantic. In general, there aren't too many places outside of a dictionary or chemistry lab where one would likely see the prefix being used, but cisgender is seeing an uptick in use.

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Knightcore, how are you doing now? I assume you've been thinking more about how you hope to approach the issue on Friday, right?

 

I did think of one more thing. If he does go the "God doesn't make mistakes" route, then perhaps you could point out that the logical conclusion would then be that it wasn't a mistake for God to give you the mind of a boy/man. (I'm guessing that you probably don't also want to challenge the idea of "God" in this meeting, right?)

 

At any rate, good luck. Here's hoping for an actual good Friday for you!

 

 

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Good points, Burnedout. There were clues in the OP that gave me the impression that he's out of the house, but it's possible that my impression may have been wrong, in which case it would be a different game altogether. 

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Hey everyone, sorry for the radio silence. I have been slammed with work and school and my OCD has been kicking my ass because of all the stress. 

 

For those asking I have moved out, that's one of the reasons I feel safe enough to do this. I'm 23 and I've been living with friends for about two years now (another topic of dissent with my parents, because my roommates are a lesbian and her single brother. So obviously this is a den of sin and lust right???), and I'm about two hours away from my parents right now. So there's a little distance and enough to avoid them if things go wrong.

 

@Citsonga I actually hadn't heard that verse yet, I'll definitely keep it in mind. They've been conferring with their pastor and I'm sure he's found this verse for them to help "change my mind". Also, really encouraging and heartwarming to hear about your son. I'm glad that he's doing better and that he has a supportive environment to figure himself out in! ALSO also, regarding your question to me, that was actually the path I think I'm going to take. I've found it easiest to explain to religious people (and harder for them to refute) when I explain that God made me this way and that part of my path is figuring out who he designed me to be. Obviously this is... bullshit. I am who I am. But if I put it in terms of "God makes no mistakes" it's harder for people to refute without digging a hole for themselves.

 

@MOHO It's pretty touchy to talk about that with my parents unfortunately! They are very very against me leaving the church still. But I will stand my ground if they try to come for me on that subject.

 

@Burnedout Believe me I already am ahaha. My dad refuses to continue a discussion with me if I get emotional, so after presenting my arguments I tend to just nod and nod and nod while he talks and talks and talks. Not really much you can do there, it's a good tactic.

 

Ultimately, I don't know how Friday will go. I can't really control that and it drives me absolutely insane. But I hope that maybe I can at least start to get through to them. I have a plan for afterwards (lunch with my roommate, try to get my mind off of it), and for Saturday (hanging out with another trans friend who I haven't seen in a while). So my community is pretty solidly behind me and I won't have to spend time alone mulling over everything and crying. I'm really thankful for all of your advice and support, you guys have really always been there for me when I need it. I'll update you all after the meeting to maybe provide some insight on how to navigate LGBT topics with Christians or just to say it's a lost cause. 

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So, knightcore, did you and your dad have the conversation? If so, then how did it go?

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Sorry for the pause. I was processing everything and I've been really scattered the past couple of days.

 

I met with my parents at a local coffee shop I know they like, and I was kind of thrown off from the start of the meeting because my mom at least and my dad more than usual were being really warm and we just talked about life at first. I forgot my parents... do this thing. Where they lull you into a false sense of security. I was so glad they weren't condemning me right off the bat and were asking thoughtful questions that I didn't think about it. They listened to me talk about my whole side of it and how I came to the realization and all that jazz. I felt like it was going good and that they were actually being kind of accepting or at least trying. And then they started talking about their side of things after I asked them if they would ever be able to fully accept me fully. 

 

Short answer is no not in the foreseeable future. My dad especially is really good at talking and making you feel like you're being the unreasonable one, and that everything he and my mom are saying makes perfect sense and it wasn't until I left the meeting and even until was at school almost twelve hours later that I realized what they were actually saying and that I had the right to be upset about it. I didn't expect them to accept me so this wasn't that hard a blow this time around. But they don't want me coming home right now because it would be tense (I agree on this point), but also because they don't want to tell me youngest brother about me. He's autistic and very delayed learning-wise, and they don't think he has the handles to grasp the situation. What I don't understand is how he's ever supposed to be able to handle things if they don't talk to him about it. I really don't understand. The worst thing is that my dad dropped on me that today (Easter Sunday) my youngest brother was being baptized and I was not allowed to come. I had no idea this was an upcoming thing. Even though it's not as important to me, I know it is to him. For me not to be there... that's going to affect him. It broke my heart and despite them telling me they're not ashamed of me multiple times I can't help but feel like it is a motivator still. 

 

I don't even remember the bulk of the conversation, honestly. Also a situation normal. They want to keep talking, didn't try to reconvert me yet despite throwing some verses about faith at me, my dad wants to have a part in my life again after eight years of ignoring me basically. He made some more promises I doubt he will follow through on about helping me with some shelves he promised me two years ago. They're going to visit me even though I'm not allowed home, which is the opposite of after I moved out. My siblings are allowed to talk to me but not visit until they "have a handle on the situation". Despite the fact that my sister has no problems with it and has known for two and a half years.

 

Anyways. I'll say what I've said to everyone who has asked me. Better than expected, worse than I wanted. They think I'm just pulling a prodigals son (my dad even used that as an analogy). I think it's really hard for me to believe he cares still, honestly. So Friday was shit. Today is shit but I'm trying to occupy myself and not think about my brother's disappointment. Alternating between listening to Edith Piaf and some pop station on spotify. 

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Thanks for the update. I'm sorry that you have to deal with that. I'm sure it's difficult for them, too, because this is not an easy issue and most people simply don't understand it.

 

Hopefully in time they'll warm up to the new you. It took my wife a while with our transgender child, but she finally came around, so there's hope for your parents as well.

 

Good luck as you move forward in your life.

 

 

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Knightcore, I'm sorry for what you have to go through. Being different is tough stuff. I have a gay son. I watched what he had to go through. But I sense that you are really strong. Hold your head up high my dear. I look at the Genesis verse in which I believe god made us all a little bit of male and female. Use this one on your parents.....''Genesis 1:27, which says, “So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.''This passage says that God contains both male and female, and since we are all created in God’s image, we each have male and female within us!

 

Did you ever read the letter I wrote a few years ago for the young people here on Ex-c? I wrote it to encourage the people your age. Maybe it may help to encourage you a bit. Best of everything to you my young friend. (hug)

 

 

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That's harsh! Though considering that religion and the deep fear it inspires is their likely motivation for acting that way, I suppose we should commend them for meeting you halfway. You must mean a lot to them if they're weighing their relationship with you against their relationship with God.

I can't help but notice the parental arrogance in expecting to be able to bar you from visiting their home, but still come and go in your home as they please. I hope you'll remember to set healthy boundaries with your parents if you feel like it. After all, it may take 20 or so years to raise a child, but it takes a lifetime to raise one's parents.

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