white_raven23 Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 YoYo, babe Again and again you keep asking people to give timeframes for what we consider "general" knowledge. Since the time frames we are referring to are apparantly not general knowledge to you, perhaps you could do some actual research on anthropology yourself. It's not like the info we are giving you is "secret details given only to non-christians" or anything. Pick up some books. While you are at it, get some history on China. They have some of the longest verified histories, if what you seek has to do with the timeframe of civilized living. I guess what I find tiresome is being asked to verify sources. I have a LOT of resources to choose from, and I have to balance the overall worth of selecting such references on: 1. Whether or not you will read the source in the first place. 2. The likelihood of you taking any value in the resource. If I knew anything I gave you was going to make you go "Hmm" and pick up a few books to check out on your own, I would not hesitate to give you those sources. But as you've not appeared to take much stock in evidence others here have given you, I feel no obligation to waste my keystrokes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy-tiger Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Can any one ammend to this comment? Can anyone give me specific time frames of the "ordaining" of these daily activities. Better Question, Can anyone give there opinion of the "time frame" to the "ordaining" of these daily activities. Lastly, Can anyone give me a "rough" "hypothetical" time frame of when the Books of Moses were written? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Now look... If you're asking when they were first in common use, ask that. If you want to know when they were made "holy orders" then stick with the questions you've just asked. A few questions for you, just to show how stupid and loaded yours were.. When was the use of toilets ordained? When were sewers ordained? When was wearing shoes ordained? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abiyoyo Posted May 10, 2005 Author Share Posted May 10, 2005 As far as the cooking of meat only starting at 2000bc you need to do a little learning on paleoethnoarchaeology. Do a search on google on Monte Verde and the word Charred. You will learn that people were using fire to cook in the Americas at 33000 BPE!!! Assuming that the earth is that old. Correct. This actually would be a good topic for another thread. Are the specific time frames of earlier and modern "paleoethnoarchaeology" actually 100% proven accurate? If so, how? What ending result/theory concluded this 100% proof? Is theory science or is science theory?Do we have all our time frames in the sole basis of a "humans" theory? That's borderline psychotic! Thanks, <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What about bathing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abiyoyo Posted May 10, 2005 Author Share Posted May 10, 2005 Now look... If you're asking when they were first in common use, ask that. If you want to know when they were made "holy orders" then stick with the questions you've just asked. A few questions for you, just to show how stupid and loaded yours were.. When was the use of toilets ordained? When were sewers ordained? When was wearing shoes ordained? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Stupid to a person that might not understand, and in rebutal, provoke "name calling". The questions are directly based around the teachings of the OT in the Books of Moses. I simply would like the time frames to when "society" "culture", assuming the Bible is fiction, when these "simplistic" daily processes came into play. Is that better formatted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abiyoyo Posted May 10, 2005 Author Share Posted May 10, 2005 YoYo, babe Again and again you keep asking people to give timeframes for what we consider "general" knowledge. Since the time frames we are referring to are apparantly not general knowledge to you, perhaps you could do some actual research on anthropology yourself. It's not like the info we are giving you is "secret details given only to non-christians" or anything. Pick up some books. While you are at it, get some history on China. They have some of the longest verified histories, if what you seek has to do with the timeframe of civilized living. I guess what I find tiresome is being asked to verify sources. I have a LOT of resources to choose from, and I have to balance the overall worth of selecting such references on: 1. Whether or not you will read the source in the first place. 2. The likelihood of you taking any value in the resource. If I knew anything I gave you was going to make you go "Hmm" and pick up a few books to check out on your own, I would not hesitate to give you those sources. But as you've not appeared to take much stock in evidence others here have given you, I feel no obligation to waste my keystrokes. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I apperciate your knowledge on the subject. I actually am "Questioning" the process that is involved with the "ancient" "sources". Assuming that the earth is that old. Correct. This actually would be a good topic for another thread. Are the specific time frames of earlier and modern "paleoethnoarchaeology" actually 100% proven accurate? If so, how? What ending result/theory concluded this 100% proof? Is theory science or is science theory?Do we have all our time frames in the sole basis of a "humans" theory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abiyoyo Posted May 10, 2005 Author Share Posted May 10, 2005 No, you are not allowed to slink back into the shadows when the facts are against you. For one. the first hospital was at 3000 BC!!! The Egyptians one-upped your god by 1,000 years and a lot more that sanitation. Imhotep had his version of Grey's anatomy, performed brain surgery, set bones, took out appendixes, and discovered that honey did a remarkable job of sealing out infection. Are you saying then that the Egyptians are responsilble for hospitals? Thats great, if thats what is being implied. Oh, and he also designed the pyramids in his spare time. Also great. Tell me, what was the Christian Church using when it came to be? Christian church as in the Children of Israel, or Christian church as in the Gospels, or Christian church as of today? Oh right. Leeches and bloodletting and exorcisms, oh my! You can slink now. Hmm, you said "no slinking". Merlin <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doomguarder Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 I hate to tell you this, but there is little information that comes directly from ancient peoples. This era is called prehistory for a reason. What we do have is the remnants of their civilizations. One of the great discoveries of the 1990s was the Iceman Mummy. This has been dated to about 3050 BC. He carried flint & steal (A sure sign of a fire builder) arrows, a copper axe, and many other things. This mummy is so well preserved that the tattoos are still readable. As far as evidence and proof, you can look up information on the iceman mummy with a simple web search. These remains are still being studied. The most recent information is regarding the content of his stomach and small intestines Dustmouse gave you a great search which you failed to do. Here I have done it for you and proviede the link. It is a PDF. Monte Verde Just as I will not accept the bible as a source, I doubt that any information I could provide will convince you. You also completely ignored my previous post, so this is kind of pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chefranden Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 If the "assumption" is that people read the Bible and started taking baths/showers, then Does anyone still take baths/showers? If so why?If the Bible says to do this daily, Is it wrong as a non-believer perform daily? This is not the "assumption", but suppose that it is. A. My sister's cats clean themselves frequently. Does that mean that they or their ancestors read the bible? B. Racoons frequently wash their food. Does that mean that they or their ancestors read the bible? C. If the practice of taking a bath is from the bible, why did medieval Christians consider doing so a sin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clearview Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Yo Yo: "Show me evidence of people cooking and bathing before the timeframe of the books of Moses" Ex-C'ers: (See examples 1-150, all predating that time) Yo Yo: "No, no, there were no people before the time of the books of Moses!" Ex-C'ers: and Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy-tiger Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Stupid to a person that might not understand, and in rebutal, provoke "name calling". The questions are directly based around the teachings of the OT in the Books of Moses. I simply would like the time frames to when "society" "culture", assuming the Bible is fiction, when these "simplistic" daily processes came into play. Is that better formatted? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I understood what your questions were... They were asking when those "processes" were given as holy commands. That is what "ordained" means, and that is what you question meant. Lets look at your questions... "when did they become holy commands?" is a loaded question. (and since, to you, "Holy" only applies to that which comes from your God, the only possible answer would be the one you've already given. ) "What time frame did these processes come into play?" has already been asked AND ANSWERED and is such, a stupid waste of time. Now, you've re-worded you questions to ask when these processes became used. That's fine and dandy, but it ignores the answers you've already been given. If you really meant to ask THOSE questions in the first place, then you've wasted your time, the time of those who answered you before, and mine, since the questions are different from what I replied to and it seems that you didn't intend to ask them anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atheist_thinker Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 I figured it was about time to have a debate in the "Debating with Christians" section! Questions? Does anyone here take daily baths or showers? How does this relate to anyone in their "beliefs"? At what precept of time did humans begin taking baths or showers if there is no God and the Bible is bogus? If the "assumption" is that people read the Bible and started taking baths/showers, then Does anyone still take baths/showers? If so why?If the Bible says to do this daily, Is it wrong as a non-believer perform daily? Does anyone here eat raw meat? How does this relate to anyone in their "beliefs"? At what precept of time did humans begin to "not" eat raw meats if there is no God and the bible is bogus? If the "assumption" is that people read the Bible and then started "not" to eat raw meat, then Does anyone still eat meat this way?If so why?If the Bible says to "cook" and "prepare" meat a certain way before consumption, Is it wrong as a non-believer to prepare in this way? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If I feel crusty then I'll take a shower. I eat oysters on the half shell and have had my fair share of undercooked meat. Anything else that your trying to get to has been heard before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abiyoyo Posted May 10, 2005 Author Share Posted May 10, 2005 This is not the "assumption", but suppose that it is. A. My sister's cats clean themselves frequently. Does that mean that they or their ancestors read the bible? B. Racoons frequently wash their food. Does that mean that they or their ancestors read the bible? C. If the practice of taking a bath is from the bible, why did medieval Christians consider doing so a sin? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Dunno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Are you saying then that the Egyptians are responsilble for hospitals?Thats great, if thats what is being implied. No, I am saying that the egyptians had basic sanitation down pat long before anyone dreamed up a guy on a cross. Your point is flat out false. Also great. Christian church as in the Children of Israel, or Christian church as in the Gospels, or Christian church as of today? That has to be ond of the best examples of COMPLETELY missing the point. Hmm, you said "no slinking". Merlin <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That was a subtle hint to read a history book instead of evangalizing without fact or wisdom. Merlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Neil Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Dunno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy-tiger Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Neil... I hardly think that Yoyo here is in the same league as BeL... They're both in leagues of their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Dunno. jesus christ!!! I cannot believe you, YoYo..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustmouse Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 First of all, YoYo, lose the "quotes". Writing "stuff" like "this" all the "time" makes you "look" really "stoopid". Second, learn to spell and us coherent sentence structure. After you do those things, you may find various information at: www.scienceinafrica.co.za www.news.bbc.co.uk www.mnsu.edu www.antiquityofman.com www.answers.com www.nytimes.com www.paleotours.com www.duluth.umn.edu www.beyondveg.com www.ecoafrica.com archeonet.nl www.unl.edu www.archaeology.org www.cabrillo.edu www.washingtonpost.com www.nationalgeographic.com www.civilization.ca www.anthrosource.net www.socarcsci.org www.siu.edu www.msnbc.com www.saa.org www.sciencemag.org www.pbs.org disc.server.com/Indices/29774 www.history-journals.de www.centerfirstamericans.com www.genomenewsnetwork.com www.cnn.com www.becominghuman.org www.talkorigins.com www.onelife.com www.handprint.com www.academicpress.com www.archaeologyinfo.com www.actionbioscience.org www.chineseprehistory.org www.iianthropology.org www.aaanet.org Shall I continue? How about you go to www.google.com and just type in different things, like 'use of fire', 'human origins', 'archaeology', etc. The problem being, however, that if you refuse to believe the earth is that old, and refuse to believe that these people then could have existed, well then you are just going to read with blind eyes. No matter what proof is presented to you, you will deny it because you don't want to believe it. But that is not a problem for us to find proof for you.. that is a problem that you must deal with in the context of your own psyche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white_raven23 Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Dustmouse you are truly MAH-velous! Not to mention more patient than Yoyo deserves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigToe Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Big Toe, Are you a Christian? Seriously, your "coined" a Christian by your profile. If you believe in the Bible, then you know that God created this world. That should be all I would have to tell you, I would assume. God creating this world or not has absolutely nothing to do with people bathing or not eating raw meat. It has nothing to do with why people bathe. It also has nothing to do with when the Bible was written. Genesis was written ABOUT the beginning, not AT the beginning. Otherwise, who wrote it when there still was no life on earth? Furthermore, if God created the earth or not- that doesn't mean the earth is onlu 6000 years old anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigToe Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Also, as was already pointed out, can you clarify what you mean by "book of Moses"? As that is not one of the books in the Bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Also, as was already pointed out, can you clarify what you mean by "book of Moses"? As that is not one of the books in the Bible. She said the books of moses. Isn't it believed that Moses wrote the Torah? Even though no historians think that...some people still believe it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Java Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 I BigToe. Random Screaming Fundy: HEY YOU, CHRISTIAN, BACK UP MY FAULTY AND PATHETIC ARGUMENTS!! Toesy: Uh, no. *shows off hawt avatar* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAm_Lucifer Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 After reading this thread, I think my IQ has dropped, drastically. Is it me or are Christians getting dumber and dumber when they are trying to defend their cult (I'm not referring to you Big Toe). The things they say make me think that Christians contribute in a negative way to society. Why do we bath and not eat raw meat? Are you serious? If American laws/society rules were based on the bible, it would probably mean the end of the world. You are ignoring other things the bible says. If American/society laws were based on the bible, there would be no pigs in America, because you can't eat them at all. You would not be wearing the clothes your wearing right now. Are they made by more than two fabrics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Also, as was already pointed out, can you clarify what you mean by "book of Moses"? As that is not one of the books in the Bible. The only Book of Moses I know of is Das Sech und Seben Buch Moses (The Sixth and Seventh Book of Moses) which is well known, so 'tis said, in occult circles. Casey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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