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Vigile

Why deconversion is hard on a lot of folks

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Plato's Allegory of the Cave

Here translated to watching Hollywood movies, is a good illustration of Plato's Allegory of the Cave. But you can extend the illustration to the whole context to the way, we in the West, experience reality. In Plato's original, the spectators were chained at the neck, so that they couldn't turn around to see that what they were seeing projected from behind was smoke and mirrors. They were forced to think that the shadows they saw before them were real. What would happen, Socrates asked, if a shadow-spectator were liberated and brought out into the light of the sun from the darkness of the cave and see the REAL world. The shadow-spectator would fight tooth and nail to STAY in the cave, and when out into the sun would suffer terribly from nearly going blind by the harshness of the light. By and by, it would adjust, slowly, painfully but no longer the prisoners of shadows.

You can see why people prefer the darkness to the light: seeing is painful; the truth makes one suffer.

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Interesting analogy.  But why is this limited to 'we in the West'?  Are other cultures less prone to this?  

 

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@Margee

 

(((Love and Gigantic Bear Hugs To You, Margee!)))

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@Margee

 

(((Love and Gigantic Bear Hugs To You, Margee!)))

 

Thank you Buff. Love you girl. :kiss:

 

 I can't wait to hear others stories about this analogy and how it has affected them.

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Margee, you have been such a great source of encouragement and support to all of us who came to this community.  It breaks my heart to hear about the anguish you have gone through.  I hope it gets better.  

 

Great big hug from south of the border...

 

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Interesting analogy.  But why is this limited to 'we in the West'?  Are other cultures less prone to this?  

 

 

Most definitely. 

 

But probably prone isn't the correct way to frame this. Other countries just don't have the same media empire owned by a tiny handful of self-interested corps or the CIA working behind the scenes (Obama made propaganda against the public legal and we know that the CIA has employed agents to work in places like CNN).

 

But this isn't my point in posting here. I thought it was a good analogy for people who decovert. Many here talk about how they wish they could go back -- especially newbies. This explains why I think. 

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Vigile, I cannot tell you how much this relates to something I have been going through in the past couple of years. I haven't been completely honest with Ex-c because I am so ashamed and embarrassed about 'coming back out into the sunlight' again. (I always feel that I have to be strong)  But I wore those chains around my neck for years. The church had convinced me that I needed to be saved and that I had a personal god looking after my life and safety. The whole doctrine made me feel safe and I needed to feel safe because I came from a lot of dysfunction. Let's just sum it up without any gory details and say my childhood was not a completely safe place. As I just stated on another thread...at the age of 20, I was a 'sitting duck' for the doctrine of getting 'saved'. When the pastor told me that god had a very special plan for my life, I was naively hooked.

 

 After about 5 years of being on this board and writing here every day, I found I was hiding more and more in my house and making excuses for not going out into the big world. The big world became so scary to me knowing that I did not have the protection of any god. So I needed to protect myself from my own death and the only way I could do this was by staying as close to my 'safe' house as possible. I very slowly and without realizing it, became quite agoraphobic. I won't bore the board with all the details about my recovery from this.. but let's just say that every day right now, I am forcing myself to go further and further from my home. It's very hard to understand for some people how hard it is for me to go to the local grocery store. To drive to my little summer trailer is torture for me until I get there. But I am doing it and I am proud.

 

We were financially strapped this year because my hubby was laid off for 5 months and we could not take a winter trip and I was soooo happy about this (not about him being laid off) but because it meant I  did not have to worry about going away from my house on a winter trip.  I literally became afraid of everything in the past 2 years. I couldn't even go for a walk around my neighborhood for fear of getting hit by a car or a hoodlum jumping out at me. I hope I don't regret writing this out and coming out of the closet with it. :( But I feel it's time to come clean. Deconversion and learning how to come out into 'sunlight' again has been very hard for me with my anxious personality. 

 

When I say on the board that forming a 'new world view' has been very hard, it is alllllll about those chains coming off of my neck and leaving the dark cave to go out into the light and learn how to feel safe again. When I say chritianity screwed up my life, it did in many ways that believers could never understand because they still have those 'smoke and mirror's' of the fantasy that they are protected by god.

 

Last night we had company over and my girlfriend who has a very wise husband said something to me that hit home so much. (as they completely accept me as I am and they know my struggle because they were both once born again believers) He said, ''you only have to die once but this condition has me dying my death every day because I am not truly living.''  I am trying to control how I die. I know that's what I am doing. And I just can't do it anymore. I need to live again. Really live and not be afraid. I need to go back outside and take the chance that today I won't get hit by a car, I won't get in a car accident, I won't get shot in a mall by a lunatic, etc. 

 

Taking those chains off my neck has been one of the hardest things in the world for me. But I am going to fight to my death and learn how to live again.

 

There, I'm out of the closet. I have tears in my eyes as I write this because it has been a roller-coaster ride. 7 years on this board to learn how to live again. So when people come here and write how afraid they are, I truly understand. 

 

Thank you for posting this today. The timing was perfect for me to make this admission. So today, I am going to force myself out into the sunlight. I will make this breakthrough and then try to help others who go through the same thing. I am determined.

 

 Thank you again, my friend. I think this condition (agoraphobia) describes the analogy you posted today so much. For an analogy like this to be created, it shows me that I am not alone.  Thanks to everyone of you who have helped me just by being on this board and by being honest.

 

Love to you all. :kiss:

 

You say you have been afraid, but honestly, you're one of the bravest people I know. Love ya Margie. 

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@Margee You are such a truly encouraging and wonderful person, I am so sorry you've been struggling with this so much. You've helped us all along when we've been depressed and in despair, I hope that we can do the same for you.

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Big hugs from me, Margee, friend of more than 10 years now. And tongue licks from Lita.

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@Margee I think what you have written of your fears and anxiety lies at the core of the difficulty in deconverting for most people, and those who have higher levels of anxiety like I do can very easily struggle in a lot of areas because sky father is no longer there protecting us day in and day out. The fear that death is out there and waiting in some form or other if we place ourselves in the wrong circumstance at the wrong time and place can very easily become overwhelming. I've had some of this fear myself and so I can empathize with what you have gone through. What has also helped me is the knowledge that having the blinders off is a saving grace in some way, because now I can truly place all of my faith in science, in doctors, in geneticists and others who have the true power to help and enlighten me when it's needed, and ultimately I will not naively cling to "thy will be done" anymore. Perhaps some context here helps explain this. I live with the knowledge that some day my heart and what keeps it pumping may fail. This knowledge had me frozen in fear, panic and anxiety for a good long while, but you know what? In the end, the desire to live, really live, won out. The prospect of an imminent death somewhere down the road handed me a gift as valuable as that that has come with deconversion: value every day, make it really count, live. I'm glad you have told this part of your story, you are one tough woman and you have given so much insight and love on this forum to everyone. You are clearly much tougher than your agoraphobia and you will beat it. Much love.

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Vigile, I cannot tell you how much this relates to something I have been going through in the past couple of years. I haven't been completely honest with Ex-c because I am so ashamed and embarrassed about 'coming back out into the sunlight' again. (I always feel that I have to be strong)  But I wore those chains around my neck for years. The church had convinced me that I needed to be saved and that I had a personal god looking after my life and safety. The whole doctrine made me feel safe and I needed to feel safe because I came from a lot of dysfunction. Let's just sum it up without any gory details and say my childhood was not a completely safe place. As I just stated on another thread...at the age of 20, I was a 'sitting duck' for the doctrine of getting 'saved'. When the pastor told me that god had a very special plan for my life, I was naively hooked.

 

 After about 5 years of being on this board and writing here every day, I found I was hiding more and more in my house and making excuses for not going out into the big world. The big world became so scary to me knowing that I did not have the protection of any god. So I needed to protect myself from my own death and the only way I could do this was by staying as close to my 'safe' house as possible. I very slowly and without realizing it, became quite agoraphobic. I won't bore the board with all the details about my recovery from this.. but let's just say that every day right now, I am forcing myself to go further and further from my home. It's very hard to understand for some people how hard it is for me to go to the local grocery store. To drive to my little summer trailer is torture for me until I get there. But I am doing it and I am proud.

 

We were financially strapped this year because my hubby was laid off for 5 months and we could not take a winter trip and I was soooo happy about this (not about him being laid off) but because it meant I  did not have to worry about going away from my house on a winter trip.  I literally became afraid of everything in the past 2 years. I couldn't even go for a walk around my neighborhood for fear of getting hit by a car or a hoodlum jumping out at me. I hope I don't regret writing this out and coming out of the closet with it. :( But I feel it's time to come clean. Deconversion and learning how to come out into 'sunlight' again has been very hard for me with my anxious personality. 

 

When I say on the board that forming a 'new world view' has been very hard, it is alllllll about those chains coming off of my neck and leaving the dark cave to go out into the light and learn how to feel safe again. When I say chritianity screwed up my life, it did in many ways that believers could never understand because they still have those 'smoke and mirror's' of the fantasy that they are protected by god.

 

Last night we had company over and my girlfriend who has a very wise husband said something to me that hit home so much. (as they completely accept me as I am and they know my struggle because they were both once born again believers) He said, ''you only have to die once but this condition has me dying my death every day because I am not truly living.''  I am trying to control how I die. I know that's what I am doing. And I just can't do it anymore. I need to live again. Really live and not be afraid. I need to go back outside and take the chance that today I won't get hit by a car, I won't get in a car accident, I won't get shot in a mall by a lunatic, etc. 

 

Taking those chains off my neck has been one of the hardest things in the world for me. But I am going to fight to my death and learn how to live again.

 

There, I'm out of the closet. I have tears in my eyes as I write this because it has been a roller-coaster ride. 7 years on this board to learn how to live again. So when people come here and write how afraid they are, I truly understand. 

 

Thank you for posting this today. The timing was perfect for me to make this admission. So today, I am going to force myself out into the sunlight. I will make this breakthrough and then try to help others who go through the same thing. I am determined.

 

 Thank you again, my friend. I think this condition (agoraphobia) describes the analogy you posted today so much. For an analogy like this to be created, it shows me that I am not alone.  Thanks to everyone of you who have helped me just by being on this board and by being honest.

 

Love to you all. :kiss:

Thanks for sharing this Margee, my grandmother never left her home for the last couple decades of her life and it was tragic to witness.  What you're doing is very brave.

 

I can relate so much to what you have said, I find it interesting that people (like and and me) who get converted in their early 20s often have truly messed up pasts.  I was raised in a household where no one escaped abuse, and now all four of us kids developed mental health problems in our 20s as a result.  The problem for me is that I got so much of this bullshit that happened to me deprogrammed within a Christian mental framework.  In other words, it was because of what I believed about forgiveness and the gospel it inspired me to forgive my family.  When the deprogramming of Christianity happened, it was at a major juncture in my life.  My wife had just given birth to our perfect son, and I was starting a new position with sweeping responsibilities.  Little did I know the horrors that would await me as it turned out Christianity was a sort of shield for the latent Complex PTSD I had which became triggered with this transition.  One of the symptoms you will find even indicates that it is normal that a person will lose their meaning system, which I personally associate with the distrust of the world which comes from experiencing severe trauma.  You're exactly right that you have to learn how to live again, but also why.  

 

However, I think that science has in the long run more that will help with mental health, and without all the cognitive dissonance.

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Wow. As usual, all of you are freakin' awsome! Thank you @Buff, TABA, Ficino, Vigile, knightcore, Truthseeker and TrueScottsman for the wonderful replies.

 

   I read them very carefully and am so grateful for this board and it's members cause you guys (besides the two friends last night and a couple others) are the only ones to know this. I certainly did not mean to make this post all about me - it's just that when I read this-this morning, it blew me out the door because my friends talked all about this last night and I knew I needed to write this morning. Man-oh-man, ya' never know when someone posts something, how many members can relate.

 

As I said many times, I just can't fight my christian friends about their faith. I think they are so lucky to have the hope that god is directing their every move. I once felt that very much. Mo matter what was going on, I was trying my best to trust god to show me directions for my success and fuck ups. I think the agoraphobic feelings started when I had a bad car accident that triggered me for driving. I was rear ended  and he sent my car through an intersection and my car was smashed up to the back window. I have never felt so out of control. Then I took my  MIL to live with us and I didn't get out much for those 3 years so I lost my confidence. Add shootouts and bomb scares in malls... and all the other crap that happens in cities and I developed huge anxiety, especially knowing that no god was looking after me anymore. I couldn't even go to the movies in comfort because of the shootings that have happened in theaters. This is why I try so hard not to hear all the bad news in the world. I got a huge imagination that won't let go of 'imagines'.

 

I need to recover for me. I need to get back on that airplane (when things get better financially) and go south in the winters and not sit there in terror during the whole flight without being so stoned on medication.

 

So please, anyone else who can relate to Vigile s post, I'm dying to hear how you all removed the chains from your neck and came out of the dark cave into the light again. Thank you all so much. I love you guys in such a special way.

 

P.S. I went through 3 very busy intersections today! I'll report this news to my therapist next month. :D

 

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Margee, you seem like the sweetest person on this site. Thank you for sharing. It sounds like you're on the right track and I hope it brings you some healing.

As for me and coming out of the shadows, I have just recently said goodbye to career in which being a Christian was a requirement of the job. I was living in the shadows for the longest time because I had to maintain a certain role in public and social situations. I couldn't reveal the "real me" in any sort of social or work situation because of where I taught. But now that I've given that up, Ive also made the decision to come out of the agnostic closet to anyone and everyone who asks from now on.  A new job means that I can now attend a local atheist meetup group, although I'm still really scared to do that as I'm a bit of an introvert. The only atheist friend Ive had (and lost) once told me I needed more atheist friends. So true! So I'm going to make an effort to do that. (I have to admit, this site can be a bit of an excuse for not getting out into the real world to make live in-person atheist friends). But before I settle into something new I think I need a little adventure so I'm thinking of just hitting the road to see where it takes me for a few weeks. Again, this will be a little out of my comfort zone, but I think it's needed.

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Wow. As usual, all of you are freakin' awsome! Thank you @Buff, TABA, Ficino, Vigile, knightcore, Truthseeker and TrueScottsman for the wonderful replies.

 

   I read them very carefully and am so grateful for this board and it's members cause you guys (besides the two friends last night and a couple others) are the only ones to know this. I certainly did not mean to make this post all about me - it's just that when I read this-this morning, it blew me out the door because my friends talked all about this last night and I knew I needed to write this morning. Man-oh-man, ya' never know when someone posts something, how many members can relate.

 

As I said many times, I just can't fight my christian friends about their faith. I think they are so lucky to have the hope that god is directing their every move. I once felt that very much. Mo matter what was going on, I was trying my best to trust god to show me directions for my success and fuck ups. I think the agoraphobic feelings started when I had a bad car accident that triggered me for driving. I was rear ended by a van and he sent my car flying through an intersection and my car was smashed up to the back window. I have never felt so out of control. Then I took my 90-year-old MIL to live with us and I didn't get out much for those 3 years so I lost my confidence. Add shootouts and bomb scares in malls... and all the other crap that happens in cities and I developed huge anxiety, especially knowing that no god was looking after me anymore. I couldn't even go to the movies in comfort because of the shootings that have happened in theaters. This is why I try so hard not to hear all the bad news in the world. I got a huge imagination that won't let go of 'imagines'.

 

I need to recover for me. I need to get back on that airplane (when things get better financially) and go south in the winters and not sit there in terror during the whole flight without being so stoned on medication. 

 

5

 

One thing you can always trust, is that to utterly withhold trust from life is to ensure a tragic outcome.  Life is something which requires at the end of the day to be passionately engaged with, and that I think is the existential question that every Ex-Christian faces.  In the face of such horrendous suffering lying behind some doors life has to offer, I know for me pessimism has become a close friend and ally, but will one day ultimately hold me back.  

 

Learning how to trust and have gratitude have been the most difficult and important steps for me in being an Ex-Christian.

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On 7/9/2017 at 11:18 PM, Faithfulless said:

Margee, you seem like the sweetest person on this site. Thank you for sharing. It sounds like you're on the right track and I hope it brings you some healing.

As for me and coming out of the shadows, I have just recently said goodbye to career in which being a Christian was a requirement of the job. I was living in the shadows for the longest time because I had to maintain a certain role in public and social situations. I couldn't reveal the "real me" in any sort of social or work situation because of where I taught. But now that I've given that up, Ive also made the decision to come out of the agnostic closet to anyone and everyone who asks from now on.  A new job means that I can now attend a local atheist meetup group, although I'm still really scared to do that as I'm a bit of an introvert. The only atheist friend Ive had (and lost) once told me I needed more atheist friends. So true! So I'm going to make an effort to do that. (I have to admit, this site can be a bit of an excuse for not getting out into the real world to make live in-person atheist friends). But before I settle into something new I think I need a little adventure so I'm thinking of just hitting the road to see where it takes me for a few weeks. Again, this will be a little out of my comfort zone, but I think it's needed.

 

Wow Faithfulless!! Now, this is really taking the chains off your neck hon! Good for you. You are an inspiration. I'm going to follow right behind you and get brave like you! You go girl! The very best to you on your journey!

 

P.S. I am not the sweetest person on this site hon (but thanks for that - you are equally as sweet!!) but I'm glad I come across in a kind way cause I think everyone deserves to be treated kindly. But I can tell you one more thing about me. When I get pissed off with someone, I'm done. But I give lots of chances before I get to that point. I'm a softee, but not a pushover. Most people are very surprised when they get to see that side of me. So the bitch from hell does live inside of me....Lol   :D

 

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One thing you can always trust, is that to utterly withhold trust from life is to ensure a tragic outcome.  Life is something which requires at the end of the day to be passionately engaged with, and that I think is the existential question that every Ex-Christian faces.  In the face of such horrendous suffering lying behind some doors life has to offer, I know for me pessimism has become a close friend and ally, but will one day ultimately hold me back.  

 

Learning how to trust and have gratitude have been the most difficult and important steps for me in being an Ex-Christian.

TS, I also have a pessimistic personality but I won't show that to most people. I have learned to live with it as being part of who I am. There is an upside to the pessimism that fuels me to fight back. 

 

And learning to trust and have gratitude have also been the most difficult and important steps in me being an Ex-christian so I completely understand. Thanks for sharing.

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Vigile, I cannot tell you how much this relates to something I have been going through in the past couple of years. I haven't been completely honest with Ex-c because I am so ashamed and embarrassed about 'coming back out into the sunlight' again. (I always feel that I have to be strong)  But I wore those chains around my neck for years. The church had convinced me that I needed to be saved and that I had a personal god looking after my life and safety. The whole doctrine made me feel safe and I needed to feel safe because I came from a lot of dysfunction. Let's just sum it up without any gory details and say my childhood was not a completely safe place. As I just stated on another thread...at the age of 20, I was a 'sitting duck' for the doctrine of getting 'saved'. When the pastor told me that god had a very special plan for my life, I was naively hooked.

 

 After about 5 years of being on this board and writing here every day, I found I was hiding more and more in my house and making excuses for not going out into the big world. The big world became so scary to me knowing that I did not have the protection of any god. So I needed to protect myself from my own death and the only way I could do this was by staying as close to my 'safe' house as possible. I very slowly and without realizing it, became quite agoraphobic. I won't bore the board with all the details about my recovery from this.. but let's just say that every day right now, I am forcing myself to go further and further from my home. It's very hard to understand for some people how hard it is for me to go to the local grocery store. To drive to my little summer trailer is torture for me until I get there. But I am doing it and I am proud.

 

We were financially strapped this year because my hubby was laid off for 5 months and we could not take a winter trip and I was soooo happy about this (not about him being laid off) but because it meant I  did not have to worry about going away from my house on a winter trip.  I literally became afraid of everything in the past 2 years. I couldn't even go for a walk around my neighborhood for fear of getting hit by a car or a hoodlum jumping out at me. I hope I don't regret writing this out and coming out of the closet with it. :( But I feel it's time to come clean. Deconversion and learning how to come out into 'sunlight' again has been very hard for me with my anxious personality. 

 

When I say on the board that forming a 'new world view' has been very hard, it is alllllll about those chains coming off of my neck and leaving the dark cave to go out into the light and learn how to feel safe again. When I say chritianity screwed up my life, it did in many ways that believers could never understand because they still have those 'smoke and mirror's' of the fantasy that they are protected by god.

 

Last night we had company over and my girlfriend who has a very wise husband said something to me that hit home so much. (as they completely accept me as I am and they know my struggle because they were both once born again believers) He said, ''you only have to die once but this condition has me dying my death every day because I am not truly living.''  I am trying to control how I die. I know that's what I am doing. And I just can't do it anymore. I need to live again. Really live and not be afraid. I need to go back outside and take the chance that today I won't get hit by a car, I won't get in a car accident, I won't get shot in a mall by a lunatic, etc. 

 

Taking those chains off my neck has been one of the hardest things in the world for me. But I am going to fight to my death and learn how to live again.

 

There, I'm out of the closet. I have tears in my eyes as I write this because it has been a roller-coaster ride. 7 years on this board to learn how to live again. So when people come here and write how afraid they are, I truly understand. 

 

Thank you for posting this today. The timing was perfect for me to make this admission. So today, I am going to force myself out into the sunlight. I will make this breakthrough and then try to help others who go through the same thing. I am determined.

 

 Thank you again, my friend. I think this condition (agoraphobia) describes the analogy you posted today so much. For an analogy like this to be created, it shows me that I am not alone.  Thanks to everyone of you who have helped me just by being on this board and by being honest.

 

Love to you all. :kiss:

 

(((HUGS))) <3 <3 <3 <3

 

Also, I think my only chain breaking story is my current process of deconversion. I've stepped into the light of reality....thanks to all y'all. 

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@Margee,

 

You have been an inspiration and encouragement for everyone on this site.

 

Now it's our turn to support you.

 

I went through agoraphobia in high-school. I would not even leave my room - let alone go outside. However I wanted to ride dirt-bikes SO BAAAAD that, when the opportunity presented itself, I went. It was total torment for the 1.5 hour drive to the desert but, once there and on the bike, I did not think about my plight at all. When following someone who rides really, really fast, you either concentrate on keeping the shiny side up and the rubber side down, or ELSE!

 

Good therapy, that!

 

So, good luck with your recovery and keep us posted.

NOW! For tonight's glass of "grape juice" isn't there a pub down the street?  :3:

 

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@Margee,

 

You have been an inspiration and encouragement for everyone on this site.

 

Now it's our turn to support you.

 

I went through agoraphobia in high-school. I would not even leave my room - let alone go outside. However I wanted to ride dirt-bikes SO BAAAAD that, when the opportunity presented itself, I went. It was total torment for the 1.5 hour drive to the desert but, once there and on the bike, I did not think about my plight at all. When following someone who rides really, really fast, you either concentrate on keeping the shiny side up and the rubber side down, or ELSE!

 

Good therapy, that!

 

So, good luck with your recovery and keep us posted.

NOW! For tonight's glass of "grape juice" isn't there a pub down the street?  :3:

 

@MOHO Thanks, sweetie. 

 

I did real good again today. Was driving all the side streets for a long time but again today, I did parts of the smaller highway here in the city and went through some big intersections again. I am still nervous but keep telling myself I've been driving since I have been 18 years old. Only had one accident in my life and it was the one 4 years ago. (wasn't my fault at all) So the more I force myself out the door, the more I feel like my old self again. And now I'm doing it without the protection of god!! <_< :D

 

Do you ever go through bouts of agoraphobia now? Once you conquered it, did it return? 

 

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@MOHO Thanks, sweetie. 

 

I did real good again today. Was driving all the side streets for a long time but again today, I did parts of the smaller highway here in the city and went through some big intersections again. I am still nervous but keep telling myself I've been driving since I have been 18 years old. Only had one accident in my life and it was the one 4 years ago. (wasn't my fault at all) So the more I force myself out the door, the more I feel like my old self again. And now I'm doing it without the protection of god!! <_< :D

 

Do you ever go through bouts of agoraphobia now? Once you conquered it, did it return? 

 

 

Hey @Margee,

 

Yes, I went through a VERY brief bout (less than 1 day) in college while under beau coup stress. I realized what it was right away and was able to quash it almost immediately. That was 35 years ago and I never experienced any issues ever again!

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TS, I also have a pessimistic personality but I won't show that to most people. I have learned to live with it as being part of who I am. There is an upside to the pessimism that fuels me to fight back. 

 

And learning to trust and have gratitude have also been the most difficult and important steps in me being an Ex-christian so I completely understand. Thanks for sharing.

There is a lot of interesting research about pessimism and depressive realism and its utility for humanity in evolutionary terms.  It seems bunkering down and being critical was of utility to our ancestors in certain times, but doesn't work as well with the modern market place like it may have on the savannah, but many of our greatest artists and thinkers were those who privately suffered.  Dickinson, Hemingway, Twain, Williams, and many more.  Suffering can sometimes open a window of insight that for others might remain closed, so I don't think these demons we wrestle with are without value for also giving us the tools to see through them and conquer them.

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@Margee,

      Tons of HUGS!!! You've made a huge step just by opening up about your agrophobia. I admire your bravery!

 

Dark Bishop

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Margee, I am glad you are doing better with getting out.  From time to time I have also had issues with this, as well as anxiety. 

 

I haven't been around ex-c for a few years.  I do think that writing things out on this site has helped me very much. I had a very close call on a busy highway back a couple years ago. Between that and the ordinary hurricane threat I don't do too well sometimes.

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Margee you can't possibility know how many people you have helped make it through the de-conversion process. You are an inspiration to many.  We all fear something & I think many of those fears can be linked back to our experiences with religion. So glad to hear you're  making progress fighting your demons now. And I second what everyone else has said.

 

Love ya sweetie,  

 

:kiss:

 

 

 

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