☆ TexasFreethinker ☆ Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 I'm struck by how often christians (and members of other religions) will freely lie or exagerate in order to make their religious beliefs more credible or to gain converts to the faith. From claims of miraculous events, healings, hearing the voice of god, to repeating creationism nonsense that's been disproven, there seems to be a large number of christians who think it's ok to be dishonest as long as it benefits christianity. Have you ever lied for the lord? If yes, what did you do? Extra question for christians: Is it ever ok to lie or exagerate in order to attract converts to christianity or to strengthen the faith of a weak christian? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Telling anyone they need to accept Jesus in order to escape eternal punishment is lying - but Xians don't know they're fibbing. When they do, they usually become ex-xians. The ones who knew it was all a lie from the get-go of course don't change much, even if they're exposed. As a Xian, I told all sorts of junk to people - exaggerated the "persecution myth" of Xians, made a big to-do about the fictional "blessings" of the religion, and so on and so forth. Any form of evangelism is lying, but when I was Xian, I was convinced it was the truth - which is where the problem lies. Xians think they're telling The Truth but in reality are selling one of the biggest lies of human history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celsus Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Anyone who has seriously debated issues like evolution or history with Christian debaters/apologists has run across the "Lying for the Lord" phenomena. It is instructive to note that lying to further belief is taught as an accepted tactic, specificially it is addressed by the Apostle Paul. In Romans 3:7 Paul speaks about his "lie" that increased belief. The full context is unclear, as we have no idea what lie he is talking about, but probably the people he wrote letter to did. Moreover, Paul further states that he plays different roles to ingratiate himself with different groups, in order to lead (mislead) them. This is deception. Lying and deception are tactic used by religions, just as it is used in politics. Christian Lies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I Broke Free Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 The biggest LIE I kept repeating at church…….. I am so happy to be here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosingMyReligion Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 I definitely used to lie. I would do anything to prove my case...The sad part is that I didn't even realize I was lying. I was only repeating everything that had been programmed into me, complete with cool sounding bible scriptures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurisaz Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Have you ever lied for the lord? If yes, what did you do? No. Not that I remember, that is... and considering the fact that back in my christian days I didn't feel like I'm under any kind of pressure to please da lawd, convert poor evil satanist heathens before they go to hell et cetera, I guess that's not much of a wonder, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookums Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Opps!!! I just lied on that poll! I tried to fake speaking in tongues and I pretended to enjoy shit that I didn't. I didn't stay very long in the penties group, it was the result of my siblings cohersion but she and the pastor definately kept info form me - like the whole doctrine including the shunning I was to receive later when I told them all to fook off... I'd don't want to appear to be a victim either ...that's not how I feel. I was raised SDA'ist but got out young .....as a kid I could see through the bullshit. Kids are cool like that ...I bring this up to ask about children - its seems 'abusive' to teach kids to lie or pretend which is probably the 'nicer' version of the same thing. I was too shy to ever 'witness' to anyone or spin a yarn. great topic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skankboy Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 The sad part is that I didn't even realize I was lying. I guess I'm in the same boat here. From my current perspective, I did mislead people, but since I didn't think I was at the time, I don't consider that a lie. For me, lying is providing information you KNOW to be untrue... IMOHO, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 The thing that's so pathetic about lying for the Lord, is if you have to lie to sell something, then perhaps you yourself don't think it's all that and a bag of chips to begin with. False advertising - bait and switch.... all are unethical principles of advertsing an inferior or substandard product. It's a shame so many xians think their "product" aka Jesus is so substandard. If looked at this way, it does not seem like such a bargain. Doe it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narcissist Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 I remember this one time when I was at university. I was talking to this new age hippie about my christian experience, attempting to "evangelise" him, and I told him about a coed "Christian Floor" at the university I had previously lived on. He asked if there was any sexual tension. My answer was "no". Of course, it was a lie. That's the most memorable lie I told as a christian. Then there were all the times I told people about how great my life was as a christian and how good god was and how my prayers were always answered etc. etc. Then I would go back to the privacy of my own room/house and wonder why god wasn't answering my prayers or doing anything that anyone would interperet as good or positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted March 24, 2006 Share Posted March 24, 2006 I ALMOST answered "no", but then I changed my tune. There was at least one HUGE lie I knowingly told. I said that coming to Christ would change you for the better and make things hunkie-dory. In my heart I KNEW this was a bullshit lie, because I knew that I was no different than before. I had the same passions, feelings, wants, desires, lusts, angers and hang-ups. I MAY have been better at hiding them or excusing them (begging for forgiveness), but they did not vanish with the "born again" experience. Christians typically sell the "changed life" angle big time, but then later they'll argue that "Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven". Or better still, "Christians aren't sinless, but they will sin less." What a crock of shit. Christians who promote the New Birth/Holiness are lying and they know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
☆ TexasFreethinker ☆ Posted March 24, 2006 Author Share Posted March 24, 2006 The sad part is that I didn't even realize I was lying. I guess I'm in the same boat here. From my current perspective, I did mislead people, but since I didn't think I was at the time, I don't consider that a lie. For me, lying is providing information you KNOW to be untrue... IMOHO, I agree. It's not lying if you honestly believe what you're saying, even if you're wrong. I should have made the poll question more precise - I'm curious about people who knowingly lied or exagerated for their faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philo Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Yes, in confess, I did lie as a Christian. Here's a good quote: "What harm would it do, if a man told a good strong lie for the sake of the good and for the Christian church...a lie out of necessity, a useful lie, a helpful lie, such lies would not be against God, he would accept them." - Martin Luther It's my understand that early Mormons had a policy of "lying for the lord." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 This highlights a basic problem with any belief system that places membership above ethics. In Xianity, it's membership via "faith in Jesus" that is the end-goal and main thrust of the religion, not the setting forth of a system of workable ethics for people to live by. The most ethical person in the world who isn't Xian will be tormented forever upon death, but the most wretched bastard can enjoy eternal bliss if he or she recants on the deathbed and believes in Jesus. Under a system like this, whatever is necessary to encourage "faith" is considered acceptable, be it violence, brainwashing, or lying. So long as it "gets the message across" it's all good - after all, there aren't any restriction in the Babble about how Xians are supposed to "spread the Good Noose". If inculcating a system of ethics was the main thrust, something like lying would be seen as naturally unethical and hence the fervent believer could not lie in order to inrease membership, since that would be in direct contradiction of the belief system. When I think of things like this, I see why the concept of "faith" as a spiritual necessity for mankind is so very dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 I must admit I lied, but at the time didn't knowingly lie. I believed the shit I was told, and told other people. So it's an awkward question. I didn't intentionally lie, but did so none-the-less so I voted yes. ( Holy cow do I sound like a fkn politician or what??? ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 This thread should be called, "Did I ever whore for Jesus..." Jesus Inc. The original Marketing Strategy. It's a shame this one more than any other seems to have had a much longer shelf life than I would have liked it to have.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 This thread should be called, "Did I ever whore for Jesus..." Jesus Inc. The original Marketing Strategy. It's a shame this one more than any other seems to have had a much longer shelf life than I would have liked it to have.......... That's true - but that's only because Xianity has evolved and changed so often. If it was really as changeless and eternal as it's adherents like to think, it'd be banned in most countries. It has to evolve, and it's human nature to develop our religions as we ourselves develop. There are no exceptions to that rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 I voted that I'm an ex-Xian and while I was Xian I did "lie for the Lawd". I voted that way because I think Xianity, particularly the fundiegelical stripe of it that I was a part of, is a lie in and of itself. So I consider that when I was witnessing, evangelizing, and trying to lead people to the Lard, I was lying, simply because I was part of a greater lie. Even though I didn't know it at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interested Atheist Posted April 15, 2006 Share Posted April 15, 2006 I was reading a thread on Pharyngula - there was a Kent Hovind presentation coming up, and people were suggesting questions to ask him. I think the best question was "If you could win a soul to Christ by lying, would you?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Emerson Posted April 24, 2006 Share Posted April 24, 2006 Took the poll and no I never lied, then again I never did try and convert anyone except for my parents and some internet strangers. Thank goodness that they never listened to me! I'm glad that I didn't try and fuck them up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyb Posted April 24, 2006 Share Posted April 24, 2006 I voted "no" because I didn't know I was lying. More like "desperately trying to maintain and reaffirm a delusion". Sort of a subconscious "If I can convince someone else of this BS then maybe that means it's real". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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