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LostinParis

God cannot be judged by human standards

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1 hour ago, disillusioned said:

 

This is actually a valid argument. There is absolutely no reason that we should expect to be able to understand God, His mind, His will, His plan, or anything else about Him. But it works both ways.  Christianity is specifically a claim to know the will of God. Hence, on this line of reasoning,  there can never be any reason to think that it is correct. So much, then,  for Christianity. 

This is an ideal answer in many ways. Just tell them, by that reasoning, they dont know god any more than you do, so they can stop talking.

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On 9/24/2018 at 7:04 PM, LostinParis said:

“God cannot be judged by human standards.”

 

“Our finite human minds are incapable of understanding the infinite.”

 

These Christian non-answers and loopholes are often thrown at me to shut down my questioning. And it works.

 

How best should I respond?

 

 

On 10/18/2018 at 5:18 PM, disillusioned said:

 

This is actually a valid argument. There is absolutely no reason that we should expect to be able to understand God, His mind, His will, His plan, or anything else about Him. But it works both ways.  Christianity is specifically a claim to know the will of God. Hence, on this line of reasoning,  there can never be any reason to think that it is correct. So much, then,  for Christianity. 

 

I actually say something similar to Disillusioned if I ever have this type of discussion anymore.  I have found the most success when you remain respectful of their beliefs. I will say something like, "Frankly, I can see why you believe the way you do, I see how you got there. I used to believe that too. IF a god exists as you describe, then it makes sense that I should not question it or be able to understand it fully. My problem is that you regard a presumption as TRUTH, when it is simply a presumption. If you do not presume there is a god, it makes sense that I've drawn the logical conclusions I've drawn." Just about every time, they just say "true." Lol

 

It's rare though, because my "Christian Bubble" doesn't chase after me anymore, my parents and I choose not to discuss it literally ever, and when I tell people in my christian circle who don't know....they say "ME TOO!" :)

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My "finite mind" is fully capable of recognizing that any "god" who would call bears out of the woods to shred kids who make fun of a man's hair or who would kill 70,000 innocent people because King David did something which (for some unknown reason) he didn't like, not to mention send people to a place of everlasting fiery torment simply because they don't believe in a "god" who won't show his face, is (if only he existed) evil beyond imagination.

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My response would be similar to WarriorPoet’s response (Sept. 24). If God’s law is written on our hearts (as Christians claim), then we are judging not based on our human standards (whatever that means) but on God’s own standards. Essentially, our standards are God’s standards. Of course they will try to flank you with the “ His ways are higher than our ways” line, but that’s just the scripture’s way of saying God gets a pass at doing bad shit that we would never do. But if God can’t be judged by his own standards, that means he’s above the law, making him an evil dictator that must be dethroned. This is all assuming he exists, of course.

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Christians judge every other god by human standards, so it's a bit hypocritical for them to say that we can't use the same criteria for judging their god.

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On 9/24/2018 at 5:48 PM, TruthSeeker0 said:

... any self-respecting person who reads the OT will conclude that that god is sadistic, cruel, and misogynistic and won't worship them anymore. If they do, they've abandoned any sense of innate morality and gone along with the crowd think and easy answers...

 

Bingo. It takes a mind bending level of moral gymnastics to read the old testament and still believe that god is a loving, kind, benevolent deity. So they have to come up with these horse shit phrases, that really don't say anything at all, to defend their continued support of that god. I've used many variations of this response over the years. Rephrase however you like, or don't.

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On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 11:04 AM, LostinParis said:

“God cannot be judged by human standards.”

 

“Our finite human minds are incapable of understanding the infinite.”

 

These Christian non-answers and loopholes are often thrown at me to shut down my questioning. And it works.

 

How best should I respond?

 

 

"It would help if you could actually demonstrate gods existence for a start".... :D 

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On 9/24/2018 at 4:04 PM, LostinParis said:

“God cannot be judged by human standards.”

 

Imaginary beings dont need to be judged.

 

On 9/24/2018 at 4:04 PM, LostinParis said:

 

“Our finite human minds are incapable of understanding the infinite.”

 

How do we know he is good then?

 

On 9/24/2018 at 4:04 PM, LostinParis said:

 

These Christian non-answers and loopholes are often thrown at me to shut down my questioning. And it works.

 

How best should I respond?

 

 

Dont engage with these people. Logic is not part of their weaponry.

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On 11/20/2018 at 10:55 AM, DeadTOm said:

 

Bingo. It takes a mind bending level of moral gymnastics to read the old testament and still believe that god is a loving, kind, benevolent deity. So they have to come up with these horse shit phrases, that really don't say anything at all, to defend their continued support of that god. I've used many variations of this response over the years. Rephrase however you like, or don't.

Excellent signature images Tom - makes the point perfectly :) 

 

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