Protective Mechanisms of Christianity

[LostinParis]

Some Christian axioms have been appearing in my brain lately, narrated by voices from my childhood. As an ex-christian, I now recognise these phrases as in-built protective mechanisms of Christianity, burrowed deep into my subconscious, designed to drag me back to the fold. Below are a few:

 

We cannot judge God in human terms.

Apostasy is the worst of all sins.

Do not put the Lord your God to the test.

The fool says in his heart, "There is no God".

Trust like a child.

You didn’t pray with a sincere heart.

Doubting Thomas.

The threat of hell (this one should probably be at the top of this list).

 

Recognising these protective mechanisms would have been helpful during my de-conversion process.

 

Do you know of any other platitudes/protective mechanisms of Christianity?

 

I also stumbled across this related video:

 

 

 

 

 

[florduh]

Self serving lies.

[older]

4 hours ago, LostinParis said:

We cannot judge God in human terms

Of course not. The standards for judging humans are far superior.

[♦ Fuego ♦]

(In regards to his great and precious promises failing utterly, and only silence from our "daddy in Heaven", believers fill in the uncomfortable silence with)

"He can say No..."  

"Maybe he wanted another angel at his throne"

"You don't give your kid everything he asks for"

"He's always faithful, all the time. He DID answer, it just looks different than what you expect"

"He's not a cosmic vending machine"

"You're just being contentious"

"You can't trust your mind"

"You can't trust your emotions"

"Just trust the love you've already felt" (!)

"God never answers the question 'Why?'"

"Who are YOU to question GOD?! Remember Job!"

 

Lots of people who would otherwise see through the lies get hooked again through guilt and other emotional manipulation. I remember one guy that was pissed at god, and asked hard questions, but never left the church. The other believers tolerate him and tell him to hush, which he does so that he can stay. He wasted his entire life stuck instead of cutting ties and moving on. He always seemed gay also, but the programming probably would not allow him to simply be himself and find a new circle of friends. 

 

When I was a young believer, I once read an atheist website in the early days of the Internet, and it hit home. But when I talked about how troubled it made me, other believers said that this was proof that it was the devil, since it robbed me of joy. Now I see that it was simply popping the bubble in which I found emotional satisfaction with the first friends I'd ever had (being an incredibly shy introvert at the time). Ignoring those questions cost me another 25 years of life that could have been explored. Then again, at the time, church (not Jesus) taught me the basics of being social, so there was some gain from that. I also learned a lot about how humans manipulate other humans, and use God as a justification. 

 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

Another way of viewing their claims. 

 

The doctrine of original sin is a self fulfilling prophecy.   If you truely believe you are incomplete, and incapable, and need gods help to be saved, then it is so.  You are hooked for life, and dependent on the religious police and saviors for guidance.

[Myrkhoos]

Hmm I know those ideas that come with full force. Most of time however it seems to that they are empty phrases filled with fear, shame, guilt etc . Senseless like some advertising slogans.

 

We cannot judge God in human terms. 

 

What does it mean to judge, anyway? What does God mean what does human mean what human terms mean? For exemple is judging saying attributes, etc words , ideas about God? That is what all the Scripture and theology is about. And it is absurd because because we are humans. In order to understand anything whatsoever about God even divine revelation we do it AS humans. I mean the Bible is written in human language. 

 

Trust like a child 

 

This one is contradicted by the man himself Jesus when he says to be pure as a dove and wise as a snake and the Apostle Paul when he says that cgristians should not be childish, but mature and children only in regards to doing evil.

 

Threat of hell. Yes, like you may know this is one of the biggest for me and for most. First there is a tradition of universalism within the church. Modern proponents are illaria ramelli and david bentley hart, both scholars one in ancient graeco roman history the other in philosophy. And again doest not make any sense whatsoever.  

 

This is something I observe about these thoughts. Extreme power, little to no meaning/ sense. Like some kind of mental bullies.

 

Do not put your lord to the test.

 

A tricky one, but I actually asked this one, I did not get a goid answer, but anyway. The context, with the trials of Jesus in the desert at least, means being wicked with God. Like trying to trick him or just do it for fun . Othrwise the Bible is full of tests the prophets and saints people did with God. I mean case in point Elijah and the fire.

 

I dot know exactly how to deal with them. For me EMDR therapy has been of help though.

 

Reading cult manipulation tehniques, effects of trauma and stuff regardung mental health in general is doing si.e good things.

[Thurisaz]

Not a thing that can be summed up in one catchy sentence but... that concept that whoever leaves the cult "never really was a christian". Nice way to shut down any doubt, providing an easy answer that jibes with the cult's doctrine. As long as you're willing to believe that you're invulnerable to reason doubt. This is 167 % defense / apologetics and -7 % logical.

[Improbability]

As a great theologian from the 23rd century put it, "what does god need with a starship"?

[LostinParis]

On 9/11/2019 at 11:20 PM, Myrkhoos said:

Reading cult manipulation tehniques, effects of trauma and stuff regardung mental health in general is doing si.e good things.

 

@Myrkhoos Great insights, thank-you.

 

Can you recommend any books about cult manipulation techniques?

[Margee]

1 hour ago, LostinParis said:

 

@Myrkhoos Great insights, thank-you.

 

Can you recommend any books about cult manipulation techniques?

I've put this article up off and on for years. There is some fantastic information. It's long but worth the read. (hug) https://www.orange-papers.org/orange-deprogram.html

[Margee]

One of the platitudes we were brainwashed with is that ''Satan comes as an angel to light to deceive the faithful.'' Every now and again ( yes, it still happens to me after all this time) I wonder if I am 'deceived' and yet, as soon as my rational brain kicks in, I ask why god would even allow that to happen to one of his own children!!??  That's like allowing an angry wolf  to attack your own child??? Grrrrrrr

[TruthSeeker0]

On 9/9/2019 at 7:20 PM, LostinParis said:

Some Christian axioms have been appearing in my brain lately, narrated by voices from my childhood. As an ex-christian, I now recognise these phrases as in-built protective mechanisms of Christianity, burrowed deep into my subconscious, designed to drag me back to the fold. Below are a few:

 

We cannot judge God in human terms.

Apostasy is the worst of all sins.

Do not put the Lord your God to the test.

The fool says in his heart, "There is no God".

Trust like a child.

You didn’t pray with a sincere heart.

Doubting Thomas.

The threat of hell (this one should probably be at the top of this list).

 

Recognising these protective mechanisms would have been helpful during my de-conversion process.

 

Do you know of any other platitudes/protective mechanisms of Christianity?

 

I also stumbled across this related video:

 

 

 

 

 

The most effective one in my ex cult was "doubt is a sin". Using your brain and logic was literally a sin. 

Also whoever invented trust like a child clearly has no clue what kids are like in their early years. Have you ever met a four year old that is easily satisfied with answers and cannot tell when the adults are just trying to placate them or make shit up? 

[LostinParis]

On 9/18/2019 at 10:05 AM, Margee said:

I've put this article up off and on for years. There is some fantastic information. It's long but worth the read. (hug) https://www.orange-papers.org/orange-deprogram.html

 

Great information thanks @Margee. Do you consider some versions of Christianity to fit into the “cult” category?

[ConsiderTheSource]

On 9/9/2019 at 4:20 PM, LostinParis said:

You didn’t pray with a sincere heart

Your entire list is sooo relatable to me.  But, this one was the hook that kept me around for soooo long.  Twice I got on my knees,  in tears, "knowing" only sincere specific prayer was answered.  Both times these prayers were "answered" in very direct, and prompt ways, via sources and people far removed from the church.  The unlikelihood of it all dominated my mental operating system for almost 20 years.  It was my personal "proof" of god.  It kept me tethered to the cult in the face of soooo much conflucting data/evidence.

 

On 9/9/2019 at 9:09 PM, Fuego said:

I found emotional satisfaction with the first friends I'd ever had (being an incredibly shy introvert at the time).

 

Such a strong hook too.  Damn hard to move on when one's young adult social set is in place.  I still have a few pieces of my old social set in my life.  But, I was lucky that we got hooked up with a non believing couple in our early 30s over youth baseball.  They were are contrary example to the cult.  They blew us away.  They exhibited all ofvthe "good stuff", without any of the disengenious judgment and manipulation.  Now they, and two other couples with a mutual interest in camping, make up our core relationships.  And, it all is sooooo much better.  Would be perfect if I could delete the religion triggers stuck in my mind. 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

I never really bought into the idea that I "just didn't pray hard enough", or that I "just didn't have enough faith."  jesus said that faith the size of a mustard seed was enough; so I figured that if I had enough faith to pray in the first place, then that was plenty more than a mustard seed.

 

It eventually blew up in my face, though, once I realized that none of my prayers were ever answered.  Because I realized that much quicker that the problem wasn't on my end, not with my prayers or my faith.  The problem was that, apparently,  god always said, "No" irrespective of how much faith I had or how many prayers I prayed.

 

Mustard seed, my ass.

[Myrkhoos]

On 9/24/2019 at 1:25 PM, LostinParis said:

 

Great information thanks @Margee. Do you consider some versions of Christianity to fit into the “cult” category?

Well this is the opinion of the official ICSA organisation. Steve Hassan considers the Moonies and Jehowah Witnesses as cultish plus certain strands of catholic organisations like Opus Dei. You asked about books. I had a lot of use if his book Combatting Cult Mind Control. Not perfect but he outlines a christian cult , the Moonies with specific things like fear of demons and hell. So many similarities. And the thing is although the cult experts rarely tackle main religions a lot of their ideas about cults overlap with mainline christianity. Not all of the time all of the place, but if you are the lucky one in those places...And even if the doctrine is ok, certain priests/ members can interpret it in such a way as to produce a cult like community under the guise of a larger more benign organisation.

 

[Moonobserver]

"We cannot judge God in human terms."

 

Yet that's exactly how Christian apologists judge the gods of other religions.

[Myrkhoos]

My brother came by with his infant daughter of 11 months. Trust like a child? She is very independent and inquiring for her age. Not to mention pretty hard to handle. Christianity does seems to have this idealised view of children many times. Like some kind of cute little blank slates. They are not.  They have their own will/ agendas. But parents are encouraged to be dictators to their children.to break their wills and enforce their own. Basically to use the lowest form of mind control on them.

[Moonobserver]

8 hours ago, Myrkhoos said:

Christianity does seems to have this idealised view of children many times. Like some kind of cute little blank slates. They are not.  They have their own will/ agendas.

Christians often echo the sentiment of Jesus that one has to be like a little child to enter the Kingdom of Heaven, but then they go off on what selfish, rebellious little natural-born sinners children are. If their assessment of little children were correct, that would make the Kingdom of Heaven a nasty place. Is it any wonder if Christian kids are so mixed-up?