PLEASE NEVER LET HIM IN

[◊ Weezer ◊]

4 hours ago, IsaBrisa said:

 

In my experience God exists, and I can't just pretend that he doesn't, it just doesn't work that way

 

 

At one time I also believed.  But did a long study of the history of gods and religions.  When you come to understand how the Christian God was "developed",  or maybe a better word is "evolved",  and how other gods and religions developed, you will see how all are myths created by humans.  It took me decades to come to the conclusion that ALL religions are the largest superstitions ever heaped on mankind.

 

Maybe there is a "creator", or "life source" out there we don't understand yet, but after studying the histories of the ones that have been handed down to us through legends, I am SURE it is non of them.  They are all too inconsistant and narcissistic to be true "life forces".

 

Life is only meaningless if you chose to make it so.  You can make it worthwhile, if you chose to be your own "creator" and make it so.  Find the things and people that help you feel worthwhile.  You have been programmed, or brain washed, to think like you are thinking. In a sense, reprogram yourself.  You will find plenty of help here to do so.  On the forums, and the endless lists of articles, videos and books.  As you go through the process, the anger and despair will dissipate, and a sense of peace will come.  I think that is what disillusioned is saying in the post before this one. HANG IN THERE !

[TruthSeeker0]

5 hours ago, IsaBrisa said:

I don't share your experience.In my experience God exists, and I can't just pretend that he doesn't, it just doesn't work that way.

 

I am trying to find meaning, but the treat of losing everything in the end, because you're not worthy, makes everything meaningless allready.

Yes, you are worthy. That's the first and largest untruth, that does the most harm, that xtianity will brainwash you with - that you were born with original sin and that you're trash. It's not that way at all. You're the product of a spectacular chain of events and you're made of stardust. Forget what some ancient tribal men wanted to tell you you're worth is - they're the ones who wrote the "holy book" that keeps people and women in particular in chains today. 

5 hours ago, IsaBrisa said:

I don't care about afterlife.I wish it didn't exist.I would be very happy if we all just died and stayed dead in body and soul.

 

 

That's what the old testament will tell you. It's the xtians who invented hell with their new testament. 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

2 minutes ago, TruthSeeker0 said:

Yes, you are worthy. That's the first and largest untruth, that does the most harm, that xtianity will brainwash you with - that you were born with original sin and that you're trash. It's not that way at all. You're the product of a spectacular chain of events and you're made of stardust. Forget what some ancient tribal men wanted to tell you you're worth is - they're the ones who wrote the "holy book" that keeps people and women in particular in chains today. 

That's what the old testament will tell you. It's the xtians who invented hell with their new testament. 

 

Excellent advice, and truth!

 

Original sin is a self fulfilling prophecy.  It is so, only if you believe it. 

 

 

[TruthSeeker0]

On 2/26/2020 at 6:23 PM, freedwoman said:

To all those considering letting Jesus Christ into your heart, please never let him in. The moment you do you are his. He marks you as his territory.  Sure he seems sweet, nurturing, strong, and protective. But it's all a lie. After you accept him he becomes abusive, oppressive, and manipulative. You will suffer. You will never be the same. Your life will be no longer yours but his. Him and his Father have you clutched in their death grip. 

 

To every former Christian, please keep up the good fight. Fight against Christianity. Your life is your own. Never look back. 

Agree 100%. Today have been reading a book called Misogyny: the world's oldest prejudice by J Holland, which discusses early xtianity, what it gave women and what it took away from them. How ironic that early xtianity owes a lot to women in it's spread, when it has done so much harm as a whole with the whole "fall of man" and original sin being blamed on women. St Augustus in particular was really disgusting. The more I read the angrier I get. It's so damn obvious when you read the history of the early church and early Catholic Church, what a crock the whole thing was and how politics was entangled in it. 

For the women out there who are still entangled in it: educate yourselves, read, read some more. Open your eyes to the patriarchal system in which you live, which xtianity is necessarily built on, because the Bible is anything but kind to women (yes the new testament is better but are you actually going to ignore the horrific shit in the old one?) 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

Early Christians lifted women up a notch.  But the Catholics pushed them back down.

[TruthSeeker0]

13 minutes ago, Weezer said:

Early Christians lifted women up a notch.  But the Catholics pushed them back down.

I'm finding it utterly hilarious now that I grew up in a Protestant cult which of course denied that it's tradition or beliefs had inherited anything from Catholicism. 

On a graver note, how sad that Protestants and Catholics have basically been at war and killing each other, literally, in more than a few places. So much hate and for such ridiculous reasons. The more I read the more I wonder, why are so many people like sheep? What will it take to wake people up? 

[Guest freedwoman]

15 hours ago, Weezer said:

Early Christians lifted women up a notch.  But the Catholics pushed them back down.

Sorry but I disagree. Wives have to submit to their husbands in EVERYTHING. No exceptions. Including abuse. Wives must be afraid of their husbands. Wives even have to submit to non believing husband's. Wives can't teach men, not even their husbands. They must save him by being his slave instead. Women are inferior to men. We are made only to serve men. We can't talk in church. I wrote two threads exactly about this if you want Bible verses to back it up.

[Guest freedwoman]

15 hours ago, TruthSeeker0 said:

Agree 100%. Today have been reading a book called Misogyny: the world's oldest prejudice by J Holland, which discusses early xtianity, what it gave women and what it took away from them. How ironic that early xtianity owes a lot to women in it's spread, when it has done so much harm as a whole with the whole "fall of man" and original sin being blamed on women. St Augustus in particular was really disgusting. The more I read the angrier I get. It's so damn obvious when you read the history of the early church and early Catholic Church, what a crock the whole thing was and how politics was entangled in it. 

For the women out there who are still entangled in it: educate yourselves, read, read some more. Open your eyes to the patriarchal system in which you live, which xtianity is necessarily built on, because the Bible is anything but kind to women (yes the new testament is better but are you actually going to ignore the horrific shit in the old one?) 

Yes. Right on 100%.

[Guest freedwoman]

They are called..."Biblically Battered Brides &Violence Against Women," and "Women Are Inferior To Men?" 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

On 2/29/2020 at 10:15 PM, TruthSeeker0 said:

 

I'm finding it utterly hilarious now that I grew up in a Protestant cult which of course denied that it's tradition or beliefs had inherited anything from Catholicism. 

 

 

That was also said by the Church of Christ I grew up in, but everything about the Christianity most of us know came from the catholics.  They decided what writings went into the New Testament, and very likely altered or even fabricated much of what they included.   Therefore if the bible is all that has been read, then what you know was influenced by them.  It is not the inerrant word of God.  It was concocted by men. 

 

I am not a christian, but believe in giving credit where credit Is due.  My guess is that you and freedwoman have not done a thorough study of the very early followers of Jesus, including all of the New Testament gospels, and the Gnostic Gospels which were left out of the bible. The immediate followers of Jesus had some women deacons and other female leaders.  And Jesus treated women with respect.  Have you read the gospel of Mary?   And other Gnostic Gospels?  You might find it interesting.  It was  the Catholic church that threw women under the bus, and some have tried to keep it that way. 

 

I was fortunate to grow up in a church that thought we were no longer under the old testament.  But not all see it that way, and men wanting to control women pick out scripture that backs their point of view.  Especially if you believe the old testament still controls us, you can find a scripture to justify about anything.  

 

I understand your anger about how women have been treated, but just wanted to point out that there was a time in the very early Jesus movement, at least in a tiny part of the world, that that was not the case.

[TruthSeeker0]

9 hours ago, Weezer said:

 

That was also said by the Church of Christ I grew up in, but everything about the Christianity most of us know came from the catholics.  They decided what writings went into the New Testament, and very likely altered or even fabricated much of what they included.   Therefore if the bible is all that has been read, then what you know was influenced by them.  It is not the inerrant word of God.  It was concocted by men. 

 

I am not a christian, but believe in giving credit where credit Is due.  My guess is that you and freedwoman have not done a thorough study of the very early followers of Jesus, including all of the New Testament gospels, and the Gnostic Gospels which were left out of the bible. The immediate followers of Jesus had some women deacons and other female leaders.  And Jesus treated women with respect.  Have you read the gospel of Mary?   And other Gnostic Gospels?  You might find it interesting.  It was  the Catholic church that threw women under the bus, and some have tried to keep it that way. 

 

I was fortunate to grow up in a church that thought we were no longer under the old testament.  But not all see it that way, and men wanting to control women pick out scripture that backs their point of view.  Especially if you believe the old testament still controls us, you can find a scripture to justify about anything.  

 

I understand your anger about how women have been treated, but just wanted to point out that there was a time in the very early Jesus movement, at least in a tiny part of the world, that that was not the case.

No I have not done a thorough study - I have started reading Elaine Pagels on the gnostics, but it's gotten left on the back burner as I reached a certain point where I realized I had wasted enough time with xtianity, and now I'm not particularly interested in spending time reading about how it came about - I know the gist, am not susceptible to the arguments made by xtians, so I want to spend my time on other things. I wanted a more over arching perspective on misogyny that didn't only involve xtianity, hence this book. 

Holland discusses the involvement of women in early xtianity as deaconesses etc. However I agree with him that it's very ironic that women, who helped spread the new religion, would become so stiffled and controlled within it. Yes you are likely correct that that had a lot to do with Catholicism and the men deciding how things would be. However, the point still stands the thousands of years later, here we are with a system that in the fundamentalist cases, controls women's bodies, their reproductive rights, and puts large amounts of pressure on them in regards to those things they do have some control over, such as marrying or remaining single. The body shunning and shaming that xtianity practices is disgusting. Natural things such as menses are made out to be disgusting and degrading. Regardless of what happened in early xtianity, the women right here in these forums haves personal experience with the very negative consequences of the belief system. 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

5 hours ago, TruthSeeker0 said:

 

Regardless of what happened in early xtianity, the women right here in these forums haves personal experience with the very negative consequences of the belief system. 

 

 

It is sad that certain segments of the many different segments of the system focused on that.  I also decided that in spite of the good done by Christians through the years, there has probably been more bad, than good.  Power hungry people have evidently always been with us.

[Guest freedwoman]

On 2/26/2020 at 3:23 PM, freedwoman said:

To all those considering letting Jesus Christ into your heart, please never let him in. The moment you do you are his. He marks you as his territory.

 

Your life will be no longer yours but his. Him and his Father have you clutched in their death grip. 

 

To every former Christian, please keep up the good fight. Fight against Christianity. Your life is your own. Never look back. 

Oops I contradicted myself here. 

 

What I should have said is that your spirit may be his but you need to rebel. Live your life your way not his way. Don't reconvert to Christianity. 

 

I swear I confuse myself sometimes??? 

[Guest freedwoman]

On 3/1/2020 at 8:24 PM, Weezer said:

 

That was also said by the Church of Christ I grew up in, but everything about the Christianity most of us know came from the catholics.  They decided what writings went into the New Testament, and very likely altered or even fabricated much of what they included.   Therefore if the bible is all that has been read, then what you know was influenced by them.  It is not the inerrant word of God.  It was concocted by men. 

 

I am not a christian, but believe in giving credit where credit Is due.  My guess is that you and freedwoman have not done a thorough study of the very early followers of Jesus, including all of the New Testament gospels, and the Gnostic Gospels which were left out of the bible. The immediate followers of Jesus had some women deacons and other female leaders.  And Jesus treated women with respect.  Have you read the gospel of Mary?   And other Gnostic Gospels?  You might find it interesting.  It was  the Catholic church that threw women under the bus, and some have tried to keep it that way. 

 

I was fortunate to grow up in a church that thought we were no longer under the old testament.  But not all see it that way, and men wanting to control women pick out scripture that backs their point of view.  Especially if you believe the old testament still controls us, you can find a scripture to justify about anything.  

 

I understand your anger about how women have been treated, but just wanted to point out that there was a time in the very early Jesus movement, at least in a tiny part of the world, that that was not the case.

The gnostic gospels contradict the Bible.

 

Plus in the gnostic gospels women weren't even allowed in Heaven. Thomas 114.

 

Jesus didn't respect women that much. He called a woman a dog before.  Plus he didn't even respect his own mother. He never once called her mother.  He only called her woman.

 

 

[TEG]

The gnostic gospels (and acts, and apocalypses etc.) are a mishmash of writings by all kinds of people; they do not present a unified message.  In the gospel of Mary, she was loved more than the other disciples and knew things they did not, and they had to acknowledge it.  Just fwiw . . . .

[◊ Weezer ◊]

3 hours ago, TEG said:

The gnostic gospels (and acts, and apocalypses etc.) are a mishmash of writings by all kinds of people; they do not present a unified message.  In the gospel of Mary, she was loved more than the other disciples and knew things they did not, and they had to acknowledge it.  Just fwiw . . . .

 

Thanks TEG for an excelent reply.  It seems if we look long enough in Christian writings, we can find something that fits about anything we want to say.  It is definitely not the inerrant word of God!!  But I still say that if you look at the big picture, overall, at least for a while, women were treated with a little more respect.  Jesus reportedly stopped a woman from being stoned, he loved Mary more than the others, they had women deacons, etc.