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Goodbye Jesus

Need Some Help Debunking This


Vigile

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I know, I was saying IF it was true... they'd still be things that exist

 

Sorry, I should have been more clear that I was agreeing with you.

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Exactly. What is cold? To me 48 degrees Fahrenheit is friggin cold. To a polar bear it summer. Cold is just a relative term to what I feel is cold. It I put my hand in hot water for a few mintues, and then put my hand in lukewarm water, then the lukewarm water feels like ice. So is lukewarm water absence of heat too? The sun is millions degrees, that means my little fire in the fireplace is extremely cold. My question to the studen would be "when is cold cold and warm warm?"

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You just have to admit that Christians have great rhetoric and paradigms to work off of. This is why this little allegory works so wonderful for them, and effectively so, wthout critically looking at what exactly is being said.

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Come just to think of this (not sure if someone said it already), but nothing can be considered hot unless you have cold, and nothing can be considered light unless you have dark, so in essence good can not exist without evil. So if God destroys evil in the end times, then good also goes bye-bye. How would the Christians solve that dilemma?

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They make up another ridiculous allegory.

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Maybe that's why God needs all the saints and Christians in heaven? His plan is to have the saints rebel and become the devils and demons for the next world he's going to make. A never ending circle of demons created from the previous world's saints. Just look at Lucifer, he was perfect wasn't he? He had everything and everything was good, and he rebelled. And if free will still exists in Heaven, the chance some Christians will go for it is infinitely large, since they're going to stay there for eternity. I wonder what kind of funny Adam and Eve story God will make up for that world?

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Exactly. What is cold? To me 48 degrees Fahrenheit is friggin cold. To a polar bear it summer. Cold is just a relative term to what I feel is cold. It I put my hand in hot water for a few mintues, and then put my hand in lukewarm water, then the lukewarm water feels like ice. So is lukewarm water absence of heat too? The sun is millions degrees, that means my little fire in the fireplace is extremely cold. My question to the studen would be "when is cold cold and warm warm?"

 

 

That is perception of temperature according to sensory input and can't see how that is relevant to the physics of space.

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That is perception of temperature according to sensory input and can't see how that is relevant to the physics of space.

That's what I was trying to say.

 

"Hot" and "Cold" is subjective, and doesn't have a scientific definition. That's the question that should have gone back to the student. Not just agreing on that hot and cold exists. The student should have been forced to give a definition of what hot is first, before they started to argue if cold exists. He would eventually understand it's relative. And if hot and cold is subjective, then (according to the Christian's comparative illustration) good and evil is subjective too. And the trap is closed.

 

 

 

(fixed spelling. hold and cot is not the same as hot and cold. :) )

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That is perception of temperature according to sensory input and can't see how that is relevant to the physics of space.

That's what I was trying to say.

 

"Hot" and "Cold" is subjective, and doesn't have a scientific definition. That's the question that should have gone back to the student. Not just agreing on that hot and cold exists. The student should have been forced to give a definition of what hot is first, before they started to argue if cold exists. He would eventually understand it's relative. And if hot and cold is subjective, then (according to the Christian's comparative illustration) good and evil is subjective too. And the trap is closed.

 

 

Well then lets see if he gnaws off his foot to escape.

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Just throwing this in for good measure. Taken from Athiest Empire (Link)

 

Albert Einstein [1879-1955] German born American threoretical physicist

 

From a correspondence between Ensign Guy H. Raner and Albert Einstein in 1945 and 1949. Einstein responds to the accusation that he was converted by a Jesuit priest: "I have never talked to a Jesuit prest in my life. I am astonished by the audacity to tell such lies about me. From the viewpoint of a Jesuit priest I am, of course, and have always been an atheist." "I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is a childlike one.You may call me an agnostic, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from religious indoctrination received in youth." Freethought Today, November 2004

 

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it." From a letter Einstein wrote in English, dated 24 March 1954. It is included in Albert Einstein: The Human Side, edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman, published by Princeton University Press. Albert Einstein, Out of My Later Years (New York: Philosophical Library, 1950), p. 27.

 

"During the youthful period of mankind's spiritual evolution, human fantasy created gods in man's own image who, by the operations of their will were supposed to determine, or at any rate influence, the phenomenal world... The idea of God in the religions taught at present is a sublimation of that old conception of the gods. Its anthropomorphic character is shown, for instance, by the fact that men appeal to the Divine Being in prayers and plead for the fulfillment of their wishes... In their struggle for the ethical good, teachers of religion must have the stature to give up the doctrine of a personal God, that is, give up that source of fear and hope which in the past placed such vase power in the hands of priests." Albert Einstein, reported in Science, Philosophy and Religion: A Symposium, edited by L. Bryson

 

"Thus I came...to a deep religiosity, which, however, reached an abrupt end at the age of 12. Through the reading of popular scientific books I soon reached a conviction that much in the stories of the Bible could not be true....Suspicion against every kind of authority grew out of this experience...an attitude which has never left me." The Quotable Einstein

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Guest Sas

I new to this site. The only way to shut the guy up is to say,

 

Evil is the absence of Good. God is not part of the Equation.

:Doh:

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